# Shotguns....



## Polar Bear (Oct 28, 2011)

I am an idiot when it comes to shotguns. I am looking for something I can build into a "Zombie Gun". I have looked at the Mossberg 930 SPX http://www.mossberg.com/products/default.asp?id=32&section=products but I have read a lot about there QC issues on sights. I have been looking at Remington's but need to know if I can build it. As in change the front and rear sight or add a rear sight...Ghost Ring.  FF has already given me a great site to get tube extenders and since I am a large guy a 28 inch barrel does not mean shit besides maybe making a 10 + 1 shotgun. The other worry is ammo. Can you use buck shot plus slugs at the same time without changing the barrel????

Any input would be great


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## AWP (Oct 28, 2011)

PB, I would change out most factory sights on almost any gun out there. Yes, you can use the same barrel for shot as well as slugs. I don't know if there are special caveats though like barrel life or if you're restricted to certain kinds of slugs.

Our needs are different, but I'm buying a 930 next spring.


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## BravoOne (Oct 28, 2011)

I like the Saiga 12. magazine fed and very reliable.


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## HOLLiS (Oct 28, 2011)

QC and sights........... Some how in my mind those two do not go together. Point Shooting FTW.
Sights have a way of taking a person's wide vision to being myopic.

For QC, I would think more about over all length.

I have several shotgun. My 590 is not like the one they make today. I am not sure about the pistol grip, never used one.

Unless the barrel has a choke, I don't know of any problems with using slugs or shot. Even some of the barrels that are designed for slugs, shot is ok.


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## Polar Bear (Oct 28, 2011)

Freefalling said:


> PB, I would change out most factory sights on almost any gun out there. Yes, you can use the same barrel for shot as well as slugs. I don't know if there are special caveats though like barrel life or if you're restricted to certain kinds of slugs.
> 
> Our needs are different, but I'm buying a 930 next spring.


Have you googled the 930? I was dead set on it but am having second thoughts. Being as big as I am I started thinking about a longer barrel with the longer extension tube.


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## Polar Bear (Oct 28, 2011)

HOLLiS said:


> QC and sights........... Some how in my mind those two do not go together. Point Shooting FTW.
> Sights have a way of taking a person's wide vision to being myopic.
> 
> For QC, I would think more about over all length.
> ...



Front sight bent.....a lot of them



> When I took delivery of my new Mossberg 930SPX everything looked good, but there is only so much you can tell until you have a chance to actually use it. After wasting about $30 worth of Federal Truball rifles slug ammo trying to get the sights zeroed, I determined that the front sight post was not centered at the factory because I had the rear aperture all the way to the left and it still needed more adjustment to get on target.
> 
> An online search will reveal that I'm not the only one who has had this problem. So, I email Mossberg and after 3 days of no response, I call their customer service number. Now, I read another member here did the same thing and they fedexed him a new barrel right away without even waiting for the old barrel in return. However, they told me I would have to send my barrel in to their service center, which actually seems to be part of their Maverick operation in Eagle Pass, Texas. So add $10 shipping to the $30 wasted ammo trying to zero a gun with a factory defect front sight.​
> I checked on the delivery of my barrel and according to the tracking number Mossberg/Maverick received it April 15, 2009. I move on to other concerns in my life and a month later Mossberg finally replies to my initial email about the barrel. The email dated May 16, 2009 says, "Please contact us and we will replace the barrel." Well, that reminded me to call them and check on the status of my returned barrel. The fella who I spoke to asks my name and looks it up, and tells me that my barrel will ship out to me Thurs May 21, 2009.​
> ...



and I read tons of crap like this


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## fox1371 (Oct 28, 2011)

Here are a couple that are a little outside the box to consider...

http://www.keltecweapons.com/news/preview-kel-tec-shotgun-ksg/

http://srmarms.com/store/pc/home.asp





We just got the SRM's in stock and it feels awesome in the shoulder.  Haven't had a chance to take one out yet but I hope to sometime soon.  Also, would just like to throw out the ultimate zombie rifle...

http://www.specializedtactical.com/  ((scroll to bottom))


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## AWP (Oct 28, 2011)

Polar Bear said:


> Have you googled the 930? I was dead set on it but am having second thoughts. Being as big as I am I started thinking about a longer barrel with the longer extension tube.



