# MARSOF Intel/ 8071



## PACMan (Nov 30, 2012)

I'm an 0231/ Intel Analyst (Secret Squirrel) by trade, but am going through my options in the MARSOC field. There is plenty of information regarding the CSO route, but I can't really find too much about the Intel pipeline. Once you complete the course are you attached to an MSOB or MSOT? Any amplifying information would be appreciated.


s/f


----------



## fox1371 (Dec 1, 2012)

Just out of curiosity, why did you feel the need to put "secret squirrel" in your post?  You went from a well typed post to a completely naive post.


----------



## PACMan (Dec 1, 2012)

Just for the simple fact whenever I mention my MOS, someone always seems to slip in the notion of 'SS.' But out of curiosity, how does the post go from well typed to, "completely naive," by me mentioning secret squirrel?


----------



## AWP (Dec 1, 2012)

PACMan said:


> Just for the simple fact whenever I mention my MOS, someone always seems to slip in the notion of 'SS.' But out of curiosity, how does the post go from well typed to, "completely naive," by me mentioning secret squirrel?


 
I can't speak for fox1371, only for myself, but I find that someone who throws out the Secret Squirrel tag/ title/ whatever is usually trying to be "cool". It is a little cheeky to me and not in the good sort of way.

We have a member on this board who had an officer show up to his unit wearing the Milspecmonkey Secret Squirrel patch; that new officer only lasted about a day thanks to their choice to wear that patch.

For whatever reason(s), that title/ career nickname can offer up some bad images to an outsider like myself. It seems childish; 15 years ago it might have been cool or funny, but not anymore.


----------



## Marauder06 (Dec 1, 2012)

PACMan said:


> Just for the simple fact whenever I mention my MOS, someone always seems to slip in the notion of 'SS.' *But out of curiosity, how does the post go from well typed to, "completely naive," by me mentioning secret squirrel?*


 
It's just not necessary.  And to others, especially other intelligence professionals, and in particularly those of us who have done this for a long time, it is irksome and reflects a lack of either 1) experience/maturity or 2) professional pride of the person using the term.  

If you're proud of your profession, you don't use terms of derision to describe it or your role in it.  You don't refer to yourself as an "intel weenie" or a "geek" or a "secret squirrel," or any number of other terms.  And, if you're really proud of what you do, you don't allow others to use it around you, either.  Some may say that they are terms of affection; they're not, they're terms of derision that have become so commonplace that people don't even think about it anymore.  

By the way, I'm one of the parties referred to in the post above.  I'll leave it up to you to decide whether or not I was the one wearing that patch, or the one that did the firing.



OK, so let's set aside the whole "Secret Squirrel" thing and chalk it on to professional development, and see if someone can address the questions that you have.


----------



## Stork (Dec 1, 2012)

I concur wholeheartedly with the above.  Also, the term evokes images of “hiding behind the green door” which undermines the work of all good intelligence professionals.
Moving on…
0231’s will complete their initial pipeline to become 8071’s.  Next, they will complete additional training depending on PME progression, time available, past experience, team shortfalls, etc.  Generally, they will be assigned to a DST and work at the MSOC, sometimes they will do a SOTF.  Getting down to an MSOT is METT-TC dependant, but not uncommon.
Bottom line:  it depends.
Let me know if you have additional questions.
S/F,
Stork


----------



## PACMan (Dec 1, 2012)

Point taken, I did not intend for the term to rub anyone the wrong way. And thank you for steering the conversation back to the original subject.


----------



## TYW27 (Jan 20, 2013)

To follow this question: Does anyone know if it is the same path for a 2621?


----------



## Stork (Jan 21, 2013)

The above is the same except 26xxs will be almost exclusively at the MSOT level.

S/F,

Stork


----------



## TYW27 (Jan 24, 2013)

Thank's Stork.


----------



## Mosque (Apr 7, 2013)

TYW27 said:


> Thank's Stork.


 
PM me for my SID or alias.


