# North Carolina Raider theft ring



## DA SWO (May 10, 2019)

3rd Raider Bn Marines going full stupid.

Is it safe to say these were support Marines (based on rank) and not Raiders?
Curious that they are not naming them, that is usually part of the get thrown under the bus M.O.

North Carolina Raider theft rings: Marines stole tactical gear, vehicle parts, flashbang grenades, and pawned off some of the loot

From 2016 to 2018 the motor pool and supply warehouse for 3d Raider Battalion aboard Camp, Lejeune North Carolina, were the targets of thieves within the elite commando unit, according to military charge sheets.

The culprits, five Marines with 3d Raider Battalion, managed to steal vehicle parts, military tactical gear, SureFire flashlights and even flashbang grenades in one instance.

More than $300,000 worth of government property was stolen by one group of four Marines in 2017 alone, according to Gunnery Sgt. Lynn Kinney, a spokeswoman with Marine Forces Special Operations Command.

Some of the stolen gear found its way into a local Jacksonville, North Carolina, pawn store, while other gear was sold to an unnamed civilian.

The crime spree involves two separate theft rings, which spanned from 2016 to 2018, according to charge sheets.

Four Marines, who raided the 3d Raider Battalion supply warehouse in 2017, were subject to courts-martial, where the accused Marines pleaded guilty and were sentenced to confinement ranging from five to 28 months, according to Kinney.

The Marines were subsequently demoted in rank and punitively booted from the Corps, Kinney said.

A fifth Marine, who broke into various motor transport lots in 2016, including the 3d Raider motor pool, was also subject to a court-martial, according to details in charge sheets.

Some of the charges included larceny of government property, wrongful sale of military property and obstruction of justice for at least two Marines. 

These actions are not consistent with Marine Forces Special Operations Command values and deter from our priority mission of deploying special operations forces,” Kinney told Marine Corps Times in an emailed statement.

The details of these crimes were laid out in a series of charge sheets obtained by Marine Corps Times via Freedom of Information Act request.

One of the Raider bandit theft rings involved four Marines, two lance corporals and two corporals, all from 3d Raider Battalion.



The names on the charge sheets have been redacted and it’s unknown what jobs those Marines held at Marine Forces Special Operations Command.

For at least a year, the Marines conspired together in some instances to steal equipment from the 3d Raider supply warehouse, and a couple of the Marines also took gear designated for the Defense Reutilization and Marketing Office, or DRMO.

In March 2017, one of the corporals conspired with another lance corporal to steal SureFire Hellfighter Lights — a popular weapon mountable tactical flashlight.

To carry out the crime, the two Marines moved pallets to block the view of a security camera at the 3d Raider supply warehouse. After stealing the tactical flashlights, they sold 13 of the SureFires for $2,600 to an unnamed civilian, according to the charge sheets.

Other instances of theft, which involved the entire gang of four, included loading 72 fixed rifle buttstocks and 130 rifle buttstock subassembly parts into a Marine Corps 7-ton vehicle where the gear was then offloaded into a lance corporal’s personal car.

Those rifle parts were then sold to a civilian in Sneads Ferry, North Carolina.

The four Raider bandits, between the time span of January 2017–January 2018, managed to steal Leatherman multitools, Benchmade knives, SureFire scout lights, SureFire helmet lights, Ka-bars, Gerber knives, recon sleeping systems and Blackhawk rifle slings, charge sheets detailed.

The gear was sold to a civilian in Sneads Ferry.

And around January 2018, two of the Marines loaded 25 pelican cases containing portable solar panels for charging communications gear. That equipment was intended for the DRMO lot, which often houses old or outmoded gear that may be reused again by other units who find use for it.

Around Aug. 1, 2016, and May 2017, one of the Marines, without proper authorization, sold a Leatherman, four Benchmade knives, four Gerbers, one MTech knife, one Ka-bar, three SureFire lights, two SureFire scout lights and one SureFire light with an M93 rail mount to the Jacksonville Park-n-Pawn store.

Two of the Marines attempted to clean up after their crimes, according to charge sheets.

After learning that security cameras at the Raider warehouse may have recorded them stealing the equipment, two of the Marines made an effort to destroy the footage.

Sometime around July and August 2017, at least two of the Marines went to a local Jacksonville Best Buy where they purchased a hard drive.

They then replaced the hard drive connected to the 3d Raider security camera with the newly acquired hard drive. The old hard drive was tossed into a body of water.

The theft ring came crashing down around March 2018 when the command dished out charges to the four Marines for theft of the equipment.

But prior to that, in 2016, another 3d Raider Marine had managed to steal tactical military equipment and vehicle parts from several motor transport lots.

