# 158 Gr .38 Sp. +P SWCHP Buffalo Bore Ammo



## dusty (Mar 7, 2009)

I just ordered a box for my little Smitty 442 pocket carry snubby.
Anybody shot any? (Or am I the only cat who owns a .38)


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## arizonaguide (Mar 7, 2009)

I've got one like this, and I really like it.





Fits my little monkey hand like a glove!

I've been hearing good things about those 158 Buffalo Bore's.
I've got the little Speer 135gr +PJHP's in mine for now.
Finally found a small OWB Serpa retention holster I like.
Still working on picking out a IWB for very concealed carry.


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## HOLLiS (Mar 7, 2009)

For the reloaders in the group.   We use to load 148 gr hollow base WC inverted and hot. (+P) for our boot guns.  A alternative.  Also Speer Gold dot is a good round.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 7, 2009)

HOLLiS said:


> For the reloaders in the group.   We use to load 148 gr hollow base WC inverted and hot. (+P) for our boot guns.  A alternative.  Also Speer Gold dot is a good round.



Yup, that's what I've got is the Speer Gold dot "short barrels", as I understand they are designed to expand correctly at the lower volocities of the short j-frame barrels.


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## dusty (Mar 8, 2009)

This stuff I bought supposedly expands at about 800 fps.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 8, 2009)

dusty said:


> This stuff I bought supposedly expands at about 800 fps.


That sounds about right. From what I understand that's about what we get out of that shorter barrel, even if a higher number is printed on the ammo. Only real way to tell is chrono it, I guess. Check out this Speer Gold Dot "short barrel" though, I'm reading good things...although that Buffalo Bore is getting _good reports_ also! I think you're good with it.
:)


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## dusty (Mar 8, 2009)

arizonaguide said:


> That sounds about right. From what I understand that's about what we get out of that shorter barrel, even if a higher number is printed on the ammo. Only real way to tell is chrono it, I guess. Check out this Speer Gold Dot "short barrel" though, I'm reading good things...although that Buffalo Bore is getting _good reports_ also! I think you're good with it.
> :)



Thanks for the idea, bro.  I'll get a box of the Speer and do a chrony and bleach bottle paraffin test.


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## 8'Duece (Mar 8, 2009)

I've been loadin the .38 Special with Corbon DPX 110 grain +P.  

It's got a helluva FPS out of a short barrel, but I'm not sure of the actual kinetic energy it will deliver.  I'll have to chrony them sometime to see.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 9, 2009)

*Corbon!!!*

That seems to be a good choice also. Can't go wrong with Corbon DPX's...even their standard (non +p) are pretty HOT!

That's similar to the other ammo I purchased, which was the Hornady 110gr. FTX.
They state a muzzle volocity of 1175 FPS which puts it very much in the same class as a 115gr. 9mm round (energy).

It's a hollowpoint with a small polymer ball in the tip, which is designed to allow penetration through clothing, yet have good controlled expansion (so they say).

I feel pretty confident that the .38 (combined with the new alarm and the dog) has enough fight to get me to the 12ga 00 in the closet (where the wife then gets handed the .38)!  And, it should be fine for CCW, until I can get that _tiny_ KAHR .45 squared away to take it's place.


I'm also very happy with the "natural point" that little j-frame has, and the ease of concealment with Arizona clothes (shorts/t-shirt)! It just all-around _fits well_, especially with the little serpa holster.

That reminds me...I've got to get the wife practicing with the speedloaders (yes, with snap-caps!)
:cool:


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## 8'Duece (Mar 9, 2009)

Arizonaguide,

I used to purchase Corbon ammunition online for about $19.95 for a box of 20 rounds of DPX and Powerball, regardless of caliber.  Now it's more than doubled since 2003.  $32.95-$36.95


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## dusty (Mar 9, 2009)

The Buffalo Bore 158 gr. cost $36. total, with the NRA round-up, UPS ground (only method available), and the $3. (special handling fee).

What the fuck is a "special handling fee", BTW? This ain't DU we're dealing with here.

Anyway, it's like a buck eighty a round!

I DAYUM sure won't _practice_ with this shit, but I might be able to_ pawn_ it if times get real hard.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 9, 2009)

No Kidding!!! I can't even find Corbon or Buffalo Bore anywhere in town.
Speer is impossible to find. I was lucky to get the last box at my Gunshop.
As a second choice I had to settle for the Hornady's because of the shortages...and they were $29 at the time. Hopefully that's gotten better since I last searched.
:doh:

I'll be looking again after I get back to working and get some more play money pulled together. Hopefully it won't all be banned by then!
I don't even have a .22 yet, since I left Alaska (next on the list) but I'm stocking up on .22 ammo when I find them on sale! 