----------



## The Hate Ape (Apr 8, 2013)

As an 8071 you will have completed all SOF level 1 training which will entail generalized SOF mos training (intel for you), Special Operations Training Course, and SERE. This is basic level training hence level 1 and is the standard for recieving an 8071 secondary MOS. 

Upon completion of your pipeline (about 9 months total) you will remain at your parent command within MARSOC, typically intel BN for you, until you are tasked for an operation/deployment. From there, depending on what your role is you will be pushed to either the SOTF, MSOC, or MSOT for that slated deployment. You will likely have more follow on training that is assignment dependent. When you return from deployment, normally you will be placed back into your parent command.

You will receive SDA pay once you receive the 8071 secondary
Yes you can go to jump and dive based on seat availability (we get more available monthly)
-BICs are available as well
Yes you will work hard, but it pays dividends not only in experience and training but the quality of personnel you work with

What it's not:
A back door into permanent team assignment
A way for you to do the "cool guy stuff" all the time
- you'll do fun training, you'll live your career a little differently, and youll have deployment experiences that will be MUCH differant than big fleet counterparts but as far as the team is concerned, they rely on you to do your job proficiently. You do your job well, you'll probably get to go play a few rounds but don't take the common misconception that you're going to have the role of both (in your case) an intel guy and a CSO. You're an intel guy who's on the team, doing team things.

You haven't given that impression I just feel it needs to be said to anyone considering the 71 field because it really is most Marines' initial impression when they come here.

As far as the specifics of your intel training, I would never discuss that on an open forum nor would I think anyone else here would.

Hope this helped.

H/A


----------



## Teufel (Apr 9, 2013)

The Hate Ape said:


> As an 8071 you will have completed all SOF level 1 training which will entail generalized SOF mos training (intel for you), Special Operations Training Course, and SERE. This is basic level training hence level 1 and is the standard for recieving an 8071 secondary MOS.
> 
> Upon completion of your pipeline (about 9 months total) you will remain at your parent command within MARSOC, typically intel BN for you, until you are tasked for an operation/deployment. From there, depending on what your role is you will be pushed to either the SOTF, MSOC, or MSOT for that slated deployment. You will likely have more follow on training that is assignment dependent. When you return from deployment, normally you will be placed back into your parent command.
> 
> ...


 
You've had support guys go to dive?  Why?  It's hard enough for operators to go.  BRC/OTC used to be a requirement.


----------



## The Hate Ape (Apr 9, 2013)

It was just available for a couple of guys and they took advantage of it. Typically Fires snakes seats the easiest and now everyone is on the jump school factory assembly line. Call it luck of the dice I guess concerning the guys w bubbles.


----------



## Teufel (Apr 9, 2013)

The Hate Ape said:


> It was just available for a couple of guys and they took advantage of it. Typically Fires snakes seats the easiest and now everyone is on the jump school factory assembly line. Call it luck of the dice I guess concerning the guys w bubbles.


 
Guys got to get their badges after all.  It's all some guys care about.


----------



## Salt USMC (Apr 9, 2013)

Seeing this discussion about 8071's (especially in relation to Intel guys) really makes me wish I hadn't dicked up the opportunities I had to go that route.  Michael Golembesky has written a little about it on SOFREP as well, and made the whole concept sound very exciting.  I fills me with regret that I didn't make it.  Doubly so when I used to look on the MOL list for my rank/MOS and sort by billeted MOS's for the 8071's and see what kind of turds had that designator!  Guys I knew from as far back as Dam Neck who couldn't string together a cogent sentence if their chow depended on it.  Guys who, even after four years in the fleet, were producing absolute garbage products.  Guys without even a deployment.  And there they were, up in that lofty pantheon , having finally "arrived". 