The competition gun forums I browse have nothing negative to say about the 930, I haven't heard of the sight issue. For auto-loaders Berettas and Remingtons seem to be well regarded. FN's shotgun is supposedly great out of the box, but doesn't respond well to alterations. I can't recall any comments on Winchesters.

If Mossberg wasn't producing a competition version of the 930 (I think they are waiting until SHOT to release it) I would buy a Remington and have it worked on. Berettas are great but I am not spending that coin. Again, my needs differ drastically from yours.


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## Polar Bear (Oct 28, 2011)

Not a fan of kel tec anything....How much does the SRM cost?


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## Polar Bear (Oct 28, 2011)

Freefalling said:


> The competition gun forums I browse have nothing negative to say about the 930, I haven't heard of the sight issue. For auto-loaders Berettas and Remingtons seem to be well regarded. FN's shotgun is supposedly great out of the box, but doesn't respond well to alterations. I can't recall any comments on Winchesters.
> 
> If Mossberg wasn't producing a competition version of the 930 (I think they are waiting until SHOT to release it) I would buy a Remington and have it worked on. Berettas are great but I am not spending that coin. Again, my needs differ drastically from yours.


I love Benelli but and going to spend that much coin either. You where the one that told me about Mossberg. I was bore one day and started doing more research.


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## AWP (Oct 28, 2011)

Research is good, just don't fall victim to paralysis by analysis. :)


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## Seajack (Oct 28, 2011)

I have yet to be disappointed by Benelli. I've got a Nova and an M3, and would gladly recommend both. Very smooth recoil, and I'm not a big guy.


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## fox1371 (Oct 28, 2011)

Polar Bear said:


> Not a fan of kel tec anything....How much does the SRM cost?


Neither am I.  I hadn't even heard of their shotgun until a few days ago, a lot of customers have been looking for them.  I looked them up and they look like they may be zombie worthy.  I'd have to test one out first though haha.

The SRM's have a pretty big price tag on them at just shy of $2000 if I remember correctly.  We sell those cylinders at $200 a pop which is crazy.  Good thing the shotgun comes with 3.  If you wanted to buy one though let me know haha.


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## Polar Bear (Oct 28, 2011)

Freefalling said:


> Research is good, just don't fall victim to paralysis by analysis.



Here is one http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=181864 and I know my problem is I will order it and not buy it from a gun shop. I don't want to fight to get it right


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## Polar Bear (Oct 28, 2011)

Seajack said:


> I have yet to be disappointed by Benelli. I've got a Nova and an M3, and would gladly recommend both. Very smooth recoil, and I'm not a big guy.


 
Thats a lot of coin


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## fox1371 (Oct 28, 2011)

I've had some feeding issues with the Benelli while in the military.  We were shooting hinges and it may have had something to do with shooting something so close to the muzzle that the gases weren't being properly expelled, not sure.  Never had troubles with the Mossburgs pumps though.


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## fox1371 (Oct 28, 2011)

Polar Bear said:


> Thats a lot of coin


Agreed.  Not sure what the employee discount is on them yet.  I'm guessing we'll get around $400 off if any of us decide to pick one up.  I have a long list of other items to purchase first though.


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## Polar Bear (Oct 28, 2011)

fox1371 said:


> Neither am I. I hadn't even heard of their shotgun until a few days ago, a lot of customers have been looking for them. I looked them up and they look like they may be zombie worthy. I'd have to test one out first though haha.
> 
> The SRM's have a pretty big price tag on them at just shy of $2000 if I remember correctly. We sell those cylinders at $200 a pop which is crazy. Good thing the shotgun comes with 3. If you wanted to buy one though let me know haha.



Tell me what Remington that is autoloading and I can change the front sight out and use a ghost ring for the rear sight.


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## Seajack (Oct 28, 2011)

Polar Bear said:


> Thats a lot of coin


Yeah. :sick:

I actually got mine used for half of what it's going for. Being able to switch between semi and pump on the M3 is awesome, though, and worth it IMO. I've beat it up quite a bit throughout hunting, and it has yet to give me issues.


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## Brill (Oct 28, 2011)

Polar Bear said:


> Tell me what Remington that is autoloading and I can change the front sight out and use a ghost ring for the rear sight.



Man, what you need is a MK19!  What the hell are you going to do with your scatter gun anyway?