I don't reload, but I've been thinking about getting a shotgun relaoding setup...as that's fairly simple/inexpensive (used to do it when I was a kid), and that 12ga can be _very_ versatile.
:cool:


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## dusty (Mar 9, 2009)

I've always bought my .308 and .45 ACP from Midway, but they're out of all kinds of shit-just like everybody else.  Something smells fishy about this ammo shortage.

I heard a *M*otherfuckin' *S*hithead *N*othin' *b*ut *C*ommunist newscaster say something like "Gun sales should be brisk for the next several months regardless of new gun regulations."

I don't like it.

On edit, I found the whole story from which the above paraphrase was quoted:
http://adage.com/article?article_id=135092

NEW YORK (AdAge.com) -- The economy might be tanking, but firearm sales are going great guns. 

Despite the weakest holiday season on record, outdoor-products retailer Cabela's turned in strong fourth-quarter sales, largely as a result of an increase in firearm and ammunition sales. Smith & Wesson is reporting pistol sales up 40%, and Sturm, Ruger & Co. reported an 81% increase in firearm revenue. 

Cabela's: Retailer turned in strong fourth-quarter results thanks to firearm sales. 
In November, on the heels of Barack Obama's election, background checks for firearm sales jumped 42% to a record 1.5 million. But that pace has not abated, with a 24% rise in background checks in December, a 28% uptick in January and a 23% increase in February. 

A new Democratic administration typically heralds a rash of gun purchases, as consumers fear the possibility of more restrictions on firearm purchases -- the election of Bill Clinton in 1992 accompanied an 18-month surge in firearm sales. But industry experts say the tough economy, along with a desire for leisure activities close to home, will ensure strong firearm sales in the coming months, regardless of the attention the Obama administration gives to gun issues. 

BRIGHT SPOTS
Opportunities for the marketing and media industries in an otherwise bleak year 
"The continued increase in gun sales can be attributed to both political and economic factors," said Ted Novin, director-public affairs for The National Shooting Sports Foundation. "In tough economic times, more people become concerned about security -- a strong reason to purchase a firearm. Similarly, when income is an issue, it's reasonable to believe that hunting becomes that much more popular. Hunting in the field, as opposed to a local grocery store, ensures safe, high-protein food at a much lower price." 

Care of one's own
Eric Zinczenko, publisher of Field & Stream and Outdoor Life, said hunting is the only hobby where you can go out and "bring your dinner home." He added, "The ability to feed your family in these tough economic times [is] a point that we're seeing is not lost [on consumers]." 

Sales figures at a host of manufacturers and retailers are surprisingly robust, given consumers are reigning in their spending habits. Regarding Cabela's strong fourth-quarter sales, President-CEO Dennis Highby said sales at stores open at least a year, which rose 2%, would likely have been down 1%, excluding firearm and ammunition sales. 

"We're excited that we have the merchandise that people want in this type of environment," Mr. Highby said during a call with analysts. "We saw strength in ammunition, firearms; reloading was big; archery was strong. He added that those categories remained strong in the first six weeks of the year. 

BassPro, a privately held company, also reports its sales are robust. Larry Whiteley, a spokesman for the company, said that the company had a "very good" fourth quarter and a strong start to 2009. Mr. Whiteley said firearm sales are up but added that the fishing category has been outperforming as well. 

On the manufacturing side, publicly traded firearm manufacturers, such as Smith & Wesson and Sturm, Ruger & Co. are enjoying strong sales and relatively steadier stock prices. Smith & Wesson said aside from the 40% growth in pistol sales in its most recent quarter, tactical rifle sales soared 308%. Sturm, Ruger & Co. reported an 81% increase in firearms revenue. In a message on its website, Rock River Arms, which specializes in custom rifles and pistols, cites an "overwhelming increase in orders" in explaining why it can no longer provide estimated delivery dates, and notes that it is increasing production.

*Now, I remember a surge in weapons sales when Clinton took office, and I remember what happened with the Brady Bill, but I don't recall a handgun ammo shortage such as we have now.

Wonder if it has anything to do with the alleged ammo microdotting scheme?*


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## dusty (Mar 9, 2009)

I forgot to say that you can order straight from Buffalo Bore as well.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 9, 2009)

Excellent post Dusty! Thanks.

