# Two U.S. Navy boats with 10 sailors on board taken into Iranian custody



## Ooh-Rah (Jan 12, 2016)

What the what?!?

BREAKING NEWS: Two U.S. Navy boats taken into Iranian custody


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## Quant (Jan 12, 2016)

Isn't this something that the administration said wouldn't happen with the deal?


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## DA SWO (Jan 12, 2016)

I'll wait for the details to come out.

Esp considering they were in Iranian waters when taken into custody.


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## Kraut783 (Jan 12, 2016)

Iran has done this before.....but it is funny, part of the State of the Union address by Obama is his boasting of the success with the Iranian Government with the Nuclear deal.


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## Dame (Jan 12, 2016)

Every day, a little more of me dies from hatred of the man in our White House.



> News of the incident broke as U.S. President Barack Obama prepared to make his final State of the Union address to the U.S. Congress. Obama, a Democrat, made the Iran accord a centerpiece of his foreign policy, and Republicans vying to succeed him have assailed him over the deal. Americans elect a new president on Nov. 8.
> 
> Iran's semi-official Fars news agency said: "The Revolutionary Guards naval forces seized the American boats two kilometers inside Iranian territorial waters while they were snooping around."



Iran holds 10 U.S. sailors; White House expects prompt return


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## Red Flag 1 (Jan 12, 2016)

Dame said:


> Every day, a little more of me dies from hatred of the man in our White House.
> 
> 
> 
> Iran holds 10 U.S. sailors; White House expects prompt return



You are not alone. In terms of pulling a nation together for a common good, at any level, or subject, Obama is just not doing that, in fact the opposite seems to be his goal. I am very, very worried about his final year in office. Obama has used Executive orders so much, and our government feels so very broken just now. I know how you feel.


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## SpitfireV (Jan 13, 2016)

What do you want, war? Let's see what the facts are first. I'd imagine that will take a couple of days. Maybe they actually WERE in Iranian waters. I've read a report that one- or both, the article wasn't clear (that would be a hell of a coincidence))- had an engine failure, drifted and ran aground. 

But then again, maybe Iran lifted them like they did the RN guys a few years back. Either way I hope they managed to destroy the sensitive stuff on board.


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## TLDR20 (Jan 13, 2016)

This is definitely President Obamas personal fault. He is such a fuck up.


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## DA SWO (Jan 13, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> This is definitely President Obama*'*s personal fault. He is such a fuck up.


to agree or disagree, so hard.


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## racing_kitty (Jan 13, 2016)

SpitfireV said:


> What do you want, war? Let's see what the facts are first. I'd imagine that will take a couple of days. Maybe they actually WERE in Iranian waters. I've read a report that one- or both, the article wasn't clear (that would be a hell of a coincidence))- had an engine failure, drifted and ran aground.
> 
> But then again, maybe Iran lifted them like they did the RN guys a few years back. Either way I hope they managed to destroy the sensitive stuff on board.



I'm guessing you're referring to the USA with your rhetorical question.  From what I've read in the NY Times (not that it's any better than Pravda, but who cares anymore), the stretch of water that they were in is a stretch that's used by both nations for surveillance operations against each other.  From all of the resources that I've read so far, only one boat was having mechanical issues.  While this is just conjecture on my part, finding both boats in Iranian waters looks to me like the Iranians came upon them before the functional craft could successfully hook onto and tow the downed craft back into safe waters.  Since the facts aren't out yet, I don't know.  Even when more facts come out, we're not going to know them all.  Well, not before Katherine Bigelow and her ilk find out, anyway.  

Countries are going to spy on each other for as long as there are governments that want that information.  None of them like it, but they do it anyway, and bitch a little when the guys get caught.  If the US really wanted to start a war, they'd hire me on as Obama's press secretary and speech writer.  It would happen a lot faster than it would over this.


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## SpitfireV (Jan 13, 2016)

Haha I do like your style. And yeah, it was a reference to the guys above. I've made an assumption that there was something sneaky beakey going on but without any evidence who would know. 

It sounds like they're close to getting released though. Iran has agreed to it but I assume they want a few more, ahem, pictures, first.


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## AWP (Jan 13, 2016)

This is also isn't the first time such things have happened, but we're going to blame it on the nuclear accord? I guess that's one way to do it...


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## DA SWO (Jan 13, 2016)

The Iranians will do what everyone but us would do, detain for a short period, then release.


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## Ooh-Rah (Jan 13, 2016)

Both boats happened to have simultaneous malfunctions that caused them to drift into Iranian waters -

"doh kay!  "

-- and at 45 seconds in, someone picked the wrong day to wear white socks!





__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=895560100558609
			




This collection of pics is all over Daily Mail...nice.  What was that Obama was saying about us being '_The most powerful nation on earth...it's not even close'
_
Fucking sailors on their fucking knees.  How does this happen?  How the FUCK can they be so far away from support in those tiny crafts, that "this" happened?


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## DA SWO (Jan 13, 2016)

Ooh-Rah said:


> Both boats happened to have simultaneous malfunctions that caused them to drift into Iranian waters -
> 
> "doh kay!  "
> 
> ...


My understanding is boat #2 was trying to assist.
Details will dribble out over the next few months.


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## x SF med (Jan 13, 2016)

Prayers out for the sailors.


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## Ooh-Rah (Jan 13, 2016)

So now the video does not seem to be working anymore, but I noticed something earlier and it has been bugging me. All of the sailors had passports, and they showed videos of the Iranians going thru the passports.  Granted it has been many years since I've been deployed, but I do not recall ever needing a passport. My military ID was all I ever needed.

Something just does not pass the sniff test.


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## TLDR20 (Jan 13, 2016)

Ooh-Rah said:


> So now the video does not seem to be working anymore, but I noticed something earlier and it has been bugging me. All of the sailors had passports, and they showed videos of the Iranians going thru the passports.  Granted it has been many years since I've been deployed, but I do not recall ever needing a passport. My military ID was all I ever needed.
> 
> Something just does not pass the sniff test.



I always had an official passport.


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## Gunz (Jan 13, 2016)

SpitfireV said:


> What do you want, war?


 
Yes.