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## fox1371 (Oct 28, 2011)

Polar Bear said:


> Tell me what Remington that is autoloading and I can change the front sight out and use a ghost ring for the rear sight.


I'm pretty sure you can with an 11-87, or possibly the 1100 tactical.  Not 100% sure though, if you'd like I can check tomorrow at work.


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## skeeter (Oct 29, 2011)

I have to agree with Invisible J. I've never seen an 870 fail and I have more round through mine than most will see in a lifetime. I've seen guys use them for boat paddles duck hunting and try to freeze them into dysfunction, but it never happened. I love the Beretta 391's and they can be modified easily, but they don't function well if you aren't 100% on top of your cleaning. As for your question about slugs and buck shot out of the same gun you should be fine as long as you look for a gun with a Cylinder choke for a fixed choke gun, but most modern shotguns come with screw in chokes and once again just screw in a cylinder choke for the slugs and you are ready to rock. you can also get rifiled barrels for the slugs but they would mess with your buck shot. Hope this helps!


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## policemedic (Oct 29, 2011)

Best shotgun I've ever used was an issued Benelli M4. The only problem with them was they wouldn't cycle less-lethal ammo, but that was related to the lower charge in those rounds (and I suspect it is the same with breaching rounds). Excellent factory ghost ring sights.

For a pump, I'd buy a beat-up Remington 870 or 870P police trade-in and send it to Wilson Combat/Scattergun Technologies for the Remington Steal package http://www.wilsoncombat.com/s_remingtion_steal.htm


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## Mac_NZ (Oct 29, 2011)

I wont use anything apart from an 870 given a choice after owning a 500 and a 590 and carrying a Benelli M4 for work.

Is there any chance you can go to a shotgun club and try out some different models to find the one thats right for you? I know with arms like your's the average shotty is going to feel like a nerf gun.


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## Headshot (Oct 29, 2011)

Too bad you didn't need this a couple of months ago, I had a deal on a Benelli M4 almost NIB for $600 and couldn't find any takers for the guy.  I don't need anymore shotties at the moment or would have purchased it myself.  I'm set up at the Louisville gun show this weekend and will look for something tomorrow and send a pic and text, so keep your phone handy man.


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## Red Flag 1 (Jan 12, 2012)

policemedic said:


> Best shotgun I've ever used was an issued Benelli M4. The only problem with them was they wouldn't cycle less-lethal ammo, but that was related to the lower charge in those rounds (and I suspect it is the same with breaching rounds). Excellent factory ghost ring sights.
> 
> For a pump, I'd buy a beat-up Remington 870 or 870P police trade-in and send it to Wilson Combat/Scattergun Technologies for the Remington Steal package http://www.wilsoncombat.com/s_remingtion_steal.htm


 
I agree with the Remington 870. Thanks for the link to Wilson!

RF 1


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## policemedic (Jan 12, 2012)

Red Flag 1 said:


> I agree with the Remington 870. Thanks for the link to Wilson!
> 
> RF 1


 
No problem.  They're good people.


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## tigerstr (Jan 13, 2012)

Polar Bear said:


> I am an idiot when it comes to shotguns. I am looking for something I can build into a "Zombie Gun". I have looked at the Mossberg 930 SPX http://www.mossberg.com/products/default.asp?id=32&section=products but I have read a lot about there QC issues on sights. I have been looking at Remington's but need to know if I can build it. As in change the front and rear sight or add a rear sight...Ghost Ring. FF has already given me a great site to get tube extenders and since I am a large guy a 28 inch barrel does not mean shit besides maybe making a 10 + 1 shotgun. The other worry is ammo. Can you use buck shot plus slugs at the same time without changing the barrel????
> 
> Any input would be great


 
I am not sure what a "zombie gun" is, googled it and saw a lot of weird stuff.  However I have some experience with various kinds of shotguns. From IPSC type of shooting to competition in clay targets.  Are you shopping for a close quarters home-defence shotgun?  And if so, how much time are you willing to spend training/shooting with it?

Are you looking for something that you can also aim well at distances over 30-40 yards? Do you want an autoloader, or a pump action will do?


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## Polar Bear (Jan 14, 2012)

tigerstr said:


> I am not sure what a "zombie gun" is, googled it and saw a lot of weird stuff. However I have some experience with various kinds of shotguns. From IPSC type of shooting to competition in clay targets. Are you shopping for a close quarters home-defence shotgun? And if so, how much time are you willing to spend training/shooting with it?
> 
> Are you looking for something that you can also aim well at distances over 30-40 yards? Do you want an autoloader, or a pump action will do?


