# 18x Medical Waiver/ Possible Recruiter Lie?



## TheKicker (Dec 3, 2016)

Alright, here goes:

     Eight years ago ( almost nine), I tore through my Meniscus (tissue in the knee) and had an arthroscopic surgery to repair it.  I healed up wonderfully, and it has been healthy with no issues even through Highschool/college football and the all intense lifting that goes with it.  It is to my knowledge that surgeries and medical conditions/operations require a waiver.  Here's what I'm stumped on.  I just stumbled across a forum or Q/A board (I'll try to find it again for y'all) that said some surgeries may not actually need a waiver due to how long ago it was, situations, etc.  The post mentioned an Army waiver guideline or policy book that covered this material, but I have had no luck in my hunt to track it down.  Would y'all happen to have any G2 on this?  Are there certain instances where even though someone may have had a surgery that would normally require a waiver, they were able to proceed without one due to circumstances?  

Now this is where it applies to the recruiter:

     When talking with my recruiter about wishing to take a grasp on an 18X contract, I disclosed that I had the work done on my knee.  He said that this may require a waiver, but that it really depends on MEPS, and how they will proceed.  Basically got told the only thing I can do is wait until my appointment, which is understandable.  He told me that if my surgery does require a waiver, 18X is a no-go as I can't receive an Airborne stamp at MEPS with one.  He then went on to tell me that even if I do get a waiver and can't take an 18X contract, there is still a way of going through the same process.  I was told that I could enlist 11B, and upon completion of OSUT, I could drop my current contract and pick up an 18X one and then go into airborne school and do the whole nine yards that way.  This seems very fishy to me, as I have tried to do extensive research on this topic, and nothing I have seen has confirmed this option/route as it looks like you first must be the rank of E-4 to drop an SF packet.  Any insight on this matter would be appreciated, as I am doing everything I can to achieve my goals, and I'm not trying to have them fudged up because a recruiter wants to blow smoke up my ass.  If this has been posted about already, I apologize for wasting your time, but after two days of scouring the net and this site, I've still come out with no information on whether my recruiter is telling me lies I would like to hear or actually notifying me of a different option I have not been told about.

Thank you for your time guys, I appreciate any help or shove in the right direction.
The Kicker


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## TheKicker (Dec 3, 2016)

I also apologize if this was placed in the wrong forum.  I only resorted to placing it in this one as I had recently seen a similar post here as well.


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## TLDR20 (Dec 4, 2016)

My battle buddy in OSUT had had knee surgery that prevented him from being an 18X. He got an 18X contract in basic and is a SFC(18C) in 1st group. That was over 10 years ago, so I don't know how it would go now.


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## TheKicker (Dec 4, 2016)

So he still went 18x even though he didn't enlist with the contract?  I've never seen that discussed anywhere, but I'll have to keep searching and see if that is still a thing.  If so that'd be awesome giving my circumstances.


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## TLDR20 (Dec 4, 2016)

TheKicker said:


> So he still went 18x even though he didn't enlist with the contract?  I've never seen that discussed anywhere, but I'll have to keep searching and see if that is still a thing.  If so that'd be awesome giving my circumstances.



It is definitely a thing. Of the dudes in my OSUT class that enlisted with an 18X contract, only I went on to SOPC. At least 5 other dudes picked up contracts at OSUT. All 5 of them are Green Berets now....


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## Red Flag 1 (Dec 4, 2016)

H


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## Etype (Dec 4, 2016)

If you are only joining to be in Special Forces, don't do it.  Even if you got an 18X contract from the beginning, there is a good chance you may wind up as an 11B in big army.

Only join if you are truly interested in being a soldier, and less concerned about the specific job.


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## TLDR20 (Dec 4, 2016)

Etype said:


> If you are only joining to be in Special Forces, don't do it.  Even if you got an 18X contract from the beginning, there is a good chance you may wind up as an 11B in big army.
> 
> Only join if you are truly interested in being a soldier, and less concerned about the specific job.



To caveat, the majority of guys don't make it.  Many realize in OSUT that the military isn't as glamorous as they thought it would be, and the thought of years of misery doesn't appeal anymore. 

Like I said above all of the dudes in my OSUT company that joined with an 18X contract gave the contract up or didn't meet the standards except for me. From 20-1 just in OSUT. We had a few dudes pick up contracts in basic, maybe 10, 5(including me) made it to group. So from 30ish to 5. That is an 84% attrition rate. Most attrition rates for 18X only take into account SOPC-forward. 

Also 18X's don't automatically end up as 11B's these days. Needs of the Army is real and happening. No more going to 82nd, there is a very high >80% chance you will end up a truck driver in Ft.Bumfuck if you don't make it, that includes getting injured...


