# Ranger Transfer Question



## TheSiatonist (Oct 20, 2009)

Howdy.

A guy posted this and I wanted to help out so I'm posting it here. He is a serving member and is from the other site.



> needing advice from Rangers on this forum:
> 
> I've wrote in the past about my intent for joining a Ranger battalion as an 11b (if the possibility still exists for me) after returning from a deployment.
> 
> ...



If anyone thinks this is a mistake for any reason, please do remove the thread.

Thanks.


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## Tyrant (Oct 20, 2009)

What other site?


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## TheSiatonist (Oct 20, 2009)

Tyrant said:


> What other site?



Ooops. I meant "other forum". MPNet.


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## Ranger_Smoothie (Oct 20, 2009)

Well if he is truthful about who he is and what he has done, I would say training for the Q course. He is way past his prime time entry into Rgr Bn. The only way I would say go that route is after he comes back from Ranger School. With his language skills and a degree behind him, SF really is a better option for him.:2c:


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## Ranger_Smoothie (Oct 20, 2009)

But either way, he needs Airborne School behind him.


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## Tyrant (Oct 20, 2009)

He needs to decide what he wants. Both doors are open to him. He can go the Ranger route, his rank nor his age are disqualifiers, or he can go to SFAS and see from there.
The biggest obstacle is himself. Once he gets over that then he should be good to go. No one can say that he would make a better Ranger or a better Team guy in SF based on whatever qualities he has. Time for him to decide.


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## dknob (Oct 20, 2009)

Masters? Military experience? Fluency in Urdu?

Tell him to apply to the Agency


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## crapgame (Oct 20, 2009)

I second dknob.  Especially if he's being honest about his KSAs -- especially because of the Urdu.

I understand the "hard" languages are in high demand.  He'd have to be confident he could test high; probably at least a solid 3, if not a 4, if he says he's "fluent".  

I only wonder where he'd be more in demand -- DI or DO.
Then again, he's gonna have to figure out what he wants to be when he grows up.


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## JJ sloan (Oct 21, 2009)

dknob said:


> Masters? Military experience? Fluency in Urdu?
> 
> Tell him to apply to the Agency


 Dude... lets not set him up for failure.  The clown show will be around for him in the future, after he gets experience in the military, among those who will use his skills properly.



crapgame said:


> I second dknob.  Especially if he's being honest about his KSAs -- especially because of the Urdu.
> 
> I understand the "hard" languages are in high demand.  He'd have to be confident he could test high; probably at least a solid 3, if not a 4, if he says he's "fluent".
> 
> ...



A 4? Hush!  Don't speak if you know nothing.

Sand Man,
I would suggest to your buddy that he go active either way.  My loyalties lie with both regiments.  I started as a Ranger and am now in SF.  I would not change a thing.  I learned about tactics and team dynamics as a Ranger which served me well later in my career as an SF guy.
Either way, he should get some active time.
I love me some Rangers.  They are consumate professionals who master the basics of soldiering and press the fight like no one else.
His language skills will come to fruition as an SF guy but are not paramount at this point.  One has to have experience before those skills are really worth anything to SOF.  Although, he will get paid no matter which unit he chooses.
I always suggest to young guys that they start at Ranger Regiment just because of the strong base they will receive.  Then, if they choose to, they can move on to other units and occupational specialties.  Guys seem to rush into positions that they are not ready for, a team guy needs that base of experience before he can operate as an ODA member (much less the working for the Clown Institution of America).
:2c:


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## digrar (Oct 21, 2009)

I've pointed the bloke in question this way, hoping he will show up. He's been a good kid over at MPnet.


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## Ranger_Smoothie (Oct 21, 2009)

Yes I agree with you JJ, but look this guy would have a BIG BULLSEYE on his chest if he went to Bn now(without a tab), if he is slotted for Hooah School, go there first. At least he would learn a great deal there. They would not give him a team in Regiment without one (tab).

We don't want to set him up for failure. But if he is thinking this way (SF and Ranger) he needs to go active. Regiment makes great operators to move on the better places like SF and other fences, he needs to know that, but it comes at a price with his rank, everyone will zero in on him. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but he will be SEEN.

Big Green, much less SF could use his skills now, but he is looking at a lot of time getting there no matter which route he travels with training.

JJ, you and Tyrant know it better than anyone. Regiment has made you a better operator, soldier and person for that matter. And you would not take that back for anything. But Regiment is a young mans world.... I have seen it work before, but it was few and far between.:2c:


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## ///M3 (Oct 22, 2009)

To all - 

Just wanted folks to know that I'm the guy that's in need of the advice and suggestions and I wanted to thank you guys for your responses.  I appreciate Sand Man posting my question.  

I have spoken with some of my friends as well about this and so far I've been told either hell yes go to a battalion or hell no go SF if you can instead.  I'm still juggling between the two.