I was reading last night about how some of Clinton's friends had holdings overseas and ties to Norinco that it resulted in millions of these rifles being imported into the USA during the Clinton administration. Clinton’s hypocrisy had the result of allowing millions of Americans to purchase a military autoloading rifle (SKS) for around $100 or so. Not to mention all the cheap AK's. Very Ironic, considering the Clinton stand on so-called "Assault Weapons".

I just can't wait to see what's next. I have done my best to convince any liberal friends that I know, the importance of being able to protect one's self and one's family...and that taking away that protection from the good people doesn't take the guns away from the criminals. I think I've made some progress. But, it takes ALL of us.


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## dusty (Mar 9, 2009)

Well we won Heller 5 to 4! :doh:


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## P. Beck (Mar 9, 2009)

Guys,

I'm see'in a lot of figures here about bullet weights and muzzle velocities and expansion but not enough about penetration.

Regardless of mv and expansion, you need a round that will consistently penetrate a MINIMUM of 12-15" of soft tissue. IIRC, the FBI standard is 4 layers of heavy denim and THEN a minimum of 12-15" of soft tissue penetration.

Bullets poke holes.  That's all.  To do the job, you have got to poke holes in major blood-bearing organs. To do that you've gotta go deep. All the MV and expansion in the world will not help you if your 1100 fps hollow-points open up to .75" but only penetrate 3-4".

:2c: YMMV


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## arizonaguide (Mar 9, 2009)

Well Put, PB! 

That's why I decided to carry the 135gr. Speers instead of the 110gr. Hornadys, even though the Hornadys have the little Polymer ball. Dusty may have the best idea with the heavier 158gr Buffalos.

It's a tough call with the .38, especially with a shorter barrel, because I want to have _some_ reliable expansion (which they say requires 800-1000fps of volocity), yet I want reliable penetration also (which they say requires a heavier bullet, (or FMJ, which throws away expansion)).

There are various debates about FBI recommended ballistics and such, and you guys have more firsthand field experience than I do! (but, most are seeing the results of FMJ, correct?).

.._But_, one gunshot victim that I DID get a close look at (both back and front) had been shot with a .30 rifle hollowpoint (from approx. 100yds), and the front wound was a small pencil sized hole...and the exit wound was a hole the size of a grapefruit. When I saw that _with my own eyes_...it made a believer in me about the necessity of the expanding bullet. 
(against tissue...not against barriers).

I know from the hole in the wall behind the victim that the bullet never expanded more than the typical 3/4" mushroom...yet all around the bullet hole in the wall was the splatter from what used to be the back (and insides) of the victim. 

So, that high volocity expanding bullet went into the victim, expanded, and took a whole bunch of extra(cone shapped wound) muscle/organ/tissue/ribs with it. Cone shapped out to about a 3" exit wound.

Of course the volocity, energy, and penetration of a .30cal rifle is a hell of a lot more than a .38 will ever be!
(and if I could carry one in my pocket here in PHX, I would...trust me! I'm still debating a shotgun mount for the front seat of the car!;))

I guess the bottom line with the snubby is get the Biggest, Heaviest, Expanding .38 Bullet possible, at the Fastest Volocity possible...and then fight my way to that 12ga (or a .30cal rifle!)!!!
:)


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## dusty (Mar 9, 2009)

P. Beck said:


> Guys,
> 
> I'm see'in a lot of figures here about bullet weights and muzzle velocities and expansion but not enough about penetration.
> 
> ...



Good point.  That's why I picked the 158 gr. SWCHP.

http://www.snubnose.info/docs/snubby_ballistics.htm





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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## dusty (Mar 9, 2009)

I'm also in a situation where overpenetration could be a problem, so I have to find a happy medium with my J-frame.  158gr. looks to be the ticket, and it shoots point of aim.  The 125's were a tad low.

I'm pretty close to the old FBI load, and I hear it did the trick for a few years.

Until Miami, anyway.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 9, 2009)

I still wouldn't want to get shot with even those 110gr Hornadys though...especially at ranges that I would use the snubby.  Of course, I wouldn't be shooting through a heavy jacket here in Arizona (typically)...but more likely a t-shirt, or maybe a hoody.


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## P. Beck (Mar 10, 2009)

Dusty,

Good choice.  The 158 gr. SWCHP has a long-standing rep as a good load for the .38 platform.  I can think of several LE organizations that used that load for years to good effect.


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## dusty (Mar 10, 2009)

These are gas checked, too.  Verges on .357 Rem mag performance, supposedly.  