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## TheKicker (Dec 4, 2016)

According to the rquirements, it looks like I should be able to go in without a waiver due to the fact that I meet all the mobility and functionality reps.  Thank you all for the awesome information, I appreciate it.  As for "just wanting to be Special Forces" I want to join to military to serve my country and become soldier.  But in addition, I want to be the best there is.  Although walking around with a beret of green and a special knife is no doubt incredible and a testament of your abilities and training, I personally am striving to be a part of a group that is bigger than myself or anyone of us alone, and Because of that, I want to be in the most trained and specialized group there is.  Regrets suck, and I don't plan on looking back on it when I'm 80 and kick myself in the ass because I knever became all I could be.


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## SilentSponge (Dec 6, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> My battle buddy in OSUT had had knee surgery that prevented him from being an 18X. He got an 18X contract in basic and is a SFC(18C) in 1st group. That was over 10 years ago, so I don't know how it would go now.


I'm in a somewhat similar situation. I have a vision waiver for an astigmatism which prevents me from securing option 18x or opt 40 and I wanted to know

Does this apply to Rangers as well?
How likely am I to pickup an 18x/opt 40 during OSUT/BCT percentage wise with a high GT and 270 PFT?
I've been looking at enlisting as 35M/F, 68W, or 11X, how much does my MOS selection matter if looking to pickup 18 or 40 during initial training?


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## policemedic (Dec 6, 2016)

SilentSponge said:


> I'm in a somewhat similar situation. I have a vision waiver for an astigmatism which prevents me from securing option 18x or opt 40 and I wanted to know
> 
> Does this apply to Rangers as well?
> How likely am I to pickup an 18x/opt 40 during OSUT/BCT percentage wise with a high GT and 270 PFT?
> I've been looking at enlisting as 35M/F, 68W, or 11X, how much does my MOS selection matter if looking to pickup 18 or 40 during initial training?



Speaking purely from a light infantry--not SOF--standpoint, a 270 APFT is entirely unimpressive.  SOF standards are high. That's not a dig; it's just motivation to work harder.


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## TLDR20 (Dec 6, 2016)

SilentSponge said:


> I'm in a somewhat similar situation. I have a vision waiver for an astigmatism which prevents me from securing option 18x or opt 40 and I wanted to know
> 
> Does this apply to Rangers as well?
> How likely am I to pickup an 18x/opt 40 during OSUT/BCT percentage wise with a high GT and 270 PFT?
> I've been looking at enlisting as 35M/F, 68W, or 11X, how much does my MOS selection matter if looking to pickup 18 or 40 during initial training?



You can only go 18X from 11 series OSUT. 

Option 40 is different. The Ranger Recruiter came to airborne to recruit dudes so I'm sure you can pick it up at some point.


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## WasNeverHere (Dec 12, 2016)

Disclaimer: I am not now, not have I ever been in any SOF MOS, I have been out of the Army for 30 yrs.

As a father of sons, I will give you MY rules for dealing with any recruiter:

1) Never believe anything that isn't written in your contact.

2) Never sign the contract until a 3rd party sincerely invested in your future welfare (preferable a supportive senior relative and/or attorney) has an opportunity to review and discuss it with you.

3) Whenever dealing with a recruiter, always keep in mind that you are dealing with a process only slightly more civilized than the Shanghai method of 16th century nautical induction for "recruiting" young sailors.

3) The recruiter is NOT your friend.

4) Do your homework, and get exactly what YOU want (after doing ALL your homework, to make sure it's REALLY what you want), or walk away and find a recruiter who'll guarantee it to you -- in writing!


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## Gunz (Dec 12, 2016)

82DABN43E1P said:


> *3) Whenever dealing with a recruiter, always keep in mind that you are dealing with a process only slightly more civilized than the Shanghai method of 16th century nautical induction for "recruiting" young sailors.*





That's beautiful. 

Wish I had a dollar for every Marine infantry 03 who ended up humping 90lbs of gear through the boondocks who claimed to have been defrauded out of "Guaranteed Aviation" by their hometown recruiter.


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## Tiger87 (Jan 25, 2017)

So if you're disqualified from 18x at MEPS, but are offered the contract at OSUT, is it safe to assume they're now willing to waive the condition that disqualified you to begin with?


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## Tiger87 (Mar 16, 2017)

Tiger87 said:


> So if you're disqualified from 18x at MEPS, but are offered the contract at OSUT, is it safe to assume they're now willing to waive the condition that disqualified you to begin with?



Any thoughts on this question?


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## TLDR20 (Mar 16, 2017)

Tiger87 said:


> Any thoughts on this question?



Yes. Once you are in it is different.


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## suaveflooder (Mar 17, 2017)

I just went through this as well, but I needed an age waiver (I aged out from the army by two days....MEPS had some of my some paperwork for three months without picking it up and with the holidays and restriction on shipping out after MEPS....I just missed my timeframe).