To be clear, I am only recently weighing my options because I just received my US citizenship in Bagram, Afghanistan while I was deployed.  I was born in Pakistan and grew up in the states but 9/11 screwed my family pretty good: two FBI interviews and screenings and 3 years later we were finally able to get permanent residency in 2004 after applying in 1999.  I enlisted later that year, and then deployed in 08-09 where I finally was given full citizenship.  Thus, I wasn't able to enlist until i was 20 and then went guard instead of active duty because i wanted to finish college.  So it's only now that I can really decide which way I want to go.

one quick comment:  by no means do I wish to sound and talk as if this is a simple "option A vs. option B" conversation.  I just want to explore my options.  again, thanks for all the advice and thoughts.


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## dknob (Oct 22, 2009)

Oh man, getting your security clearance could be a problem.


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## ///M3 (Oct 22, 2009)

^^it shouldn't really.  I've spent 22 out of my 25 years living in the US.  plus overseas i was granted an interim security clearance.


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## Tyrant (Oct 22, 2009)

///M3 said:


> ^^it shouldn't really.  I've spent 22 out of my 25 years living in the US.  plus overseas i was granted an interim security clearance.



Back to the original topic. What do YOU want to do, and why?


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## ///M3 (Oct 22, 2009)

Tyrant said:


> Back to the original topic. What do YOU want to do, and why?



If I could sum it in one line I would say that I desire to work with the local nationals of a given nation and use them in direct action missions.

ok, so working with local nationals would probably suggest that I should try for SF; but recognizing that some would argue that their primary role is to work in the unconventional side of things as opposed to simply resorting to direct action, a Ranger bat looks more appealing.

currently I'm definitely leaning towards SF and have been in contact with a SF guard unit near where I live and am preparing for their tryouts to get on a training team and then move on to assessment and selection.

my only concern is whether or not I'm missing out on anything without trying to go to a Ranger bat first?


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## Tyrant (Oct 22, 2009)

///M3 said:


> If I could sum it in one line I would say that I desire to work with the local nationals of a given nation and use them in direct action missions.
> 
> ok, so working with local nationals would probably suggest that I should try for SF; but recognizing that some would argue that their primary role is to work in the unconventional side of things as opposed to simply resorting to direct action, a Ranger bat looks more appealing.
> 
> ...


Well of course you're going to miss out on some things by not going to a Ranger Battalion. It sounds like to me that you're already moving towards the SF route. Good luck.


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## ///M3 (Oct 22, 2009)

Tyrant said:


> Well of course you're going to miss out on some things by not going to a Ranger Battalion. It sounds like to me that you're already moving towards the SF route. Good luck.



true, and thanks.


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## JJ sloan (Oct 22, 2009)

Don't overthink it.  Just follow your gut.  Whatever you decide, good luck to you.


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## Ranger_Smoothie (Oct 23, 2009)

I hope we did help you and not blind YOUR judgement. Good luck what ever you do.:)


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## feildman (Oct 23, 2009)

///M3 I would say the same as the "follow your gut" comment. I will say that you need to get to Ranger School. We will take you as an E-5 WITH a tab, alot easier than without.


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## ///M3 (Oct 24, 2009)

^^awesome, and thanks for the advice (of course that goes to everyone).  I guess it'll come down to a couple of things, but I've also entertained the idea of just switching over and dropping to E-4 so that I could work as a member of a team before being put in charge of one.  I can imagine how some soldiers of mine would feel about me being their team leader since I wasn't able to "grow up" as a Ranger.

Not that I don't have absolute confidence that I could execute my job, but it'd be nice to have some time as a member of a team and I know that I still have a lot to learn.


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## 275ANGER! (Oct 24, 2009)

I would do the tabless E-4, sharing the hardships will gain you acceptance.  You will also be able to sit back and see how things are ran instead of jumping in there and getting a fire hose shoved down your throat, "learning curve".  I have seen more import E-5s get the boot than any other.  Usually if you don't have a SL with patience you will be fighting an uphill battle. Don't discredit salty PVTs, they have much too teach. Approach with an open mindset, listen and learn.

Good luck!



Now back to my beer pong tourney and hotties...
College is GREAT!!!


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## 275ANGER! (Oct 25, 2009)

275ANGER! said:


> I would do the tabless E-4, sharing the hardships will gain you acceptance.  You will also be able to sit back and see how things are ran instead of jumping in there and getting a fire hose shoved down your throat, "learning curve".  I have seen more import E-5s get the boot than any other.  Usually if you don't have a SL with patience you will be fighting an uphill battle. Don't discredit salty PVTs, they have much too teach. Approach with an open mindset, listen and learn.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> ...



I do not recall posting this, it was one hell of a night. Anyways, I agree with my inebriated post.  Good luck with whatever path you choose.


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## dknob (Oct 25, 2009)

///M3 said:


> Not that I don't have absolute confidence that I could execute my job, but it'd be nice to have some time as a member of a team and I know that I still have a lot to learn.




You have the absolute confidence that you could fully perform your job as a team leader in a special operations unit upon immediate assignment??


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## ///M3 (Oct 26, 2009)

dknob said:


> You have the absolute confidence that you could fully perform your job as a team leader in a special operations unit upon immediate assignment??



I'm fully confident with the skills that I have so far learned.  In your context no, of course not, which is why i'd rather go as a tabless E-4 if i go the Ranger bat route.