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## Red Flag 1 (Jan 13, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> I always had an official passport.



I did that too. It made it much easier on leave and off duty travels througout Europe.


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## Gunz (Jan 13, 2016)

Ooh-Rah said:


> So now the video does not seem to be working anymore, but I noticed something earlier and it has been bugging me. All of the sailors had passports, and they showed videos of the Iranians going thru the passports.  Granted it has been many years since I've been deployed, but I do not recall ever needing a passport. My military ID was all I ever needed.
> 
> Something just does not pass the sniff test.


 

Marines don't need passports.  We just use The Force.


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## Red Flag 1 (Jan 13, 2016)

Ooh-Rah said:


> Both boats happened to have simultaneous malfunctions that caused them to drift into Iranian waters -
> 
> "doh kay!  "
> 
> ...




I hate looking at these pics.


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## Salt USMC (Jan 13, 2016)

And they're out
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/14/w...t-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0



> The sailors’ release was announced shortly before 10 a.m. on an Iranian state-run news channel, IRINN. “The detained U.S. sailors, after it was realized that their entry into Iran’s territorial waters was unintentional, and after the sailors apologized, were released into international waters in the Persian Gulf,” the channel reported, attributing the statement to the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps.


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## Blizzard (Jan 13, 2016)

Red Flag 1 said:


> I hate looking at these pics.


You're really not going to like this video either:
Video shows American sailor apologizing for Iran incident - CNNPolitics.com


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## Ooh-Rah (Jan 13, 2016)

Yeah, @Blizzard - I don't have enough blood pressure pills to even consider watching that.


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## ZmanTX (Jan 13, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> I always had an official passport.



Is it common practice or SOP's to carry passports on operations like these guys?

ZM


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## TLDR20 (Jan 13, 2016)

ZmanTX said:


> Is it common practice or SOP's to carry passports on operations like these guys?
> 
> ZM



I don't know what kind of operation they were on.


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## Red Flag 1 (Jan 13, 2016)

Blizzard said:


> You're really not going to like this video either:
> Video shows American sailor apologizing for Iran incident - CNNPolitics.com



You're right. Of course CNN is front and center. Kerry has his head saying something that we all heard, never happened. Oh don't ya just love the spin, and transparency:-/.


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## TLDR20 (Jan 13, 2016)

DA SWO said:


> to agree or disagree, so hard.



Not one person should have agreed with me, unless they caught my sarcasm.


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## Brill (Jan 13, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> This is definitely President Obamas personal fault. He is such a fuck up.



FINALLY!  We've been waiting for you. Navigate to this:

Donate | Cruz for President


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## DA SWO (Jan 13, 2016)

ZmanTX said:


> Is it common practice or SOP's to carry passports on operations like these guys?
> 
> ZM


Yes, they were going from one country to another.
The arabs love fucking with us, hence the requirement for an official passport.
Qatar (IIRC) requires the tanker crews to process through immigration everytime they take off and land, which means they customs check twice every other day.


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## Brill (Jan 13, 2016)

Putin is laughing his ass off and the US is calling this a diplomatic success! This video just "Trump-ed" all recruiting video snippets that the IS could ever even dream of.

The Democrats just lost all foreign policy debates regarding leadership.


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## TLDR20 (Jan 13, 2016)

lindy said:


> Putin is laughing his ass off and the US is calling this a diplomatic success! This video just "Trump-ed" all recruiting video snippets that the IS could ever even dream of.
> 
> The Democrats just lost all foreign policy debates regarding leadership.



Wait how is this democrats fault, you are losing me.

Those sailors getting captured/taken by another nation is politicians fault? The video of soldiers being detained makes them weak? Should we have had a strike force go rescue them? They were released in less than 24 hours, seems like a pretty good damn job getting them out to me.


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## Salt USMC (Jan 13, 2016)

As a reminder, Britain suffered a similar incident back in 2007: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/24/world/europe/24britain.html
However, in that instance British sailors were _seized_ in contested Iran/Iraq waters, and held for nearly two weeks before being released.
Hell, it happened under similar circumstances in 2004, but those guys were released after three days, albeit without their boat.

Yesterday, we had two riverine boats stray (either accidentally or intentionally) into Iranian waters.  They were detained and released within 24 hours, with all equipment and personnel.  No crazy standoffs, no grand bloviating on either side.  How is that not a diplomatic victory?  If the worst we suffer from this is an embarrassed-looking ensign making a lame apology on TV, then fuck it, I'll take it.


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## Ooh-Rah (Jan 13, 2016)

Deathy McDeath said:


> As a reminder, Britain suffered a similar incident back in 2007: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/24/world/europe/24britain.html



I have to wonder if Daily Mail give Britain similar treatment on their site then?  I've always thought them to be rather pro-America - mayhaps not.


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## Brill (Jan 13, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> Wait how is this democrats fault, you are losing me.
> 
> Those sailors getting captured/taken by another nation is politicians fault? The video of soldiers being detained makes them weak? Should we have had a strike force go rescue them? They were released in less than 24 hours, seems like a pretty good damn job getting them out to me.



No, DEFINITELY not their fault (unless the Nav is a Democrat) but the PERCEPTION of weakness via the DC spin machine; yep, all on the feet of the White House.  The Daily Mail nailed it.

How in hell can SECSTATE call the negotiations a success? The "got lost" and had engine trouble yet were detained overnight?  Why couldn't Kerry simply pick up the phone and simply say "let 'em go now or the nuke deal is dead...or you will be because the IRGC will blame you (the Iranian Foreign Minister) for not letting them get their cash."  Click.

The ONLY thing that is understood n the Middle East is strength. We need to get our turkey back before our daughter is raped.

For those who claim this was a success because it could have been worse, that same logic could be used to say that 9/11 was a success in that our security measures allowed *only* 4 planes to be hijacked, the White House and Capitol were spared, or that some guys "on the back of pickup trucks and twisted souls plotting in apartments or garages" do not pose an existential threat to America.

Yep...clearly a victory.  Good thing Bill just got a hummer vice full "blown" sexual intercourse...saved his presidency.


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## ZmanTX (Jan 13, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> I don't know what kind of operation they were on.