I AM NOT SF AND HAVE NEVER SERVED IN THE MILITARY, but this is my recent experience (January)

WasNeverHere nailed it on the head.  Do your own research, and don't rely on the recruiter.  I caught mine a couple times giving me wrong information (he told me I could submit a SF packet in 3 months).  If you can't get an 18x contract, you DO need to be an E4 before you can drop an SF packet.  Maybe someone can chime in on this because I never pursued it, but I was told I could do the physical early to cut out some of the wait time, but this could have been more recruiter BS.  Also, TLDR20 is correct.  Once you are in, it's easier to get the waiver you need.  I had a couple friends get them after they got in....that being said, one failed out, and the other hurt his back on a jump and is no longer in (he was never deployed)


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## Tiger87 (Mar 17, 2017)

suaveflooder said:


> I just went through this as well, but I needed an age waiver (I aged out from the army by two days....MEPS had some of my some paperwork for three months without picking it up and with the holidays and restriction on shipping out after MEPS....I just missed my timeframe).
> 
> I AM NOT SF AND HAVE NEVER SERVED IN THE MILITARY, but this is my recent experience (January)
> 
> WasNeverHere nailed it on the head.  Do your own research, and don't rely on the recruiter.  I caught mine a couple times giving me wrong information (he told me I could submit a SF packet in 3 months).  If you can't get an 18x contract, you DO need to be an E4 before you can drop an SF packet.  Maybe someone can chime in on this because I never pursued it, but I was told I could do the physical early to cut out some of the wait time, but this could have been more recruiter BS.  Also, TLDR20 is correct.  Once you are in, it's easier to get the waiver you need.  I had a couple friends get them after they got in....that being said, one failed out, and the other hurt his back on a jump and is no longer in (he was never deployed)



I don't think you have to be E4 before you can drop the SF packet. Just have to be 21 years old. My son entered as a 22-year old E3, and the SF liaison was on him all through OSUT and Airborne to switch his 11x-option 40, for the 18x.


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## medicchick (Mar 17, 2017)

Tiger87 said:


> I don't think you have to be E4 before you can drop the SF packet. Just have to be 21 years old. My son entered as a 22-year old E3, and the SF liaison was on him all through OSUT and Airborne to switch his 11x-option 40, for the 18x.


Nope, once you are in the Army (MOS Q'd) you need to be an E-4.


> *Additional criteria exclusive to enlisted applicants:*
> 
> 
> Enlisted applicants must be in the pay grade of E-4 to E-7. Successful completion of SFAS is a prerequisite to the SFQC.



Recruitment Criteria


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## TLDR20 (Mar 17, 2017)

Tiger87 said:


> I don't think you have to be E4 before you can drop the SF packet. Just have to be 21 years old. My son entered as a 22-year old E3, and the SF liaison was on him all through OSUT and Airborne to switch his 11x-option 40, for the 18x.



That isn't accurate anymore. There was a time when you could go as a PFC, but it has passed.

You can however go as a PFC 18X...


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## suaveflooder (Mar 17, 2017)

Tiger87 said:


> I don't think you have to be E4 before you can drop the SF packet. Just have to be 21 years old. My son entered as a 22-year old E3, and the SF liaison was on him all through OSUT and Airborne to switch his 11x-option 40, for the 18x.



That's awesome!  I was going to be going in as an E3 as well.  No idea if it was because of my age (I did not qualify for 18x), and I could find very little information other than the 18x program as far as actually joining.  The two guys I knew who actually went through the program (or attempted to in one case) both went in as an 18x.  My recruiter was telling me something similar to what is happening to your son.  He told me to start the forms right after basic and get the physical done before I became an E4.

Hopefully someone who is SF will chime in here


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## suaveflooder (Mar 17, 2017)

Well, there you go.  I responded too late.  Thank you for the information, medicchick and TLDR20


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## TheKicker (Apr 1, 2017)

What requirements would need to be met in order to pick up 18x (or op40 for the ranger hopefuls out there) while in basic/ait? As in, if a recruiter was to come around and ask for volunteers in OSUT or if I was to ask for one, what prerequisites/ standards would I (or anyone for that matter) need to have exceeded?


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## TheKicker (Apr 1, 2017)

And by going that route not require me to be an E-4?  Is the E-4 requirement only for the guys who have finished their MOS qualification training and then decide they want to go SF?  Thanks for the awesome responses everybody, y'all are incredible.


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## Tiger87 (Apr 3, 2017)

So if I piece together what my E3 son told me - the SF liaison at OSUT was all over him wanting to get him on 18x - with the info posted here that you have to be E4 once you're in...then I come to the conclusion that the "E4 waiver" will only work prior to OSUT graduation. The liaison "recruited" 8 of them in OSUT. None were E4. All were over 21 years old. Not sure about the others, but my son had already 18X qualified on ASVAB before enlisting. All the guys had qualified as Expert marksman, and all had maxed out 300 on APFT. Most of the guys had 11x option 40, and they stayed with that.


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