Autoloader 30 40 yards would be nice


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## AWP (Jan 18, 2012)

FWIW on on old thread:

Mossberg is going to release their Jerry Miculek 930 model. He's working the Mossberg booth at SHOT.

Pulled from a thread on another forum:


> Some trigger parts chromed and polished
> Loading port opened up
> Chromed gas system as well.
> Cocked hammer indicator.
> ...


 
MSRP is $715 so I'd think you should be able to buy one for $650-ish.


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## tigerstr (Jan 18, 2012)

Too bad you don’t want a pump, because a Remington 870, even a used one could do just fine and on a very tight budget! 

For an autoloader I would go for a variant of Benelli M-2. 

I understand you are a big guy, but I would not go for a barrel longer than 24 inches because it would be cumbersome to use in enclosed spaces and barrel length has no real impact in shotgun range. 

It is just a matter of what we call a better “sighting plane”.  The longer it is, the better it is, when engaging small very rapidly moving targets (like birds or clay targets), which is not what you intend to do.

If money is a major concern, buy a used  model from the line of M-2.  I would make sure it has a “*comfort stock”* because it reduces felt recoil considerably, which is a big thing when you use heavy loads for buckshot or full power slugs and you plan on shooting quickly round after round. 

Personally, I own an M-2 tactical with a 50cm barrel, an extended magazine and comfort stock and I can vouch for its lightness, accuracy and comfort. 


For a new one, albeit *not cheap at all*, I would suggest this as it seems to be a very good choice from the line (not available in my country yet) The M2 3-gun competition model.

It has recoil reducing features (the comfort stock), lots of chokes, an ergonomic bolt release, a good bolt handle, 8+1 shots, plus other goodies .  Its sort of a dream-shotgun for practical use, but as I said it is not cheap.


Now there is another important aspect I want to touch on. Do you plan on shooting your shotgun like a rifle, properly aiming it, establishing a sight picture etc. or are you willing to go the extra mile and point- shoot it with both eyes open, like a shotgun is supposed to be shot?

If the answer is yes on the second option, then there are some other things to discuss, and maybe you can forget about the ghost ring sight and sights in general, at least out to 30 yards.


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## tigerstr (Jan 18, 2012)

BTW Polar if you check the link, also check the Video on that page.


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## Centermass (Jan 18, 2012)

870 Express - one of the most durable, and dependable scatter guns I've had.

Benelli - if you want what I consider the best auto loader out there.

Just mi dos centavos and change.....


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## Marauder06 (Jan 20, 2012)

tigerstr said:


> I am not sure what a "zombie gun" is, ...?


 

This:



or if we're talking shotguns specfically:


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## tigerstr (Jan 20, 2012)

I see.    In this case I would suggest:








Its good for various levels of threat escalation. I admit its a bit cumbersome and on the heavy side, but as some pointed out, Polar Bear is a big guy 

And as a back up, this






With this... you can also scratch your back!


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## policemedic (Jan 20, 2012)

tigerstr said:


> Now there is another important aspect I want to touch on. Do you plan on shooting your shotgun like a rifle, properly aiming it, establishing a sight picture etc. or are you willing to go the extra mile and point- shoot it with both eyes open, like a shotgun is supposed to be shot?
> 
> If the answer is yes on the second option, then there are some other things to discuss, and maybe you can forget about the ghost ring sight and sights in general, at least out to 30 yards.


 
I agree with most of what you've said, but advocating point shooting a shotgun at 30 yards in a  defensive situation is a little off the mark.  For game shooting, fine; where there are good guy/bad guy targets and high stress, absolutely not.


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## tigerstr (Jan 20, 2012)

policemedic said:


> point shooting a shotgun at 30 yards in a defensive situation is a little off the mark. For game shooting, fine; where there are good guy/bad guy targets and high stress, absolutely not.


 
You are absolutly right. I was just trying to make a broad point about the way a well fitting  (and checked for Point Of Impact etc.)  shotgun can be quickly shot out to certain distances IF you practice with it *consistently*, without elaborate/military sights. Just with the good old "eyeball" as a back sight and a bead front sight.


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