When I was checking out to EAS, I saw one such guy at CIF.  A guy who had a reputation throughout the whole MAW for sucking at Intel.  I chatted him up for a minute and asked where he was going. "Oh, I'm going over to x MSOB, pretty cool huh?".  Keeping the straightest face I could, I asked if the screening had been difficult.  He said "Oh no, I knew a SSgt over there and he by-name requested me.  Didn't really have to screen".  It was about all I could do to prevent myself from punching him.  I fucking hate nepotism.  Hate it more than anything else.  Sometimes it serves a purpose, to get a well-qualified guy in spot where he's needed in a short period of time.  But when it gets a shitlord into a position like that where lives are at stake because he was buddies with a staff NCO.......that's such shit.  And it doubly upsets me because I was scrutinized so heavily.  This little fuck, who hadn't done so much as an Iraq tour, was getting to where I wanted to go.  What the fuck?

Rant over.


----------



## The Hate Ape (Apr 9, 2013)

Teufel said:


> Guys got to get their badges after all.  It's all some guys care about.



I don't know. If I had the green light on Dive I certainly would, can't say I blame them either - especially with BICs.


----------



## Salt USMC (Apr 10, 2013)

Deathy McDeath said:


> When I was checking out to EAS, I saw one such guy at CIF. A guy who had a reputation throughout the whole MAW for sucking at Intel. I chatted him up for a minute and asked where he was going. "Oh, I'm going over to x MSOB, pretty cool huh?".


 
I just found out yesterday that this guy got a DUI when he got to Pendleton, got busted down to lance and kicked over to a victor unit.  I know it shouldn't, but that news warmed the cockles of my tiny black heart


----------



## 0699 (Apr 12, 2013)

All except now the victor unit has to deal with him.  When I was at HMX-1, we had the lowest rate of NJP and Courts Martial in the entire Corps, because the slightest fuck up would get you sent to Base HQ Bn, transferred with orders and a charge sheet.  Great for us, but now it's just another problem that the joining unit has to deal with.


----------



## Hitman2/3 (Apr 13, 2013)

The Hate Ape said:


> It was just available for a couple of guys and they took advantage of it. Typically Fires snakes seats the easiest and now everyone is on the jump school factory assembly line. Call it luck of the dice I guess concerning the guys w bubbles.


 
Have you actually seen these guys go to MCD or seen their BTR? Because thats pretty impossible unless they hold a 0321, 0302, 0203, 0307, 0372, 8404 MOS, thats a non waiverable requirement thats part of the course. I've heard plenty of support guys talking out of their ass saying they were going to dive school because they think they can fool the actual divers who know the requirements. However, as Teufel said its hard enough for operators to get a seat, let alone pass the course. There isn't an ops chief or CO that would sign off on that, and even if they did it wouldn't matter because they still don't meet the MOS requirements. Thats part of the MCD check list.

Thats like them saying "I'm going to the advanced Sniper course" but their not a Sniper. It dosen't work like that.

Not to mention MCD isn't like going to get your civilian dive licence. I've seen plenty of Recon Marines and CSO's who have a VERY strong water background not be able to hack it. Unless these support guys where college swimmers I don't see them just being able to jump in to pre-dive and pass onto MCD.


----------



## The Hate Ape (Apr 14, 2013)

I have seen members of fires and intel wearing bubbles that more than likely have never been in your mentioned list of MOSs. They are however, unless I'm completely mistaken - holding the same enabler secondary mos we all share. That stated and the mentions of the training possibility from the leadership that have been around much longer than I have would leave me comfortable sharing said information without any BTR reviews or condescending questions.

Go in the locker any day of the week and you'll bump into a pair prepping for the mentioned predive. Most of those guys are support types and I don't think theyre busting their asses in the water to find you somewhere and talk out of it. Your comment about knowing CSOs and Recon Guys who didn't make it doesn't change the fact that these guys did.


----------



## Hitman2/3 (Apr 14, 2013)

The Hate Ape said:


> I have seen members of fires and intel wearing bubbles that more than likely have never been in your mentioned list of MOSs. They are however, unless I'm completely mistaken - holding the same enabler secondary mos we all share. That stated and the mentions of the training possibility from the leadership that have been around much longer than I have would leave me comfortable sharing said information without any BTR reviews or condescending questions.
> 
> Go in the locker any day of the week and you'll bump into a pair prepping for the mentioned predive. Most of those guys are support types and I don't think theyre busting their asses in the water to find you somewhere and talk out of it. Your comment about knowing CSOs and Recon Guys who didn't make it doesn't change the fact that these guys did.