I'll let you know how they do in a while.


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## 7point62 (Mar 10, 2009)

I love my Smitty M10 with the 4" barrel.








It is my go-to gun for HD...the easy kick facilitates target reacquistion and it's got sufficient killing power.

I recommend .38's to those who ask my opinion because I think a firearm that can be wielded one-handed leaves another hand free for comm, which is the other essential element of home defense; not to mention allows one to fire from cover, i.e. around a corner without unnecessary exposure.


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## HOLLiS (Mar 10, 2009)

7point62 said:


> I love my Smitty M10 with the 4" barrel.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I really like shooting 38 sp (appoximate the same as 9mm).   I would recommend over a 38 sp, is a .357 Mag.   There are number of reasons.  Wider choice of rounds to shoot,  beefer frame, etc.

You also mention shooting with one hand,  it is good to know.  Also shooting one handed off hand is another. 

I like M10's.   Then again, I like most Smith wheel guns and their newer autos.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 10, 2009)

That does make me wonder if they market a 180grain or even 200grain ammo for the .38? I see it for the .357...but nothing for the .38 (that I can find with a quick search).
Anyone ever see any factory .38 (+P) in 180gr or 200gr Hollowpoints?


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## HOLLiS (Mar 10, 2009)

arizonaguide said:


> That does make me wonder if they market a 180grain or even 200grain ammo for the .38? I see it for the .357...but nothing for the .38 (that I can find with a quick search).
> Anyone ever see any factory .38 (+P) in 180gr or 200gr Hollowpoints?



Any bullet for a .357 will work on the .38 sp.   Both are .357 diameter.  The difference is loads.   The .357 was designed with a longer case so it would not be accidentally loaded into a .38 sp.  Some of the .38 Sp pistol, are pretty light framed, especially some of the really old ones.  Another reason to becareful with +Ps loads.  One could load a 38 sp with .357 data..  Depending on the pistol one could loose a few fingers to the load working. 

I gather you don't reload.  I would suggest looking into reloading data.  I fyou have sufficient skills and equipment, you could work up a load. 

They use to load 38 S&W with a 200 gr. bullet.  200-380 (British nomenclature, if I got the numbers right)


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## arizonaguide (Mar 10, 2009)

Yup! I know it might be a bitch in the little snubby "airweight", but I'd like to try some 200gr. JHP's in it...just to compare. P. Beck got me thinking about the .38 compared to the .45.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the .45 is a slower (900fps typical) round with a heavy (200-230gr typical)bullet, and it does quite good from what I hear! Why not use the same logic on my snubby...and go to a 200gr. Hollowpoint. I'll have to check the Buffalo Bore site next.

Here's the Data on the Buffalo Bores (DO look like good stuff):



> The new Buffalo Bore Heavy 38 SPL+p ammo will maximize the effectiveness of your 38 SPL revolver. The powders are flash suppressed so as to not hinder your vision should you be required to drop the hammer in low light.
> 
> *Item 20A*: 158gr., very soft cast, semi wad cutter, (Keith) hollow cavity, with a gas check. This bullet will mushroom violently on impact and will penetrate roughly 14 inches in human flesh. Again, this bullet is gas checked and will not lead your barrel.​
> Item 20A/20 is the terrific SOFT lead semi wad cutter hollow cavity bullet, however we've added a gas check to stop the leading that this load typically causes with other manufacturers version of this bullet.
> ...


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## dusty (Mar 10, 2009)

arizonaguide said:


> That does make me wonder if they market a 180grain or even 200grain ammo for the .38? I see it for the .357...but nothing for the .38 (that I can find with a quick search).
> Anyone ever see any factory .38 (+P) in 180gr or 200gr Hollowpoints?



http://www.reloadammo.com/38loads.htm

They used to make a 200 gr. "Special Police Load", but I think it was too slow.


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## HOLLiS (Mar 10, 2009)

Faster is not always better, same as slower is not always worse.  Bullets are design to do and not do things.  When I hunt, I carry a side arm, 44 Mag.   I load the cylinder alternating chambers with penetrating rounds and soft tissue rounds.  


Why.. we have two legged pests, we have cougar, we have bear, and the coup de grace if necessary.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 10, 2009)

Yeah, I'm not finding anything.
But those 158 Buffalos do look great!
I think it's time to start searching for a source here in the PHX!
I'm sold.:)

Check out these numbers:
S&W mod 60, *2 inch*—*1072* fps (*319* ft. lbs.)
That's GOOD stuff from a snubby!!
:eek:


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## dusty (Mar 10, 2009)

I  hear ya.  I carry a .45 Colt where there's bear.