The Marine lance corporal gained entry to one the motor pool lots with a key, and in another instance, he used bolt cutters to cut a chain link fence.

The Marine stole gear from from the 3d Raider motor pool lot and the II Marine Expeditionary Force Headquarters Group motor transport lot.

The lance corporal also used bolt cutters to gain entry to a vehicle lot housing Logistics Vehicle System Replacements, or LVSR, trucks.

Looted gear from the crime spree included flashbang diversionary hand grenades, tool kits, multi-meters, BF Goodrich Baja tires, plate carriers, helmets, M16 magazines, military medical kits, fog lights, wire harnesses, headlights and composite lights.

In all, over the past several years, hundreds of thousands of dollars in tactical gear and vehicle parts have been stolen by Marines, where the 3d Raider warehouse and motor pool lot have been the central focus of the crime sprees.

“We are committed to accountability against any violation the standards we set for our Marines,” Kinney said.


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## Gunz (May 11, 2019)

"These actions are not consistent with Marine Forces Special Operations Command values"

Really?

One thing's for sure...The J-Town Black Market is still healthy and receptive. 

We need another fucking war.


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## AWP (May 11, 2019)

I wonder how many memes OAF will produce...


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## Kraut783 (May 11, 2019)

Mmm....cheap gear on Ebay you say...


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## Hillclimb (May 11, 2019)

Everyone gets a trophy 🙄 everyone is a Raider 🙄

Raiders are E5s out the pipeline. Most likely supply and motor T guys with access and placement.


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## AWP (May 11, 2019)

As a former support guy:

How in the absolute fuck are we 18 years into the GWOT and our respective services can't find a way to assess and select support troops? Sure, you won't find every bad apple, but come on, we can't do better across every branch? Bullshit. Absolute bullshit.

We assess, select, and train the best and then give them whatever for support? We still follow this business model? 1995 is new again...

Clown shoes.


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## DZ (May 11, 2019)

AWP said:


> As a former support guy:
> 
> How in the absolute fuck are we 18 years into the GWOT and our respective services can't find a way to assess and select support troops? Sure, you won't find every bad apple, but come on, we can't do better across every branch? Bullshit. Absolute bullshit.
> 
> ...



You hit the nail on the head. I couldn't agree more.


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## DA SWO (May 11, 2019)

AWP said:


> As a former support guy:
> 
> How in the absolute fuck are we 18 years into the GWOT and our respective services can't find a way to assess and select support troops? Sure, you won't find every bad apple, but come on, we can't do better across every branch? Bullshit. Absolute bullshit.
> 
> ...


Support guys/gals are not viewed as importent to the mission as "operators" are.  So no one gives a rats ass about the quality of support.



Hillclimb said:


> Everyone gets a trophy 🙄 everyone is a Raider 🙄
> 
> Raiders are E5s out the pipeline. Most likely supply and motor T guys with access and placement.


Thanks, this is what I thought.


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## Devildoc (May 11, 2019)

Had I known about this, I go through there enough that I would have picked up a couple items for myself.

In all seriousness, when the drawdown in the desert was happening, it was stupid amazing what you could find in pawn shops and surplus stores. You knew that stuff had to be hot.


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## Florida173 (May 11, 2019)

Depends on the organization. Maybe on the traditional sof side you're seeing a lack of quality support, but putting people through a proper accessions process helps you to a degree, and don't forget we have bad apples at all levels.


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## Teufel (May 11, 2019)

AWP said:


> As a former support guy:
> 
> How in the absolute fuck are we 18 years into the GWOT and our respective services can't find a way to assess and select support troops? Sure, you won't find every bad apple, but come on, we can't do better across every branch? Bullshit. Absolute bullshit.
> 
> ...



There are several guys in the news right now facing murder charges that made it through some of the toughest selection processes in the military.


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## Gunz (May 11, 2019)

AWP said:


> As a former support guy:
> 
> How in the absolute fuck are we _*18 years into the GWOT and our respective services can't find a way to assess and select support troops*_? Sure, you won't find every bad apple, but come on, we can't do better across every branch? Bullshit. Absolute bullshit.
> 
> ...




There's a reason they're called "Lance Criminals."


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## Brill (May 11, 2019)

AWP said:


> As a former support guy:
> 
> How in the absolute fuck are we 18 years into the GWOT and our respective services can't find a way to assess and select support troops? Sure, you won't find every bad apple, but come on, we can't do better across every branch? Bullshit. Absolute bullshit.
> 
> ...



Go..to..hell. 

Airborne is the toughest 10 days in the Army.  No, wait, that’s Air Assault.

Never mind.

