# Taliban Need A "time Out?"



## Marauder06 (Nov 27, 2010)

A possible indicator that our strategy in Afghanistan may be showing fruit- Taliban returning to Pakistan and asking for a break from the fighting.

http://www.newsweek.com/2010/11/27/taliban-we-need-a-time-out.html#



> ... A group of 17 ground commanders recently traveled to the Pakistani frontier city of Quetta to meet with one of their top military chiefs, Abdul Qayum Zakir, say four Taliban officials who didn’t want to be named for safety reasons.
> 
> The commanders informed Zakir that they and their men were temporarily suspending combat operations and asked that he either transfer them to less hotly contested areas or let them recover in Pakistan until the spring thaw. “We have lost many friends and commanders,” one member of the delegation told Zakir, says Mullah Salam Khan, a midlevel commander in Helmand province who was briefed on the meeting by a participant. “We are tired and want to take a rest.” Zakir, says Khan, acknowledged their complaint—but said he needed the commanders to help him keep up at least a harassing presence in their areas so villagers could see that the insurgents are not on the run. They promised to do what they could. ...



Thoughts?


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## pardus (Nov 27, 2010)

Meaningless.

They'll be back in the spring ready to rock and roll refurbed, and be spent again at the end of hunting season in the fall, ad nauseum...


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## QC (Nov 27, 2010)

Agreed


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## AWP (Nov 27, 2010)

FAIL

Press them, push them, allow them no rest, destroy them.

The Vietnamese did this to us, Al Q did this in Tora Bora, this tactic isn't new.

Press them, push them, allow them no rest, destroy them.


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## Marauder06 (Nov 27, 2010)

Freefalling said:


> FAIL
> 
> Press them, push them, allow them no rest, destroy them.
> 
> ...



I concur, and I think that was a major contributing factor to the ass whipping AQ took in Iraq.

The problem is that unlike Iraq, our enemies in Afghanistan enjoy protected sanctuary in an adjacent country.  This is what happened to us in Korea and in Viet Nam.  If you give an insurgency a sanctuary, they can just wait you out...


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## pardus (Nov 27, 2010)

Freefalling said:


> FAIL
> 
> Press them, push them, allow them no rest, destroy them.
> 
> ...



Nice in theory and agreed, but we can't press/push them in Pakistan... So meaningless...

Our commanders decided a long ago that they didnt want us to win and set us up so, might as well accept that or start a revolt here.


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## AWP (Nov 27, 2010)

Drones are our only option in Pakistan (and I think we all know what I think about Pakistan).

But on this side of the border? The ass whipping they took to put them in that position has to continue. They didn't exist in this country on their own, they had help and I doubt their support staff is going to Pakistan with them.

Kill their leadership in Pakistan, destroy or marginalize their sanctuaries here in Afghanistan.....give them no shelter.


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## Marauder06 (Nov 27, 2010)

India.


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## AWP (Nov 27, 2010)

Marauder06 said:


> India.



You have no idea how happy that would make me.


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## pardus (Nov 27, 2010)

Ive been an advocate of releasing India for some time, it is the obvious answer.

Drones? A nice tool, but tools don't win wars.


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## Marauder06 (Nov 27, 2010)

You're absolutely right.  "Fire" weapons are almost never decisive on their own (the only exception I can think of is nukes).  You need "shock" weapons to finish the fight if you're looking to occupy/stabilize the ground.

Relying on fire weapons alone in a counterinsurgency is like snipers in Call of Duty*- they're useful sometimes and you can rack up the kills, but your team is never going to win until you get in there and mix it up in close quarters.



*I'm referring to the old school CoD/CoDUO, I have no idea how the game is played now.


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## AWP (Nov 27, 2010)

Given the current political state, drones are our only option.

I think if President Maruader06 or Dictator Freefalling were in charge "Pakistan" would exist as provinces in Afghanistan and India with the Indus as an international border. Pakistanis have a national identity similar to the Seminole tribe in south FL....


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## pardus (Nov 27, 2010)

Did you seriously mention a computer game in a strategic discussion?
Push Sir!

In COIN your team is never going to win unless they identify and assimilate to a certain degree with your insurgents.

I dispare often when I hear American views on COIN...


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## Marauder06 (Nov 27, 2010)

Yeah, I'm not a real big fan of Pakistan right now.

Maybe we bought enough loyalty with that $2B package that we'll be able to make some progress in Afghanistan... I'm not sure though.

Maybe we bought enough "look the other way" time to take out the Quetta Shura leaders and the HQN.  That would go a long way towards disrupting the insurgency, heck it would probably help Pakistan out in the long run too.  Those fanatical Islamists they're protecting aren't going to evaporate the day we leave Afghanistan, and Peshawar is a lot closer than Mumbai for anyone who wants to get their martyrdom on...  just sayin'...


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## Marauder06 (Nov 27, 2010)

pardus said:


> Did you seriously mention a computer game in a strategic discussion?
> Push Sir!
> 
> In COIN your team is never going to win unless they identify and assimilate to a certain degree with your insurgents.
> ...




Just trying to relate to my audience ;)  I guess you didn't see the PowerPoint puppet show I did last night...


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## pardus (Nov 27, 2010)

Fuck my life.
I could win this war within 12 months if allowed to...


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## scout7 (Jan 17, 2011)

Lets do it Pardus!!!!


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## Teufel (Jan 17, 2011)

Time outs aren't that effective for my toddler, I don't see why they would work with the Taliban.  By the way if anyone is looking for Osama Bin Laden, he is currently hiding inside of my 2 year old.


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## Mac_NZ (Jan 17, 2011)

Teufel said:


> Time outs aren't that effective for my toddler, I don't see why they would work with the Taliban.  By the way if anyone is looking for Osama Bin Laden, he is currently hiding inside of my 2 year old.



Glad to see I'm not the only father who thinks his toddler is a terrorist.


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## Diamondback 2/2 (Jan 17, 2011)

Free has hit the nail on the head.

My daughter is perfect, she knocked a bigger little boy down at the park twice  b/c he would not leave her and her friends alone (wanted to play with them). My wife thought it was bad, I got her ice cream... ;)


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## Manolito (Jan 17, 2011)

Times have changed my Dad took a time out from his busy schedule to beat my Ass.


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