Understood... Either way I'll just wait for more info to come out.


@DA SWO thank you.

ZM


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## Brill (Jan 13, 2016)

Another point of view:

Former Pentagon official to ‘Post': ‘Iran humiliating US with no consequences’

“This is another case of *America demonstrating that it is an unreliable ally and a harmless enemy*,” he added.

“In the Middle East, when people smell weakness, they pounce,” said Rhode.

“Most amazingly from the Iranian point of view,” he continued, “is that they captured these sailors right before Obama’s State of the Union speech, and the president didn’t even mention it.”


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## DA SWO (Jan 13, 2016)

I want to know the details on how they ended up in Iranian Waters.
GPS error would concern me, alot.


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## Ooh-Rah (Jan 13, 2016)

.


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## Queeg (Jan 13, 2016)

Blizzard said:


> You're really not going to like this video either:
> Video shows American sailor apologizing for Iran incident - CNNPolitics.com



What happened to Conduct After Capture?


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## Ooh-Rah (Jan 13, 2016)

PaulD said:


> What happened to Conduct After Capture?



That has been the question bothering me from the beginning.  I think back to the stories of John McCain, all of the Vietnam era stories of resistance to the enemy...and this officer videoed an Apology for "getting lost" ? 
I had a gung-ho Gunny who made us memorize this - especially #3 - so to see these Sailors on their knees, hands behind their heads, and then eating and drinking with the Iranians... - it was just weird, and uncomfortable.

Knowing no more than what has been reported, it sure seems like whomever was in command of those boats gave up on the Code of Conduct awful fast - they had to  know that it was unlikely any harm would come to them - just bugs me.

*Code of Conduct for Members of the United States Armed Forces
I*. I am an American, fighting in the forces which guard my country and our way of life. I am prepared to give my life in their defense.

*II*. I will never surrender of my own free will. If in command, I will never surrender the members of my command while they still have the means to resist.

*III*. If I am captured I will continue to resist by all means available. I will make every effort to escape and aid others to escape. I will accept neither parole nor special favors from the enemy.

*IV*. If I become a prisoner of war, I will keep faith with my fellow prisoners. I will give no information or take part in any action which might be harmful to my comrades. If I am senior, I will take command. If not, I will obey the lawful orders of those appointed over me and will back them up in every way.

*V*. When questioned, should I become a prisoner of war, I am required to give name, rank, service number and date of birth. I will evade answering further questions to the utmost of my ability. I will make no oral or written statements disloyal to my country and its allies or harmful to their cause

*VI*. I will never forget that I am an American, fighting for freedom, responsible for my actions, and dedicated to the principles which made my country free. I will trust in my God and in the United States of America.


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## Queeg (Jan 13, 2016)

After the 2007 HMS Cornwall incident.  The three guys on the far right got it.


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## TLDR20 (Jan 13, 2016)

lindy said:


> No, DEFINITELY not their fault (unless the Nav is a Democrat) but the PERCEPTION of weakness via the DC spin machine; yep, all on the feet of the White House.  The Daily Mail nailed it.
> 
> How in hell can SECSTATE call the negotiations a success? The "got lost" and had engine trouble yet were detained overnight?  Why couldn't Kerry simply pick up the phone and simply say "let 'em go now or the nuke deal is dead...or you will be because the IRGC will blame you (the Iranian Foreign Minister) for not letting them get their cash."  Click.
> 
> ...



Yeah this is totally equatable to 9/11, always a classy thing to compare to.

This was a success because our people are home.  Threats do not always need to be issued. Ruling by ultimatum does not make you strong, it makes you a bully.


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## Centermass (Jan 14, 2016)

Ooh-Rah said:


> .



..?


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## Brill (Jan 14, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> Yeah this is totally equatable to 9/11, always a classy thing to compare to.
> 
> This was a success because our people are home.  Threats do not always need to be issued. Ruling by ultimatum does not make you strong, it makes you a bully.



Typical Democrat-style response: disagree with the facts (logic in this case), attack the person.

I will concede, however, that you are correct. Ruling by ultimatum is bullying are signs of a very weak leader.

Wielding A Pen And A Phone, Obama Goes It Alone


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## Gunz (Jan 14, 2016)

PaulD said:


> What happened to Conduct After Capture?


 

Good question.

Here's a few more: We're not at war with Iran so is "captured" the right word? And is Conduct After Capture applicable under those circumstances? Then again if it's a mere "detainment" why should an American serving officer feel compelled to apologize? Does he have a gun to head? Is he being tortured? Does one have to be so cooperative if he's not being threatened with serious bodily injury or death?

And it seems to me any apology--if deemed diplomatically prudent--should come from DoS.


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## Queeg (Jan 14, 2016)

My take is that even if one is "detained" vice being "captured" they should stick to Rank, Name, SN etc.  To deviate from those responses opens up the detainee to leading questions by the "interrogator"  which could negative follow on effects later.


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## DA SWO (Jan 14, 2016)

PaulD said:


> My take is that even if one is "detained" vice being "captured" they should stick to Rank, Name, SN etc.  To deviate from those responses opens up the detainee to leading questions by the "interrogator"  which could negative follow on effects later.


People assume that they didn't start off that way.
What level of SERE Training did they get?
The media keeps calling them Riverine boats, they look more like Port Security boats to me; different missions, different levels of training.


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## Marauder06 (Jan 14, 2016)

They should have known better than to capture a bunch of sailors...



> “I swear before almighty God that we would never have taken them prisoner if we had known they were sailors,” Iranian Foreign Minister Javad Zarif said in a diplomatic cable to the U.S. State Department. “We have seen things now that our eyes can never unsee.”


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## SpitfireV (Jan 14, 2016)

Not sure which button to press.


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## Diamondback 2/2 (Jan 15, 2016)

So this is nothing more than a WTF moment, some shit went bad, some sailor's got detained for less than 24 hrs, and everyone went home with all their gizmos...put yourself in their shoes for a minute, without the Rambo option, and be glad that our sailors are not being held in some shithole prison for years upon years, for nothing.


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## Ranger Psych (Jan 15, 2016)

DA SWO said:


> People assume that they didn't start off that way.
> What level of SERE Training did they get?
> The media keeps calling them Riverine boats, they look more like Port Security boats to me; different missions, different levels of training.