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## Ranger Psych (Oct 26, 2009)

Just realize, and admit to yourself that regardless of where you were, Regiment is a whole different animal. Just do as your immediate leader does and you'll be fine.


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## RSD-75 (Oct 31, 2009)

275ANGER! said:


> I would do the tabless E-4, sharing the hardships will gain you acceptance.  You will also be able to sit back and see how things are ran instead of jumping in there and getting a fire hose shoved down your throat, "learning curve".  I have seen more import E-5s get the boot than any other.  Usually if you don't have a SL with patience you will be fighting an uphill battle. Don't discredit salty PVTs, they have much too teach. Approach with an open mindset, listen and learn.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> ...



275ANGER nailed it - When I left Regiment for the other side of the fence I was disgusted to find that most of the Regular Army NCO's that I encountered couldn't carry a Ranger PFC's jock.  Needless to say, they didn't like me very much.....especially after I told my worthless SSG squad leader that I would follow a Ranger private to the gates of hell before I'd follow him to the chow hall.

Anyway, the moral of the story of the story is that you're going to have to work twice as hard to earn the respect that goes along with your rank in BN.  And when Ranger Psych says it's a whole different animal, he means you might as well be on another frickin planet.


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## ///M3 (Nov 2, 2009)

RSD-75 said:


> 275ANGER nailed it - When I left Regiment for the other side of the fence I was disgusted to find that most of the Regular Army NCO's that I encountered couldn't carry a Ranger PFC's jock.  Needless to say, they didn't like me very much.....*especially after I told my worthless SSG squad leader that I would follow a Ranger private to the gates of hell before I'd follow him to the chow hall.*
> 
> Anyway, the moral of the story of the story is that you're going to have to work twice as hard to earn the respect that goes along with your rank in BN.  And when Ranger Psych says it's a whole different animal, he means you might as well be on another frickin planet.



hahahaha

I got until I graduate in December to make a decision, until then I'll keep stabbing away at what exactly I want.


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## car (Nov 2, 2009)

Let me throw you a complete curveball.....are you dead set on being a "hard guy?"

Granted there may be some clearance/access probs, but have you considered being an interrogator or CI/HUMINT? Then getting assigned in SF or other SOF units?

Maybe not so "sexy," but muy importante nonetheless - and Interrogators 'n' CI/HUMINTers with your skills are in great demand.

Just wanted to put that in your head...

Whatever you choose, as long as you think it all the way through, will be the right decision.

Good luck.


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## RetPara (Nov 2, 2009)

Car hit a valid point.  With the advent of the Ranger Support Bn...  there is another route.  With your education and experience; Humint would be an option for you.  

What follows is a very blunt (?) observation.  IF you were to show up at a Ranger Bn as a 11 series Sgt with\without a tab....  You become a target.  The Specialist Mafia is a mainstay of the Regiment, has been and always will be.  At the small unit level the Regiment CAN afford to be very damn pickey about who they let in the door.  After you get in the door you are constantly and continually judged.  Coming to the Regiment as junior NCO you DO NOT have the skills that a Bn raised Ranger Sergeant does.  However; you will be expected to be at the same level on day 1.  

If you are set on the Ranger's, coming in through the MI pipeline to the Regiment, with or without a tab is a better way to ensure that your skills, abilities, and education put to a premium use.  You will be able to have a greater impact on the mission than a combat arms NCO of the same level can.  

This also plays with going the SF route.  But unlike the Rangers, SF don't eat their young....  very often.  You would be at the age\rank target that SF was originally designed to recruit from.  That is a major difference.  

Go into this with your eyes wide open....  While this all falls with in the Army....  you are looking at two EXTREMELY different subcultures.  The unspoken mores and customs are lightyears apart.  They are two VERY different lifestyles.


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## dknob (Nov 2, 2009)

What everybody is trying to say is that Rangers eat babies.


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## RAGE275 (Nov 4, 2009)

Agreed.


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## ///M3 (Nov 7, 2009)

update:

I got tryouts for 20th SF soon this next month.  If I make the cut they'll put me on the training team and then I'll go to selection when they think I'm ready.

also, with my current unit I got slotted in for airborne school in January, and then pre-Ranger course (for Guard soldiers) in February...it's a two week course, if i make the cut they send me directly to Ranger School.   :cool:


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## ///M3 (Nov 8, 2009)

^^the slots were actually confirmed today and I got counseled for them so it's a done deal is what I'm getting at (since I already mentioned the above info in the very first post through Sand Man).


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## Ravage (Nov 8, 2009)

Good luck :)


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## dknob (Nov 8, 2009)

College, SF, then College, then back to SF, finalize on college, now you sign up for SF..

Obviously we aren't helping you enough lol.


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## ///M3 (Nov 27, 2009)

I'm off to tryouts for a NG SF unit in a week, if selected I get on a training team before being sent to selection.  Thanks again everyone for all the advice and help, i'll keep you folks updated.


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## Polar Bear (Nov 27, 2009)

Have you thought about joining the Air Force and becoming an engine mechanic


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