# Interservice transfer/Resigning Commission to apply to SF?



## Ideal Paradigm (May 18, 2013)

I am currently serving in the US Navy as an Officer. I would like to have to opportunity to join the SF community. From what I understand, I have done research and it is possible to resign a commission and then enlist to go SF. However, every single case that I have found did not involve an interservice transfer. They were all one of the following variations:

1. Active duty Army Officer resigning commission and joining active duty SF.
2. Active duty Army Officer resigning commission and joining National Guard SF.
3. National Guard Officer resigning commission and joining SF through active duty.
4. National Guard Officer resigning commission and joining National Guard SF.

My issue is that as an Officer I have an 8 year minimum service commitment, where I can spend 4 years of active duty, and then 4 years in the inactive ready reserve. Going through selection, for the most part is a young man's game, so I would like to go as early as possible. I'm currently 25, and after my active duty time, I will be very close to 27. After 4 more years of the inactive ready reserve, I would be 30-31 years of age (although I know it is possible to pass selection as this age, since it has been done before).

I believe I would be a good candidate because I have language potential in both Mandarin Chinese and Spanish. I am also aware and understand that I would have to enhance these capabilities further in order to be competitive.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, as I would like to find a way to join SF. I'm very interested in 18D in particular, as my major in college was medically related. Thank you for your time.


----------



## Crusader74 (May 18, 2013)

Why not the SEALs?


----------



## Ideal Paradigm (May 18, 2013)

Irish said:


> Why not the SEALs?


 
The next application window is March 2014, and I will be pinning on LT in June of 2014. The chances of me being accepted as a LT are very low because I will be too senior to hit critical career milestones in the community. I desire for a fresh start, where I could possibly serve out a career. I don't want to be too ambitious by assuming that I would serve a career in SF, as I'm trying to focus on the 25m target currently, which is my current job as a Naval Officer. But I'm also doing my best to plan for the future in an area in which I would like to serve. Please let me know if I need to add any more clarification. Thank you.


----------



## Crusader74 (May 18, 2013)

Ideal Paradigm said:


> The next application window is March 2014, and I will be pinning on LT in June of 2014. The chances of me being accepted as a LT are very low because I will be too senior to hit critical career milestones in the community. I desire for a fresh start, where I could possibly serve out a career. I don't want to be too ambitious by assuming that I would serve a career in SF, as I'm trying to focus on the 25m target currently, which is my current job as a Naval Officer. But I'm also doing my best to plan for the future in an area in which I would like to serve. Please let me know if I need to add any more clarification. Thank you.


 
Have you spoken to a(SF) recruiter yet? if you haven't, I suggest you do, to properly go through your options. Are you sure you want to resign your Commission considering the huge failure rate in SFAS?

I personally have never heard of an AD/NG Army Officer going enlisted to go to SFAS as they have a defined route. I strongly suggest a Recruiter.. Or maybe one of our SF members could chime in..


----------



## Teufel (May 19, 2013)

A friend of mine went from Navy surface warfare Lt to enlisted Sgt in the 19th SF group.  He's a SSgt now I believe.  He made it through the Q course and eventually went active duty.  Not a common story.


----------



## AWP (May 19, 2013)

The short answer: it is possible though the quantity of aligned stars necessary for such an event are unknown to me.



Irish said:


> I personally have never heard of an AD/NG Army Officer going enlisted to go to SFAS as they have a defined route. I strongly suggest a Recruiter.. Or maybe one of our SF members could chime in..


 
A couple of things to consider:
1) Some SOF Officer slots have narrow windows for applicants. I know that Army SF requires you to be in a certain Year group (commissioning year) to apply for the SF Officer route.
2) The enlisted have no such window to worry about.
3) Sometimes, being an O isn't what you expected. I speak from experience....

I can't speak for an AD to AD interservice transfer and to go from O to NCO, but it wasn't terribly uncommon in the Guard.