Those aren't port security boats.


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## RetPara (Jan 15, 2016)

Seriously....   this shocks members here.   For the last few years haven't we run posts tracking how many Navy commanders and command groups have been relieved?  Go back over the last several years you will find that the Navy is very publicly relieving ship & boat Captains, XO's, & CmdMasterChiefs at a rate heretofore unheard of in history. That riverine squadron chain of command, down to the leading PO's of each boat are toast, administratively. The Navy has worse problems now than what was evident in the late 60's-early 70's with their leadership.  There are a LOT of questions that remain, why were they patrolling around the island, granted the IRGC has a base there.  They had 3 M2's, M4's and who knows what else.  What were the ROE? Did one or both have mechanical casualties?  If only one did; then why did not the other boat rig for towing and get the fuck out of Dodge.  They go in pairs for a reason.  Also I thought leaving small boats hanging out there without support ended decades ago...  These boats are smaller than the PT boats of WWII.   I have more questions than outrage right now.


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## Gunz (Jan 15, 2016)

As of now  "undetermined mechanical or navigational problems" and the crews are undergoing "reintegration and debriefing" in Bahrain. Oh, and Kerry says he didn't apologize and the quick release of the crew was due to the nuclear deal.


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## Gunz (Jan 15, 2016)

Marauder06 said:


> They should have known better than to capture a bunch of sailors...
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 14780


 
It's the bongos that give this authenticity


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## pardus (Jan 15, 2016)

Ranger Psych said:


> Those aren't port security boats.



I was cringing watching the salt water splash over the guns.
Badass boats, I was expecting a larger main gun though.


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## AWP (Jan 15, 2016)

What type/ model of Iranian boats rolled up our guys?


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## SpitfireV (Jan 15, 2016)

I can't tell my small craft apart but this footage of the incident should help with the ID.


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## CDG (Jan 15, 2016)

Freefalling said:


> What type/ model of Iranian boats rolled up our guys?



I thought @SkrewzLoose said they were Houdongs.

_In September 1994, 5 variants of the Huangfeng design, named Houdong, were delivered to Iran. Another 5 more were delivered in May 1995. In March 1996, Iran took delivery of the last 5 Houdong FACs. The Houdong were equipped with the long-range C-802 anti-ship cruise missile (120 km range with 700 kg warhead). This brought the Iranian fleet to ten Houdong FACs. Other reports claimed that China sold Iran about 40 Hudong fast attack missile boats and more than 80 C-802 anti-ship cruise missiles during the mid-1990s._

Huangfeng (TYPE 021) - People's Liberation Army Navy


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## Ranger Psych (Jan 15, 2016)

Freefalling said:


> What type/ model of Iranian boats rolled up our guys?



It looked like their little swiftboats with stalins organs ducktape and ratchet strapped to the top like they roll. Could be wrong. 

The simple fact is that while the Iranians sure as fuck aren't our friends, we're also not directly enemies as in a declared war (at least on our side, although DIE USA DIE is a pretty common chant there) so I am hard pressed to see where being on a standard patrol like how they roll, then having engine trouble... I mean, fuck, it had to be some serious shit because generally speaking those boats aren't single engine deals either.  Why they didn't try to tow, or at least state that they had tried? No clue. 

@parallel WHERE ARE YOUUUUUUUUU....


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## AWP (Jan 15, 2016)

CDG said:


> I thought @SkrewzLoose said they were Houdongs.
> 
> _In September 1994, 5 variants of the Huangfeng design, named Houdong, were delivered to Iran. Another 5 more were delivered in May 1995. In March 1996, Iran took delivery of the last 5 Houdong FACs. The Houdong were equipped with the long-range C-802 anti-ship cruise missile (120 km range with 700 kg warhead). This brought the Iranian fleet to ten Houdong FACs. Other reports claimed that China sold Iran about 40 Hudong fast attack missile boats and more than 80 C-802 anti-ship cruise missiles during the mid-1990s._
> 
> Huangfeng (TYPE 021) - People's Liberation Army Navy



Which means they had 25 and or 30mm cannon on board. The whole notion of shooting at the Iranians is a non-starter.


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## SkrewzLoose (Jan 15, 2016)

Indeed, they were huodongs that picked up our guys.


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## Brill (Jan 15, 2016)

Freefalling said:


> What type/ model of Iranian boats rolled up our guys?



Couple of Skeeters with 200hp 4-strokes...word is they got lost en route to the FLW Bassmaster Classic in Dubai but when they saw the Navy boats, they thought they could use explosives to earn the biggest bass purse.


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## Brill (Jan 15, 2016)

No shocker that a Canadian would be the first to get it.  Hat tip to @RackMaster


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## RackMaster (Jan 15, 2016)

lindy said:


> No shocker that a Canadian would be the first to get it.  Hat tip to @RackMaster



We loves us some Bassmasters.


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## Brill (Jan 16, 2016)

I'm happy to see the Americans coming home but this highlights my point about "getting our turkey back".  Iran doesn't even have the $100B yet!

In negotiating to free Americans in Iran, U.S. blinked on new sanctions


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## Salt USMC (Jan 16, 2016)

Yeah, about that...

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/01/1...ear-deal.html?referer=https://www.google.com/


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## Brill (Jan 17, 2016)

An opinion piece that makes one think: are we getting the real story? 

Opinion: Were US sailors 'spoofed' into Iranian waters?


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## AWP (Jan 17, 2016)

lindy said:


> An opinion piece that makes one think: are we getting the real story?
> 
> Opinion: Were US sailors 'spoofed' into Iranian waters?



I had doubts about the article until I saw they confiscated the GPS units. "Drag" some boats into their waters, treat them well and return them in less than a day, and then ask for their 100 billion a few days later?

Not fishy at all.

ETA, and the Iranians release 5 "detainees" yesterday? Lots of goodwill by a country in the doghouse...


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## Marauder06 (Jan 17, 2016)

What the world thinks of the US Navy right now, in one cartoon

"The incident with the two Navy boats was not worth going to war with Iran over.  But if we continue to allow the perception that we are weak, that we lack will and staying power, and that Iran can do whatever it wants in the region, then we are setting ourselves up for big trouble in the future."