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## Diamondback 2/2 (Mar 10, 2009)

7point62 said:


> I love my Smitty M10 with the 4" barrel.



Damn brother, that don’t look anything like my old S&W model 10 :confused:


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## 08steeda (Mar 10, 2009)

J.A.B. said:


> Damn brother, that don’t look anything like my old S&W model 10 :confused:



My Model 19 looks close but that is one sweet looking wheel gun!!!


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## 7point62 (Mar 10, 2009)

Both 38 and 9 have that sweet kick, although BITD I wore that crossed-pistol badge for the  1911. Once I discovered the Zen of it, it was my weapon.

One reason I keep the 38 wheel gun for HD--and not .357-- is because both my younger boys, 15 & 12, got scary-good with it from day one. It ain't complicated, it's a sweet shooter and it'll kill. I like .357s and carried a Ruger Speed Six for many years as my personal weapon, but it's like shooting Atomic bullets.


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## HOLLiS (Mar 10, 2009)

08steeda said:


> My Model 19 looks close but that is one sweet looking wheel gun!!!



Two S&W M 10s


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## 08steeda (Mar 10, 2009)

Nice Carpet, I mean firearms!!!

Gotta love wheel guns!!!


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## P. Beck (Mar 10, 2009)

"...I think a firearm that can be wielded one-handed..."

Absolutely.  That's why it's called a "handgun" and not a "handsgun".
Nobody goes to a gunfight armed with only a handgun on purpose.  If you find me in such circumstances, you may assume that something has gone terribly wrong.

Practice one-hand technique regularly. Ok, good.  Now do it with your other hand.

I know a number of people who use heavy-loaded, subsonic, .38 Special rounds in .357 frames. On purpose.  They tend to be older gentlemen.  Be careful of such men.  They might know what they are doing and many of them display a distinct lack of tolerance for fools.

On the subject of heavy pistol bullets, I seem to remember a game warden a while back that habitually carried 300 grain SWC in his .45 1911.  Loaded to only about 700 fps.  Claimed they were good medicine for black bear.  On bright days, with the sun behind you, you could watch those big black pills practically waddle downrange into the tan backstop. Hell for penetration though. All that momentum.


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## dusty (Mar 10, 2009)

Proper one-handed use of a .38. FF to about 4:30 to skip the bullshit:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIvg-pnjjmM&feature=related"]YouTube - Stairway Shootout[/ame]


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## Diamondback 2/2 (Mar 10, 2009)

HOLLiS said:


> Two S&W M 10s


Yep-yep my S&W model 10 looks like the top one, but with a rubber grip like the bottom one. WTF is that on the trigger of the top one?



P. Beck said:


> I know a number of people who use heavy-loaded, subsonic, .38 Special rounds in .357 frames. On purpose.  They tend to be older gentlemen.  Be careful of such men.  They might know what they are doing and many of them display a distinct lack of tolerance for fools.



I did not know that you knew my grandfather and his barber  My dad and me always give them shit for their “Saturday night specials”! But of course not too much shit ;)


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## HOLLiS (Mar 10, 2009)

It is called a trigger shoe.   It came with the pistol.  Some of the competition shooters used them.  Widen the trigger surface and helps to prevent finger slip.  Or that is what I remember about them.  I never used one previously before obtaining this pistol.


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## P. Beck (Mar 10, 2009)

A trigger shoe is ok for a target piece or single action shooting but it tends to wear on your finger a mite after a while. For more serious social purposes I would suggest rounding and polishing the trigger smooth to allow the finger to "roll" the trigger easier in double-action. That's where the revolver really makes it's money.

Refer to "No Second Place Winners" by Bill Jordan and "Fast and Fancy Revolver Shooting" by Ed McGivern for instructions on maximizing the double-action utility of the combat revolver.  I read both as a boy and still retain those books as essential to my library. (Bill's book is signed)


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## dusty (Mar 10, 2009)

P. Beck said:


> A trigger shoe is ok for a target piece or single action shooting but it tends to wear on your finger a mite after a while. For more serious social purposes I would suggest rounding and polishing the trigger smooth to allow the finger to "roll" the trigger easier in double-action. That's where the revolver really makes it's money.
> 
> Refer to "No Second Place Winners" by Bill Jordan and "Fast and Fancy Revolver Shooting" by Ed McGivern for instructions on maximizing the double-action utility of the combat revolver.  I read both as a boy and still retain those books as essential to my library. (Bill's book is signed)



My brother had that book. Outstanding book. And signed? Dayum.