Ideal Paradigm, Google the SORB website. They handle AD recruiting for the Army. You might be able to reach out to them with your unique circumstances and find some more concrete answers. I konw of at least one Army O-3 who resigned his commission to enlist in the AF as a CCT candidate and he made it. Keep pushing and good luck.


----------



## Ranger Psych (May 19, 2013)

Well, as a flip side... I have a bro that was a NG O-3... resigned his shinys, came to Regiment... went to the other Regiment with his new hat color... decided to go back through to get recomissioned... did time as whatever wherever, and is on his second trip through the Q right now, as an O.

So things can happen. Heard of odder things, honestly.


----------



## Crusader74 (May 19, 2013)

So if you do resign your Commission as an Officer, does it depend on what rank you were as an Officer, determine what rank you're going to be as an NCO? Freefalling Ranger Psych


----------



## DA SWO (May 19, 2013)

Resigning and enlisting (in the ANG/NG) may be the easiest route.

CA and OR both have units, though getting a slot may not be easy.


----------



## Soldado (May 19, 2013)

I've heard about some people in my army whom went to the Navy's Special Operation Forces, but just for the courses(Marine Commando Course or Special Operations Forces Course).


----------



## AWP (May 20, 2013)

Irish said:


> So if you do resign your Commission as an Officer, does it depend on what rank you were as an Officer, determine what rank you're going to be as an NCO? Freefalling Ranger Psych


 
I know Army OCS grads are promoted to E-6/ SSG just before graduation, even if that wasn't their previous rank. I think (not 100% sure) prior enlisted would drop to their pre-OCS rank (not the E-6 unless they were already that or higher). Non-PE would enter as an E-4 or maybe an E-5 (Enlistees with a 4-year degree used to or still enlist as an E-4)


----------



## AWP (May 20, 2013)

Soldado said:


> I've heard about some people in my army whom went to the Navy's Special Operation Forces, but just for the courses(Marine Commando Course or Special Operations Forces Course).


 
Joint crosstraining is common in most militaries, but completing a course doesn't entitle one to an automatic branch transfer (Army to AF for example).


----------



## Soldado (May 20, 2013)

Freefalling said:


> Joint crosstraining is common in most militaries, but completing a course doesn't entitle one to an automatic branch transfer (Army to AF for example).


 
This happen in your Military? Soldiers to Navy Seals or soldiers to Pararescuemen?


----------



## AWP (May 20, 2013)

Soldado said:


> This happen in your Military? Soldiers to Navy Seals or soldiers to Pararescuemen?


 
Other branches going to say...Ranger School happens. Soldiers and some SEALs to the Marine Scout Sniper course. As to portions of a SOF pipeline, some medics take a course which is a portion of the SF Medical Sergeant's Q Course, but that doesn't make them an 18D. You can be a JTAC, but if you wanted to transfer to the Air Force as a TACP it wouldn't happen.

So there's overlap in some individual courses, probably the initial pipelines as well....but it isn't common.

As to a.... say Ranger becoming a SEAL or an SF Med. SGT becoming a PJ, that has happened, but they go through the entire course. Being a prior Ranger doesn't allow one to skip portions of BUD/S and I know of a few SF Med SGT's who became Pararescuemen, and did the entire course from INDOC to graduation. Same with Marine Recon wanting to be Army SF. Proving yourself in one branch doesn't allow one to skip portions of another branch's selection and training process.


----------



## Teufel (May 20, 2013)

Freefalling said:


> Other branches going to say...Ranger School happens. Soldiers and some SEALs to the Marine Scout Sniper course. As to portions of a SOF pipeline, some medics take a course which is a portion of the SF Medical Sergeant's Q Course, but that doesn't make them an 18D. You can be a JTAC, but if you wanted to transfer to the Air Force as a TACP it wouldn't happen.
> 
> So there's overlap in some individual courses, probably the initial pipelines as well....but it isn't common.
> 
> As to a.... say Ranger becoming a SEAL or an SF Med. SGT becoming a PJ, that has happened, but they go through the entire course. Being a prior Ranger doesn't allow one to skip portions of BUD/S and I know of a few SF Med SGT's who became Pararescuemen, and did the entire course from INDOC to graduation. Same with Marine Recon wanting to be Army SF. Proving yourself in one branch doesn't allow one to skip portions of another branch's selection and training process.