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## TLDR20 (Jan 17, 2016)

It is easy to get uppity with a riverine boat, a little different with a carrier battle group.


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## Brill (Jan 17, 2016)

Freefalling said:


> I had doubts about the article until I saw they confiscated the GPS units. "Drag" some boats into their waters, treat them well and return them in less than a day, and then ask for their 100 billion a few days later?
> 
> Not fishy at all.
> 
> ETA, and the Iranians release 5 "detainees" yesterday? Lots of goodwill by a country in the doghouse...



I have zero insight into what did or did not occur IVO Farsi island.  I do consider highly probable that IRGC forces ID'd and tracked the riverine boats with the assumption that capturing them would not lead to military conflict but allow them leverage over the strong probability imposing sanctions after recent missile tests.  I believe the boats were captured in international waters something akin to AGER-2 in '68.

Sailors detained, sanctions delayed, JCPOA enacted, funds released, and BAM!!!! USG drops sanctions against individuals and companies in Iran for violating UN rules.


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## Brill (Jan 17, 2016)

Interesting to point out that Iranian military fires off a ballistic missile yet *individuals and corporations associated with weapons procurement/development*, NOT the Iranian government, *are held responsible by the USG!*

That would be like MSF holding Lockheed Martin accountable for the strike in Kunduz, AF.:-/


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## SpitfireV (Jan 17, 2016)

What? The USG was enforcing UN sanctions against Iran.


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## SkrewzLoose (Jan 17, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> It is easy to get uppity with a riverine boat, a little different with a carrier battle group.


Exactly! Wish I could agree more.


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## Gunz (Jan 17, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> It is easy to get uppity with a riverine boat, a little different with a carrier battle group.


 
And yet...

US Navy releases video of Iran firing rockets near a US aircraft carrier


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## Marauder06 (Jan 17, 2016)

They know we're desperate for this deal and they can do pretty much anything they want.


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## SkrewzLoose (Jan 18, 2016)

Rockets being launched at anyone going through the SOH is not news at all. That shit happens all the time. The pucker factor is always high during that transit.

ETA: Launching rockets _near_ or IVO the HST, not _at_ her.


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## Brill (Jan 18, 2016)

Now press is reporting three Americans kidnapped in Baghdad but taken to Sadr City, a very well known Shia "neighborhood".


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## Gunz (Jan 18, 2016)

SkrewzLoose said:


> Rockets being launched at anyone going through the SOH is not news at all. That shit happens all the time. The pucker factor is always high during that transit.
> 
> ETA: Launching rockets _near_ or IVO the HST, not _at_ her.


 

Right, but poking the tiger with a stick just the same.


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## Ooh-Rah (Jan 18, 2016)

Okay...now they everyone has their sanitized story straight, I'll wait a week and get the updated version of the sanitized story. 

In_ its first official account of Iran's detention of 10 U.S. sailors in the Persian Gulf, the U.S. military said Monday that Iran took SIM cards for two satellite phones_.

US military releases 1st account of sailors' Iran detention


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## DA SWO (Jan 18, 2016)

TLDR20 said:


> It is easy to get uppity with a riverine boat, a little different with a carrier battle group.


Like conducting a live fire exercise within 1000 yards?



Ocoka One said:


> And yet...
> 
> US Navy releases video of Iran firing rockets near a US aircraft carrier





Marauder06 said:


> They know we're desperate for this deal and they can do pretty much anything they want.



Iran knows Obama won't do anything and views him as weak (or complacent).  I actually think Biden would be better in this situation.

They need the deal approved money released before November, because I can't see anyone else (Republican or Democrat) thinking this is a good deal.


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## parallel (Jan 21, 2016)

Ranger Psych said:


> ***snip***
> 
> @parallel WHERE ARE YOUUUUUUUUU....


I've been busier than a cat coving shit on a marble floor.

As for my take on this incident? Early on I was coming up with theories that would give those crews the benefit of the doubt but its not looking good. Even so, I'm not buying the "official" story, but without any reliable info all I can say is none of it makes sense. By the way... those crews are NOT SWCC but are instead RIVRON.


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## Ranger Psych (Jan 21, 2016)

Well, that might better explain things.


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## Brill (Jan 23, 2016)




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## Brill (Jan 31, 2016)

Iran give medals to Iranian commanders who detained US sailors. I wonder what Iran received from the USG to feel the need to honor their commanders?

Iran gives medals for capture of U.S. sailors


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## SkrewzLoose (Jan 31, 2016)

They should totally join the USN. We give out medals for filling snack machines and chipping paint, so much less work!!


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## DA SWO (Jan 31, 2016)

SkrewzLoose said:


> They should totally join the USN. We give out medals for filling snack machines and chipping paint, so much less work!!


My brother'd be having an aneurysm if he heard that.


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## SkrewzLoose (Jan 31, 2016)

That would fall under the category of "stories I could tell". I've seen both of those happen on more than one occasion, Sir.


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## Gunz (Feb 1, 2016)

lindy said:


> Iran give medals to Iranian commanders who detained US sailors. I wonder what Iran received from the USG to feel the need to honor their commanders?
> 
> Iran gives medals for capture of U.S. sailors




We should've killed every one of these Persian bastards after the last hostage came home in 1981. Or bombed the living shit out of them as payback. The one country we needed to go to war with and didn't.


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## Salt USMC (Feb 1, 2016)

Ocoka One said:


> We should've killed every one of these Persian bastards after the last hostage came home in 1981. Or bombed the living shit out of them as payback. The one country we needed to go to war with and didn't.


Well, the chemical weapons and other arms we sold to Sadaam certainly did a number on them from 1980-88.


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## Flagg (Feb 1, 2016)

Deathy McDeath said:


> Well, the chemical weapons and other arms we sold to Sadaam certainly did a number on them from 1980-88.



I thought it was the Germans who almost exclusively hold responsibility for the Iraqis duel use tech pesticide/nerve agent WMD plants?

I thought the US only sold a few helos to Iraq and facilitated spare parts and Int.