 

Pump your breaks cool breeze. One, those are not my list of MOS they're the Marine Corps laid out in MCO 3150.4. Two, I don't know what you think the enabler secondary MOS for MARSOC means, but it does not mean that you get carte blanch on schools. Three, that leadership thats been around longer than you, would be me. We'll just round it down to 13 years between the Recon and MARSOC community with about three being a Combatant Diver. So when I speak on such things you may want to take note.

Now see where you screwed up is that you started trying to state facts that you don't know. Would you like to tell me how often the Dive locker runs re-qualification dives and or a pre dive? I'll give you a hint its not any day of the week, and for that matter its barely even every other week, if every month.

Then there's the whole most of those guys are support types comment. That being said I never saw ANY support personnel running around Stone Bay with dive bubbles; not in the past four years. Had you said you know of one guy who did it, that might be believable, hell I've been killing people for the past half year or so, so maybe there was a policy change since I've been gone. But if that were the case that would mean that in the past four to five classes there has been a huge influx of support personnel in these courses. That would be interesting considering the MARSOC standing policy on meeting all the pre requisites for MCD, including an MOS that meets the Marine Corps order. As I stated before, the course is a bitch and just like in this community reputation is everything, even the Commands reputation. Do you really think the Command would send personnel down to a school like that without them already meeting the requirements? For that matter when the NOM sheet gets submitted it has to get checked off by a senior 0372 who was a 0321 and MCD graduate for well over a decade. Not sure you understand how their mind works but I can assure you his response upon seeing a NOM sheet like that would not only be no but fuck no.

And now that I think about it your post says there are support guys in PRE-DIVE. Thats good for them but last time I checked pre-dive is not dive school nor does it qualify you to go to dive school. It is a check for the Command to ensure you are physically capable. Hell, we can put anybody through pre-dive all day any day, just like I can put somebody through a pre-sniper or pre-JTAC. But unless they meet all the requirements for those schools ie MOS they aren't going.  

Do you even know why non essential personnel aren't allowed to go to MCD and why dive pay is more than static line pay? Its because diving is dangerous as shit, hence the Marine Corps order requiring an MOS that requires a need for the skill set. Last time I checked not a whole lot of need for an intel analyst or truck driver to surreptitiously enter a denied area via sub surface navigation. So next time you'd like to get snippy I suggest you do it in your lane and have all the facts.


----------



## The Hate Ape (Apr 14, 2013)

Informative and understood. 

R/S.


----------



## 0699 (Apr 14, 2013)

Teufel said:


> Guys got to get their badges after all. It's all some guys care about.


 
It always annoyed the shit out of me when guys were badge chasing.  People would line up down the hallway for seats at jump school, but trying to get them to go to an advanced comm school (something that would actually make them better at their job) was like pulling teeth... :-/


----------



## AWP (Apr 14, 2013)

0699 said:


> It always annoyed the shit out of me when guys were badge chasing. People would line up down the hallway for seats at jump school, but trying to get them to go to an advanced comm school (something that would actually make them better at their job) was like pulling teeth... :-/


 
The military culture in general places an emphasis on badges, tabs, and assorted baubles. When a young E-2/E-3 sees his/ her NCOs wearing their bling, it reinforces the need for said bling.

I've come to the belief that every branch should ban all of that nonsense. Keep the badges and everything, but keep them off the uniform. You aren't a great NCO because you passed some course, you're a great NCO because of your abilities.


----------



## dirtmover (Apr 14, 2013)

Freefalling said:


> The military culture in general places an emphasis on badges, tabs, and assorted baubles. When a young E-2/E-3 sees his/ her NCOs wearing their bling, it reinforces the need for said bling.
> 
> I've come to the belief that every branch should ban all of that nonsense. Keep the badges and everything, but keep them off the uniform. You aren't a great NCO because you passed some course, you're a great NCO because of your abilities.