 
I will add that normally most qualifications carry over though.  If you are a dive qualified Recon Marine, your dive qualification should carry over since the combatant dive schools are joint accredited by SOCOM.  I know we had PJs and CCTs in my dive class.  If you went to Ranger school as a Marine no one is going to make you go again if you join the Army.  RASP sure but not Ranger school.


----------



## KwJ (May 26, 2013)

Ideal Paradigm said:


> I am currently serving in the US Navy as an Officer. I would like to have to opportunity to join the SF community. From what I understand, I have done research and it is possible to resign a commission and then enlist to go SF. However, every single case that I have found did not involve an interservice transfer. They were all one of the following variations:
> 
> 1. Active duty Army Officer resigning commission and joining active duty SF.
> 2. Active duty Army Officer resigning commission and joining National Guard SF.
> ...


 





Sir,
     Contact the Special Forces Recruiters at Fort Bragg explain your situation and afterwards explain to your command what it is you are wanting to do. Selection is constantly evolving, and the recruiters know what they are doing however the caveat to all of this is that you do not get a choice as to what MOS you are assigned unless you are a team leader aka 18A.


----------



## KwJ (May 26, 2013)

*Special Forces Recruiting*, *Fort Bragg*, N.C.: (910) 432-1818

unless it has changed


----------



## SURF40 (Aug 13, 2013)

I think I can shed some light on this subject since I've done one of the options listed above. I spent 5 yrs active duty as an infantry officer, then resigned my commission and joined the guard as an E5 and graduated the SFQC as an 18C. I too had an 8 yr mso. After you separate active duty your commission transfers over to the IRR. Once you join another service (active Army or Army NG) this will override your IRR commitment, which is kind of a joke anyway. At least it was for Army IRR, not sure about Navy IRR. If you give up your commission to enlist for SF, you will not be doing an Inter-service transfer. The IST program is for Officers only, if you want to go 18D, you will need to finish your 4 yr active duty obligation or see if the Navy would let you out early to enlist in the Army. If you wanted to stay officer, you would have to complete the paper work for an Inter-service transfer and get Navy approval, then that gets forwarded to Army hrc for approval. Then you would get a branch assignment. I don't believe you can IST directly into SF, (Not positive on this, you need to call IST section at Army HRC) you would need to commission in a regular Army branch, ie Infantry, Armor, MP etc... then wait for your year group for the SF board. If your too senior, you would have to submit an out of yr group packet to SF.....As you can see this could literally take years. All for what, maybe 24 months of team time on an ODA???? Not worth it to me. 
Honestly, the easiest thing for you to do is separate active duty, then join the army National Guard (19th or 20th grp) depending on what state you live in after you separate and join SF that way. You get to pick your MOS and language so you could guarantee your 18D slot. Which is something active duty guys do not have the option to do, they are assigned MOS and language after selection. You will come in as an E5 and, theoretically, if you had everything lined up before you separate, you could be going to selection within a matter of months. You should not have to go to Army basic or anything since they should transfer your navy mos to the closest related army mos. While you're going through the enlistment process into NG you should be talking to the NG SF liaison/training detachment guys for your state. So as soon as your enlisted in the guard you can attend one of the tryouts for SF guard. The biggest down side to this route is you will need a full time job after you graduate the Q course. But you already have a degree, so you'll be better off then most of the enlisted guard guys graduating the Q.
If you wanted to enlist into active duty you need to get in contact with an Army recruiter and try to get an 18X contract. This route would probably be a little trickier, since the active side is stricter on enlistment criteria than the NG. Although, not impossible. I've found in my time in the military, anything is possible with the right form, and the right signature. 
Good luck, hopefully this helped and let me know if you have any other question about the process. I guarantee you it won't be easy, but will be worth it in the end.
P.S.- The "Age" talk is bullshit bro. I had 2 guys in my graduating class in the Q course that were in their 40s. Lots of guys in the Q and SF are in their 30s. 2 of the guys on my team right now went through the Q course in their 40s and a couple guys on my team are pushing 50! It is a young mans game, but most of what SF does is more mental. More so than other units in SOF. If you stay in shape and keep your body healthy anything is possible.