But a crapton of weapons to Iran(Iran/Contra).

All for the purpose of both Iran and Iraq killing each other better so that no one wins and both sides lose as much as possible.


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## AWP (Feb 1, 2016)

We primarily gave them money and intel, but sent them a bunch of "dual use" compounds like anthrax and insecticides.


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## Gunz (Feb 1, 2016)

Deathy McDeath said:


> Well, the chemical weapons and other arms we sold to Sadaam certainly did a number on them from 1980-88.




Well, he left a few...and they been yankin our chain.


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## Ooh-Rah (May 12, 2016)

Hmmm...have to admit that I was not expecting this.

Navy officer fired after crew 'misnavigated' into Iran


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## DA SWO (May 12, 2016)

Ooh-Rah said:


> Hmmm...have to admit that I was not expecting this.
> 
> Navy officer fired after crew 'misnavigated' into Iran


Squadron Commander is gone, so they next guy in the food chain gets eaten.


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## Marauder06 (May 13, 2016)

"This is why the Iranians capture us. "



> In a move we all knew was coming, the US Navy announced the firing of the commanding officer of the Coastal Riverine Squadron 3, the unit that had a number of sailors captured by Iran earlier this year.


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## Etype (May 13, 2016)

Marauder06 said:


> "This is why the Iranians capture us. "
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 15481


I would hope that in the event I was captured by Iran, I would be doing the wildest most outlandish bullshit when they tried to photograph me.

"Go ahead Iran, do something stupid."


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## racing_kitty (May 13, 2016)

I'd hope to be wearing socks with bongs and pot leaves on them, worn over a pair of black silk thigh highs (complete with the seam in the back) and a garter belt, and a push-up bra with a disembodied hand flipping the bird on each cup, plainly visible through my ripped-to-shit undershirt.  At that point, UCMJ is the least of my worries.

Go ahead, make some propaganda out of this.  I'm going in the spank bank, and you'll have to stone the fuck out of tens of males to banish me otherwise.


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## Red Flag 1 (May 13, 2016)

racing_kitty said:


> I'd hope to be wearing socks with bongs and pot leaves on them, worn over a pair of black silk thigh highs (complete with the seam in the back) and a garter belt, and a push-up bra with a disembodied hand flipping the bird on each cup, plainly visible through my ripped-to-shit undershirt.  At that point, UCMJ is the least of my worries.
> 
> Go ahead, make some propaganda out of this.  I'm going in the spank bank, and you'll have to stone the fuck out of tens of males to banish me otherwise.



I see your birthday present finally got to you.


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## RackMaster (May 13, 2016)

racing_kitty said:


> I'd hope to be wearing socks with bongs and pot leaves on them, worn over a pair of black silk thigh highs (complete with the seam in the back) and a garter belt, and a push-up bra with a disembodied hand flipping the bird on each cup, plainly visible through my ripped-to-shit undershirt.  At that point, UCMJ is the least of my worries.
> 
> Go ahead, make some propaganda out of this.  I'm going in the spank bank, and you'll have to stone the fuck out of tens of males to banish me otherwise.



Thought for a second you meant the dude in white socks...


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## Ooh-Rah (May 16, 2016)

Yet another report I probably don't want to read. 

Congressman: Details of Iran's kidnapping of U.S. sailors will shock


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## Ooh-Rah (Jun 24, 2016)

Ooh-Rah said:


> Hmmm...have to admit that I was not expecting this.
> 
> Navy officer fired after crew 'misnavigated' into Iran



...and heads continue to roll ...

Navy commodore is fired after Iran captured 10 American sailors


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## DA SWO (Jun 24, 2016)

"Second, the chain of command was not well defined on the two boats. While a young lieutenant was the highest-ranking individual on either of the two 50-foot boats, when the order was given to evade the Iranian forces, the helmsman refused the order."
:-/


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## Marauder06 (Jun 24, 2016)

DA SWO said:


> "Second, the chain of command was not well defined on the two boats. While a young lieutenant was the highest-ranking individual on either of the two 50-foot boats, when the order was given to evade the Iranian forces, *the helmsman refused the order*."
> :-/


He was probably the guy in the white socks.


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## Ooh-Rah (Jun 24, 2016)

DA SWO said:


> "Second, the chain of command was not well defined on the two boats. While a young lieutenant was the highest-ranking individual on either of the two 50-foot boats, when the order was given to evade the Iranian forces, the helmsman refused the order."
> :-/



I read this and immediately thought someone saw Crimson Tide too many times and sided with the Denzel Washington character.


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## AWP (Jun 24, 2016)

Maybe the helmsman thought it was a movie?

LT: Hey asshole. Those are Iranians. Ain't no Chriss Angel Mindfreak David Blaine Trapdoor shit jumping off here 
Helmsman: LT, you wanna get in line or do you want blow another take. 
LT: Ain't no takes. Ain't no goddamn motion picture.
Helmsman: Are you sure?


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## DA SWO (Jun 24, 2016)

Marauder06 said:


> He was probably the guy in the white socks.


I think you are correct.


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## Ooh-Rah (Jun 30, 2016)

Inside the Bungled Mission That Allowed Iran to Detain US Sailors
_Iran’s detention of 10 U.S. sailors in January was preventable and resulted from bad leadership, poor training, bad planning and little oversight of the sailors during their deployment, the Navy has determined in a report unveiled today._

Boy, Navy is not letting this go.  I guess a black eye will do that to you...especially since every story is accompanied by this pic:


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## Brill (Jun 30, 2016)

WTF is the guy lower left doing???


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## Ooh-Rah (Jun 30, 2016)

<deleted comment because it is probably only funny to me>

<another deleted comment because it is probably only funny to me>

<one final deleted comment because it is probably only funny to me>

Ummm...ducking for cover?


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## RackMaster (Jun 30, 2016)

Ooh-Rah said:


> <deleted comment because it is probably only funny to me>
> 
> <another deleted comment because it is probably only funny to me>
> 
> ...



Looks like he was getting ready to for a promotion board to me.


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## Marauder06 (Jun 30, 2016)

It was a "failure at every level."




> The US Navy released a long-anticipated report today outlining the many failures that led to the January capture of two Navy boats and their crew members by Iran.
> 
> It was even worse than we expected.