Seriously though, 75th RR has their shit wired tight for line or support. That should be the standard (in my opinion) and I do realize some support jobs would be hard to fill, like 35-series, but, again, they have that nut cracked via targeted recruiting and in-unit cross training. 

Prior to the MIB, the majority of OSTs (Ranger “SOT-As) retrained from 11Bs to stay in the Regiment.


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## digrar (May 11, 2019)

We just don't post new soldiers into those units. No one is getting there until they've shown above average competence in their role at a conventional unit, with well above average performance reviews.
 I understand the scale is totally different, but it would be an easy fix, just stop posting in noobs, start posting in motivated high performers.


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## BloodStripe (May 12, 2019)

How much money does screening for support cost? Are you wanting to change the process as a whole by doing more operator type screening processes to select? While SOCOM has a sizable budget, they still do have a budget. Are you willing to degregate other programs to increase the support screening process? 

People are still humans and humans can be fucking stupid. Like @Teufel said, 4 of some of our countries best are under murder investigation of a US citizen. Others are under investigation for war crimes. Hell, even the CG even pushed down a ethics memo a few months ago. SOCOM is great for the ability to be autonomous, but with that comes increased oversight.


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## DZ (May 12, 2019)

Like @digrar said, close SOF support positions to new Soldiers fresh out of training, and create some kind of short screener. 

A lot of the problems we run into is with Soldiers who go to Group fresh out of AIT and develop terrible discipline and work ethic because of the relaxed environment. I think having more mature Support Soldiers would solve a lot of problems.

I used to be a Support guy, so I've seen it from both points of view now.


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## 0699 (May 12, 2019)

Teufel said:


> There are several guys in the news right now facing murder charges that made it through some of the toughest selection processes in the military.


Every organization has their percentages.  There are turds at Blue & Green.  There are also guys in the 333rd National Guard Quartermaster Heavy Truck Bn from Springfield, North Takoma that I would go to war with every day of the week.  You can't judge the stink of the turd by their MOS or unit, but the depth of the crap is hopefully shallower at more "tested" units.


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## Teufel (May 12, 2019)

0699 said:


> Every organization has their percentages.  There are turds at Blue & Green.  There are also guys in the 333rd National Guard Quartermaster Heavy Truck Bn from Springfield, North Takoma that I would go to war with every day of the week.  You can't judge the stink of the turd by their MOS or unit, but the depth of the crap is hopefully shallower at more "tested" units.


It’s a lot easier to assess toughness than character.


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## amlove21 (May 12, 2019)

Teufel said:


> It’s a lot easier to assess toughness than character.


Anyone that has worked at their schoolhouse (any MOS/AFSC/Rate) would probably be able to speak about this very concept for hours. 

I’ve done this very thing for 4 years and I still don’t know a foolproof way to select for character with any certainty.


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## Grunt (May 12, 2019)

amlove21 said:


> Anyone that has worked at their schoolhouse (any MOS/AFSC/Rate) would probably be able to speak about this very concept for hours.
> 
> I’ve done this very thing for 4 years and I still don’t know a foolproof way to select for character with any certainty.



Yep, the problem is...that it often takes time to detect true character. There are those that are outliers and obvious, but those are easy. However, there are plenty of them that you won't really be able to determine without spending a good bit of time with them.

And, time is something that you more often than not don't really have...so you do the best you can with what you have at the time....


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## Devildoc (May 12, 2019)

This isn't unique to SOF, or the military at large.  Almost every organization accept people who end up being shitheads, but can't parse it out in the interview and onboarding process.  

No one has been able to figure out how to separate the shit from the shinola


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## amlove21 (May 12, 2019)

Grunt said:


> Yep, the problem is...that it often takes time to detect true character. There are those that are outliers and obvious, but those are easy. However, there are plenty of them that you won't really be able to determine without spending a good bit of time with them.
> 
> And, time is something that you more often than not don't really have...so you do the best you can with what you have at the time....


The nuances are the bane, as well. 

Some guys play a role. Some guys aren’t the right guy now but could be with time and mentorship you don’t have. Some guys are the wrong guys but know what they need to do to succeed. 

And for some, you literally roll the dice and just sort of hope. 

For as much as we would like it to be the reverse, I’ve found that it’s more art than science.


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## amlove21 (May 12, 2019)

Devildoc said:


> This isn't unique to SOF, or the military at large.  Almost every organization accept people who end up being shitheads, but can't parse it out in the interview and onboarding process.
> 
> No one has been able to figure out how to separate the shit from the shinola



Double like.


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## BloodStripe (May 19, 2019)

Meh, I'd still feel more comfortable leaving my car unlocked in Stone Bay than Felony Creek.


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