----------



## Crusader74 (Aug 13, 2013)

SURF40 said:


> I think I can shed some light on this subject since I've done one of the options listed above. I spent 5 yrs active duty as an infantry officer, then resigned my commission and joined the guard as an E5 and graduated the SFQC as an 18C. I too had an 8 yr mso. After you separate active duty your commission transfers over to the IRR. Once you join another service (active Army or Army NG) this will override your IRR commitment, which is kind of a joke anyway. At least it was for Army IRR, not sure about Navy IRR. If you give up your commission to enlist for SF, you will not be doing an Inter-service transfer. The IST program is for Officers only, if you want to go 18D, you will need to finish your 4 yr active duty obligation or see if the Navy would let you out early to enlist in the Army. If you wanted to stay officer, you would have to complete the paper work for an Inter-service transfer and get Navy approval, then that gets forwarded to Army hrc for approval. Then you would get a branch assignment. I don't believe you can IST directly into SF, (Not positive on this, you need to call IST section at Army HRC) you would need to commission in a regular Army branch, ie Infantry, Armor, MP etc... then wait for your year group for the SF board. If your too senior, you would have to submit an out of yr group packet to SF.....As you can see this could literally take years. All for what, maybe 24 months of team time on an ODA???? Not worth it to me.
> Honestly, the easiest thing for you to do is separate active duty, then join the army National Guard (19th or 20th grp) depending on what state you live in after you separate and join SF that way. You get to pick your MOS and language so you could guarantee your 18D slot. Which is something active duty guys do not have the option to do, they are assigned MOS and language after selection. You will come in as an E5 and, theoretically, if you had everything lined up before you separate, you could be going to selection within a matter of months. You should not have to go to Army basic or anything since they should transfer your navy mos to the closest related army mos. While you're going through the enlistment process into NG you should be talking to the NG SF liaison/training detachment guys for your state. So as soon as your enlisted in the guard you can attend one of the tryouts for SF guard. The biggest down side to this route is you will need a full time job after you graduate the Q course. But you already have a degree, so you'll be better off then most of the enlisted guard guys graduating the Q.
> If you wanted to enlist into active duty you need to get in contact with an Army recruiter and try to get an 18X contract. This route would probably be a little trickier, since the active side is stricter on enlistment criteria than the NG. Although, not impossible. I've found in my time in the military, anything is possible with the right form, and the right signature.
> Good luck, hopefully this helped and let me know if you have any other question about the process. I guarantee you it won't be easy, but will be worth it in the end.
> P.S.- The "Age" talk is bullshit bro. I had 2 guys in my graduating class in the Q course that were in their 40s. Lots of guys in the Q and SF are in their 30s. 2 of the guys on my team right now went through the Q course in their 40s and a couple guys on my team are pushing 50! It is a young mans game, but most of what SF does is more mental. More so than other units in SOF. If you stay in shape and keep your body healthy anything is possible.



Thank you for your response but please follow the rules and make an intro before you post again.


----------



## SURF40 (Aug 13, 2013)

Roger that. done.


----------



## SURF40 (Aug 13, 2013)

Oh, and for the record, there has not been one day I regret resigning my commission.


----------



## TLDR20 (Aug 13, 2013)

One of my students in the 18D course was an 18A who resigned his commission to stay on a team. He was a National Guard guy as well.


----------