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## Ooh-Rah (Jun 30, 2016)

lindy said:


> WTF is the guy lower left doing???



Ya know, I really looked at that picture for a minute. Compared the look on his face to everyone else. Forget the silly Navy jokes I was going to make. I'd like to believe that this guy was covering his head in disbelief and thinking:

_"You have GOT to be FUCKING kidding me!  I'm 90 days and a wake up to being fucking civilian again and now my ass is about to be made famous because Lt. White-Sox over there decided to stop and ask for directions instead of making a bead back to base!  I told that mother fucker we were off course, I FUCKING TOLD HIM! ...I swear to Christ above...if I get out of this alive, I am going to track that mother fucker down and put 10-times the hurt on him that these bastards put on me.  fuck...Fuck...FUCK!"_

That's what I'd like to believe he is thinking...



Either that or..._"I am SO fucked if they make us take our boots off!"




>_


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## DA SWO (Jun 30, 2016)

Ooh-Rah said:


> Ya know, I really looked at that picture for a minute. Compared the look on his face to everyone else. Forget the silly Navy jokes I was going to make. I'd like to believe that this guy was covering his head in disbelief and thinking:
> 
> _"You have GOT to be FUCKING kidding me!  I'm 90 days and a wake up to being fucking civilian again and now my ass is about to be made famous because Lt. White-Sox over there decided to stop and ask for directions instead of making a bead back to base!  I told that mother fucker we were off course, I FUCKING TOLD HIM! ...I swear to Christ above...if I get out of this alive, I am going to track that mother fucker down and put 10-times the hurt on him that these bastards put on me.  fuck...Fuck...FUCK!"_
> 
> ...


Except Lt JG White sox told the helmsman to evade, and he refused; so he is probably thinking either the Iranians or the Navy are gonna butt-fuck me (I should have eaten popcorn last night).


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## CDG (Jul 1, 2016)

Ooh-Rah said:


> Boy, Navy is not letting this go.  I guess a black eye will do that to you



The funny thing is, this is EXACTLY the type of mindset the Navy fosters. This is the same US Navy that, despite having an SOP in place and a valid reason to engage, let the USS Cole get blown up. The Navy loves to spout bullshit about "Surface Warriors". That's a bigger crock of shit than "Army of One". The warriors, outside of NSW, are few and far between. And they're fewer and farther between the higher up in rank you go. This will continue to happen every few years or so until the Navy pulls its collective head out of its ass and starts training people to react with violence when needed.

Anecdote: I was on a NCVBSS (non-compliant visit, board, search, seizure) team. We did 3 weeks of training out in Moyock with a group of former SOF guys. At the FTX, some senior NCOs and Os from the Fleet were there to observe. We, and the cadre, were chastised afterwards for being "too aggressive".  

This is the culture in the Navy. It's unbelievable that they're attempting to blame this all on the team, when Big Navy trained them to respond in exactly this manner.


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## Devildoc (Jul 1, 2016)

CDG said:


> The funny thing is, this is EXACTLY the type of mindset the Navy fosters. This is the same US Navy that, despite having an SOP in place and a valid reason to engage, let the USS Cole get blown up. The Navy loves to spout bullshit about "Surface Warriors". That's a bigger crock of shit than "Army of One". The warriors, outside of NSW, are few and far between. And they're fewer and farther between the higher up in rank you go. This will continue to happen every few years or so until the Navy pulls its collective head out of its ass and starts training people to react with violence when needed.
> 
> Anecdote: I was on a NCVBSS (non-compliant visit, board, search, seizure) team. We did 3 weeks of training out in Moyock with a group of former SOF guys. At the FTX, some senior NCOs and Os from the Fleet were there to observe. We, and the cadre, were chastised afterwards for being "too aggressive".
> 
> This is the culture in the Navy. It's unbelievable that they're attempting to blame this all on the team, when Big Navy trained them to respond in exactly this manner.



The surface Navy is all about big tech-missiles-automatically tracking/targeting guns.  They cannot fathom that a failure in their gazillion dollar war machine that carries 10 times the fire power that destroyed Hiroshima can be doomed by a couple E1s.

On a float I observed a couple very senior Navy officers (Captains) conferring with a couple senior Marine officers (Maj/LtCol if I recall); the Marines essentially said, "you get us to the destination, we'll worry about the killing."  You are right, it's a fucked up mindset and culture.


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## Ooh-Rah (Apr 22, 2017)

<UPDATE>

Navy Lt Who Apologized To Iran After 2016 Capture Gets To Keep His Job

_The Navy officer who apologized to Iran after the crew of the riverine boats he was in command of were captured in January 2016, will be allowed to remain in the service after a separation board in Imperial Beach, California, ruled in his favor on April 18, according to Navy Times._

After all this; especially as an officer, why would you want to stay in?  (serious question)

To add - assuming the bolded area below cannot be a good thing and will certainly hinder any continued career opportunities?  

<From Navy Times article>
_But just what Nartker’s future in the Navy will be remains to be seen. A 2011 Naval Academy graduate, he’s been on active duty for just under six years. 

As a surface warfare officer, Nartker now faces an uphill battle in that community and in the Navy. *As part of Nartker's punishment at admiral’s mast, Morneau also took away the 28-year-old officer’s surface warfare qualification and pin, too. *_


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## Teufel (Apr 22, 2017)

Damn they took away his SWO pin! I think he just wants to finish his time and get out with an honorable discharge instead of being stuck with a general discharge after being administratively separated. He has no future in the Navy after all this. The Navy is not a service that tolerates mistakes. Nowadays anyway; Admiral Nimitz ran a ship aground as a Captain before WWII.


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## Ooh-Rah (Apr 22, 2017)

Teufel said:


> Damn they took away his SWO pin!



Sir, what is the significance of this?


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## Teufel (Apr 22, 2017)

It is equivalent to stripping a Marine of their MOS. He can stay in the Navy now but he is no longer qualified to do anything and won't ever get promoted.


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## Teufel (Apr 22, 2017)

SWO: Surface Warfare Officer. The pin is the physical representation of his qualification. I know some pilots that are removed from flight status for a mishap but are allowed to keep their wings.