I liked the part where Bill's cop buddy, in sight of no witnesses, shot a prick who had a throwaway with two fired rounds in the cylinder which he dropped off a bridge and into the river after getting killed; the investigators found (I think) five weapons meeting that exact description that Bill and the cop's buddies dropped in the river to cover his ass.

The good ol' days.


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## pardus (Mar 10, 2009)

dusty said:


> My brother had that book. Outstanding book. And signed? Dayum.
> 
> I liked the part where Bill's cop buddy, in sight of no witnesses, shot a prick who had a throwaway with two fired rounds in the cylinder which he dropped off a bridge and into the river after getting killed; the investigators found (I think) five weapons meeting that exact description that Bill and the cop's buddies dropped in the river to cover his ass.
> 
> The good ol' days.



Terrible, just terrible ;) :cool:


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## 7point62 (Mar 11, 2009)

P. Beck said:


> "...I think a firearm that can be wielded one-handed..."
> 
> Practice one-hand technique regularly. Ok, good.  Now do it with your other hand...




I had a civilian self-proclaimed firearms expert telling me one day that one-handed pistol shooting was for Hollywood action heroes and people who don't know anything about handguns and I kept my mouth shut but it wasn't easy. Sure, two-hands is better, but it pays to be good with one.


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## Trip_Wire (Mar 11, 2009)

dusty said:


> I just ordered a box for my little Smitty 442 pocket carry snubby.
> Anybody shot any? (Or am I the only cat who owns a .38)




I have a S&W Model 422 (silver). I carry it in a Kramer pocket holster. It's real handy to carry it that way. I don't shoot it a lot. I try to avoid using +P ammo in such a light frame revolver, as S&W doesn't recommend doing do. For carry I use a 125gr Gold Saber.


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## HOLLiS (Mar 11, 2009)

One of my favorites was the S&W M 36, chief special with the round butt.  It is a 5 shot .38 special. 

I do really like the new "feather lights".  99.9998% of the time conceal carry is just that, concealed and carry.  Bulk and weight tends to encourage a person not to carry.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 11, 2009)

One thing I like about the j-frame revolver is the ability to carry it in a jacket/vest pocket, with my hand on it...where I can keep it concealed as a suspicious person approaches, yet fire through the pocket at the last minute if I need to (in theory anyway, never actually tried it). Can't exactly do that with a semi-auto.

Plus, nothing seems to fit my hand with a "natural point" quite as well as that little smith j-frame.
:)





(And damn PB, a signed Bill Jordan....shit, I'm jealous too! I think the only thing that would be as good would be a signed Skeeter Skelton or Jeff Cooper. (to me, anyway)). Cool stuff.


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## P. Beck (Mar 11, 2009)

"I think the only thing that would be as good would be a signed Skeeter Skelton or Jeff Cooper."

You're right. And it is.:cool:

Don't get me wrong folks. I do practice shooting with both hands. Right after I'm done practicing with either one first.:)


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## P. Beck (Mar 11, 2009)

Kind of off the subject, but it is a classic. Stoked it with Elmer Keiths SWC's.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 17, 2009)

Just got the LAST BOX of Buffalo Bore .38sp SWCHP158gr at Cabellas because we can't even find it/get it at the shop. I was happy to get it, for $21 for a box of 20. Last box in town that I can find. I guess I'll have to look into finding it on the web. Maybe.
Was glad to get it for daily carry.


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## dusty (Mar 17, 2009)

Haven't shot mine yet, bro-too busy this weekend cleanin' the broken limbs outta deer camp because of that freakish ice storm.

If you do any testing soon, let me know, eh?

Of course, it won't take me long to check out the performance with my piece at over a buck a bullet.

That guy who said ammo's the new money was a prophetic mofo.


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## arizonaguide (Mar 17, 2009)

Stocking up on .22shells just for that reason...(and purchased the 12ga reloader).
Still need to get a Ruger 10-22 soon, before semi-auto's are banned. Get the KAHR on layaway, reloading supplies.
Damn, busy week coming up!!!

I'll let you know if I ever get to get out and shoot these...maybe this next week at the shoot I'll see if I can a box in Denver before we head out.


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## dusty (Mar 26, 2009)

Here you go. This is what the load I use will do:

http://www.brassfetcher.com/Buffalo Bore 158gr (non +P) SWC-HC.html


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