 AMEN brother!!!  This is the same reason why my old CO never wore all his shit.  This guy was SF prior to going green to gold so he had almost every cool guy bauble you could think of.  I keep that same mentality to this day.


----------



## Brill (Apr 14, 2013)

Mosque said:


> PM me for my SID or alias.


 
SID?  Really?


----------



## Brill (Apr 14, 2013)

Freefalling said:


> The military culture in general places an emphasis on badges, tabs, and assorted baubles. When a young E-2/E-3 sees his/ her NCOs wearing their bling, it reinforces the need for said bling.
> 
> I've come to the belief that every branch should ban all of that nonsense. Keep the badges and everything, but keep them off the uniform. You aren't a great NCO because you passed some course, you're a great NCO because of your abilities.


 
PT badge? :-"


----------



## CryptoLingUSMC (May 13, 2013)

.


----------



## PACMan (Jun 2, 2013)

CryptoLingUSMC said:


> You probably noticed the CWO3 at Intel BN. He got his bubble through Radio Recon...SigInt.


 
CWO3 from which Intel Bn? I am currently with 1st Intel on CP.

On another note, I just returned from a year long deployment with an Advisor Team and decided to take an analyst billet with MARSOC. No one in my unit seems to know much information other than I need to check-in with MARSOC July 1. I had to extend for an additional year, but I've heard various information from Marines regarding what I'll be doing. Can anyone provide any insight on the training I'll likely be receiving or what else I could be doing other than ANALYST work? PM me if you have any pertinent information.


----------



## Teufel (Jun 2, 2013)

The Hate Ape said:


> I have seen members of fires and intel wearing bubbles that more than likely have never been in your mentioned list of MOSs. They are however, unless I'm completely mistaken - holding the same enabler secondary mos we all share. That stated and the mentions of the training possibility from the leadership that have been around much longer than I have would leave me comfortable sharing said information without any BTR reviews or condescending questions.
> 
> Go in the locker any day of the week and you'll bump into a pair prepping for the mentioned predive. Most of those guys are support types and I don't think theyre busting their asses in the water to find you somewhere and talk out of it. Your comment about knowing CSOs and Recon Guys who didn't make it doesn't change the fact that these guys did.


 
Gold bubble or silver bubble?  Big difference between the two.  BRC or ITC and pre dive course is a prerequisite for Marine Combatant Diver.  I find it hard to believe that they would send intel or fires guys to MCD.  If they want a school send them to BRC or ITC.  I hate badge hunters.


----------



## Stork (Jun 3, 2013)

PACMan said:


> Can anyone provide any insight on the training I'll likely be receiving or what else I could be doing other than ANALYST work?


 
If you're so concerned about everything other than YOUR MOS, they'll probably say screw it and just make you an honorary CSO.  You'll be a MFF/MCD/Breacher/Sniper SDAP 12 earning life taker in no time.

[Sarcasm Off]

Don't get it twisted, you're going to MARSOC to be an analyst.  CSOs come down a different pipe, and they don't need wannabe CSOs, they need analysts.  We have the best analyst training in the Marine Corps.  What isn't here, you will be sent to get.  Anything else you happen to get is gravy.

S/F,
Stork


----------



## PACMan (Jun 3, 2013)

Nothing was ever, "twisted," I understand what my PRIMARY job is going to be. I was just trying to find additional information from others who may have taken the same billet. Nor did my question infer that I was trying to be a wannabe CSO. Nonetheless, I appreciate the information.


----------



## Teufel (Jun 3, 2013)

Actually I do know two HET Marines who are combatant divers and I think they are both freefall qualified.  Both of them were 0321s who crossed over and went to school prior to moving over to intel.  As BRC graduates though, they would meet the prerequisites to go to MCD if they didn't go as 21s.  It'd be harder to find an operations chief to let them go though.


----------