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## DA SWO (Apr 22, 2017)

Teufel said:


> It is equivalent to stripping a Marine of their MOS. He can stay in the Navy now but he is no longer qualified to do anything and won't ever get promoted.


He'd have to requalify and I suspect he will get nothing but shore assignments until he leaves.
I wonder if any of the enlisted boat OIC's were punished?


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## CDG (Apr 22, 2017)

Ooh-Rah said:


> Sir, what is the significance of this?



To add on to what Teufel said already, this is a huge deal.  As soon as a new ensign shows up on a ship, he/she is given a huge binder full of qualification paperwork.  They spend months learning about everything on the ship, from how to strip and clean small arms, to how to berth the ship in port, to how the supply system works, etc.  They have to collect a lot of signatures, perform a lot of tasks, and spend a lot of time studying, standing watches, and working after hours.  Then they get all that done and have to take a pretty brutal murder board with ship leadership to prove they actually know about all the shit with the signatures next to it.


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## Teufel (Apr 22, 2017)

DA SWO said:


> He'd have to requalify and I suspect he will get nothing but shore assignments until he leaves.
> I wonder if any of the enlisted boat OIC's were punished?



Honestly I don't think he can requalify. SWOs have a career track that requires them to get cumulative quals. It starts with the SWO pin, which takes forever, then on to advanced quals. There is a board to determine your quals. He's walking in with a Fail tattooed to his face.


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## pardus (Apr 22, 2017)




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## Teufel (Apr 22, 2017)

CDG said:


> To add on to what Teufel said already, this is a huge deal.  As soon as a new ensign shows up on a ship, he/she is given a huge binder full of qualification paperwork.  They spend months learning about everything on the ship, from how to strip and clean small arms, to how to berth the ship in port, to how the supply system works, etc.  They have to collect a lot of signatures, perform a lot of tasks, and spend a lot of time studying, standing watches, and working after hours.  Then they get all that done and have to take a pretty brutal murder board with ship leadership to prove they actually know about all the shit with the signatures next to it.



He had six years in the Navy. He is done as a SWO. He is six years behind his peers and realistically cannot catch up. He could possibly lat move over to Navy Intel (information dominance), supply, or Human Resources though. The reserves may also be an option as well.


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## Ooh-Rah (Apr 22, 2017)

I know it is only speculation, but what is hisndsy-to-day life like?

Is he ostrisized by his fellow officers or would there be empathy?  I cannot imagine doing what he did and then expecting to go back to work like all is well with the world.


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## SpitfireV (Apr 22, 2017)

Teufel said:


> He had six years in the Navy. He is done as a SWO. He is six years behind his peers and realistically cannot catch up. He could possibly lat move over to Navy Intel (information dominance), supply, or Human Resources though. The reserves may also be an option as well.



I think there could possibly be an argument that if he capitulates to his captors in what seemed to be a reasonably soft captivity (all things considered) so easily, then is he really suitable for access to confidential material? What do you think?


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## Teufel (Apr 22, 2017)

SpitfireV said:


> I think there could possibly be an argument that if he capitulates to his captors in what seemed to be a reasonably soft captivity (all things considered) so easily, then is he really suitable for access to confidential material?


I don't know if he lost his clearance or not. I suppose it doesn't matter at this point. He may have won the admin separation board but his career is deader than Aaron Hernandez.


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## SpitfireV (Apr 22, 2017)

Teufel said:


> I don't know if he lost his clearance or not. I suppose it doesn't matter at this point. He may have won the admin separation board but his career is deader than Aaron Hernandez.



Yeah he's best to move on as quickly as possible.


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## CDG (Apr 23, 2017)

Ooh-Rah said:


> I know it is only speculation, but what is hisndsy-to-day life like?
> 
> Is he ostrisized by his fellow officers or would there be empathy?  I cannot imagine doing what he did and then expecting to go back to work like all is well with the world.



Surface officers are a very cliqueish group.  Many of them would have done the exact same thing, because the Navy does not develop anything remotely resembling a warrior  mindset outside of the NSW/SO fields.  However, they will not admit that, and he will likely be treated like shit while they pretend they would have been all William Wallace about it.


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## Teufel (Apr 23, 2017)

Ooh-Rah said:


> I know it is only speculation, but what is hisndsy-to-day life like?
> 
> Is he ostrisized by his fellow officers or would there be empathy?  I cannot imagine doing what he did and then expecting to go back to work like all is well with the world.



I know some of his classmates from the academy. Many of them, the SWOs anyway, are very sympathetic. The EOD, NSW and Marines less so. 

I imagine he has one of those Kim Kardashian jobs now where you get paid for doing nothing. 

He's probably doing something that doesn't require a warfare qualification like command equal opportunity officer or SAPR. I suppose he could be an aide if the flag officer is okay with a surrender monkey in a khaki uniform.


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## Blizzard (Apr 23, 2017)

I'm guessing his goal is just to survive in some position the next 2 years until he can resign, right?


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## Teufel (Apr 23, 2017)

Blizzard said:


> I'm guessing his goal is just to survive in some position the next 2 years until he can resign, right?


I'm sure he's studying for the GRE and submitting applications to business schools as we speak. He's already familiar with hostile take overs.


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## TLDR20 (Apr 23, 2017)

Teufel said:


> I'm sure he's studying for the GRE and submitting applications to business schools as we speak. He's already familiar with hostile take overs.



Zing


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## Kraut783 (Apr 23, 2017)

He could write a book about how the Naval mentality lead to his capture......or something like that.


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## Ooh-Rah (Apr 23, 2017)

CDG said:


> while they pretend they would have been all William Wallace about it.



Somewhere, somehow, I will use that line as a closing statement to something.  It will be brilliant.


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## Marauder06 (Apr 23, 2017)

Teufel said:


> I'm sure he's studying for the GRE and submitting applications to business schools as we speak. He's already familiar with hostile take overs.



Oh damn, he went there.  Savage level:  Marine Corps


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## Red Flag 1 (Apr 23, 2017)

[Q


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## Kraut783 (Apr 23, 2017)

LOL...very true!


----------

