Two down. Untold thousand to go.
Iraq and ISIS Discussion
- Thread starter Kraut783
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It's pretty fucking sad it takes something insanely vivid like this (or, say, the destruction of the World Trade Center) for liberals to finally comprehend reality. It takes Jack Black kicking their dog off the bridge.
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Could anyone blame Jordan if it rolled an armored Corps into Iraq or Syria?
Then there's this and I hope it is true:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...dullah-quotes-clint-eastwood-to-us-lawmakers/
Then there's this and I hope it is true:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...dullah-quotes-clint-eastwood-to-us-lawmakers/
pardus
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I would be happy as fuck if Jordan rolled in and kicked some ass.
Like Oprah at a buffet.
"You get a bullet and you get a bullet and you get a bullet.....everybody gets a bullet!"
I just can't imagine defeating a well-organized, well-financed enemy now at an estimated 30-50,000, without a robust coordinated land campaign.
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I would have to disagree. As Pardus mentioned, Japan changed after WWII. They were doing similar back then to what ISIS is doing now.
Look what it took and they still won't acknowledge many of the atrocities. We'd have to rain utter destruction on a majority of the Muslim community, all 1.6 billion, to have the same effect. "Make Iraq look like an appetizer" type of destruction.
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I hate this story because the Columbus Dispatch is all but calling these disillusioned terrorists, heroes for trying to flee. Fuck them -
LINK
TUNIS, Tunisia — In Tunis, Ghaith stands furtively on a street corner, his face masked by a hoodie, his tense eyes scanning the crowd for any hint of Islamic State militants.
He chain-smokes as he describes the indiscriminate killing, the abuse of female recruits, the discomfort of a life where meals were little more than bread and cheese or oil. He recounts the knife held to his throat by fellow fighters who demanded he recite a particular Quranic verse on Islamic warfare to prove himself.
“It was totally different from what they said jihad would be like,” said Ghaith, who asked to be identified by only his first name for fear of being killed.
Ghaith eventually surrendered to Syrian soldiers.
LINK
TUNIS, Tunisia — In Tunis, Ghaith stands furtively on a street corner, his face masked by a hoodie, his tense eyes scanning the crowd for any hint of Islamic State militants.
He chain-smokes as he describes the indiscriminate killing, the abuse of female recruits, the discomfort of a life where meals were little more than bread and cheese or oil. He recounts the knife held to his throat by fellow fighters who demanded he recite a particular Quranic verse on Islamic warfare to prove himself.
“It was totally different from what they said jihad would be like,” said Ghaith, who asked to be identified by only his first name for fear of being killed.
Ghaith eventually surrendered to Syrian soldiers.
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Agreed.
I was focusing on the "once a savage, always a savage" comment. The Japanese were considered savages back then with some of the things they had done. They are not the same now as back then.
Monkey savages that deserve nothing more than to be treated like the virus scourge upon humanity that they are.
In principle I do not agree with Jordan's reaction, as executing prisoners- even condemned ones- in response to an enemy is not the civilized response.
We are all a half step away from becoming what we hate; it's easy to feel like we're on the verge of being sucked into what they are.
In principle I do not agree with Jordan's reaction, as executing prisoners- even condemned ones- in response to an enemy is not the civilized response.
We are all a half step away from becoming what we hate; it's easy to feel like we're on the verge of being sucked into what they are.
I totally agree, but the level of destruction required is "unacceptable" in today's world, hence why I think they won't change. For a people to change you have to bring them to their knees, one heartbeat away from a flatline, and this "civilized" world in which we live believes that level of violence isn't necessary; history tells us otherwise.
There are huge problems with knowing where friendly forces are at any given point in time (all those factions you mentioned). There is also more than just CAS going on, and the whole thing is much more complex than a JTAC co-located with friendlies on the ground calling in a strike OEF style. It's telling that they aren't conducting large conventional movements with tanks and APCs out in the open anymore; and while probably half of Kobani is seriously fucked up, bombing plus the Kurds held Daesh off.
All that said, I think your larger point is correct; re-taking land is going to need something different than what we're doing now. Given the Sunni/Shia problems of dis-trust I'm not sure how much real cooperation we'll ever get among the various players.
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It's not really comparable. Japan was pounded into submission and that was in a different era. They then had the opportunity to rebuild and adapt to more 'Western' values. Plus they didn't have Islamic fanaticism to keep up any kind of resistance. Savages never change by themselves. You beat the savage out of savages. But since Westerners have become a bunch of coddled pussies, we don't have the stomach to give out beatings anymore.
Which brings me to one of my favorite quotes:
"He must walk warily and fearlessly, and while he should never brawl if he can avoid it, he must be ready to hit hard if the need arises. Let him remember...that the unforgivable crime is soft hitting. Do not hit at all if it can be avoided, but never hit softly."
Brill
SOF Support
They could carpet bomb Ar Raqqah, where there aren't any friendlies.
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Something has been bugging me for a while and I've not asked because I've been trying to figure out a way to pose this without asking anyone to violate OPSEC in answering it, but I don't know how. So here's my question, answer if you "can":
if it has been a US pilot who had gone down, would we have been in a position to save him before he fell into enemy hands? Carrying it one step forward, could we have gotten to the Jordan pilot if given the order? And if so, why wouldn't we have been given that order?
if it has been a US pilot who had gone down, would we have been in a position to save him before he fell into enemy hands? Carrying it one step forward, could we have gotten to the Jordan pilot if given the order? And if so, why wouldn't we have been given that order?
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Thanks for the clarification. I took your original post as a generalization.
Just watched Rep Gabbard talk about some of the issues, looked her up: Army Guard officer, Democratic Rep from Hawaii, and has this to say about the larger effort: It's about radical Islamic ideology.
Thought you guys might enjoy, a young congressman who doesn't seem to be afraid to tell it like she see's it.
Thought you guys might enjoy, a young congressman who doesn't seem to be afraid to tell it like she see's it.
I'll answer this as best I can. A cornerstone nee the foundation of success is timely and accurate information. It sounds easy but getting it is often difficult. The world is a big place and as our enemies have proven before, you can hide from the eye in the sky, be it drone or other aircraft. In order to save the guy, we would need to know where he actually is.
Example: Someone can tell you I'm at my house. The information is 5-6 hours old by the time you hear it, it gets analyzed, disseminated, etc. By the time you get approval, authority, move on to get me at my house, I might be five states away in any direction, possibly even out of the country, and that's if I'm in a car. The only way you can get updates on where I went is through talking with my neighbors...and therein lies the rub.
Radical islam maybe but then there is this: http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slat...ge_says_captors_did_not_discuss_religion.html
If there goal is political primacy (which I assess it is given they want a State of their own to govern, albeit religiously), then this should make it easier for the gloves to come off and an actual, bonafide, declaration of war to occur. An actual congressional, legal declaration would solve a lot of problems.
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