# .Step it up Marines



## Teufel (Sep 22, 2015)

The latest Basic Reconnaissance Course started with 150 students and only graduated 15.  Get the word out.  We need high quality Marines and future Marines to step up to the plate and take the challenge.  Marine Reconnaissance is one of the most difficult communities to join in the Marines Corps but also one of the most rewarding.  A 70-90% attrition rate will guarantee that you will stand tall next to the finest in our Corps...should you have the fortitude, determination and heart to be one of the select few to earn the 0321 MOS.  Contact your recruiter for more information.

Broadsword6 sends


----------



## GhillieDude08 (Sep 22, 2015)

I figured most BRC classes would have higher graduation rates by now with the Addition of BRPC.


----------



## Teufel (Sep 22, 2015)

GhillieDude08 said:


> I figured most BRC classes would have higher graduation rates by now with the Addition of BRPC.



It has helped.  Most classes aren't quite this bad but the average attrition rate is 70%.  That includes BRPC.


----------



## buzzkill.0621 (Sep 23, 2015)

Personally what I think causes the drops is that there isn't any age restrictions that I've seen. I've never gone so I really don't know what the course entirely consists of, I've just heard that it's a "man course" meaning that an 18 year old boy would be more likely to DOR or fail. I see there being a need to attract an older, more seasoned crowd coming through. Bottom line is that it takes time to develop a harden the fuck up mentality if you will.


----------



## Ranger Psych (Sep 23, 2015)

Meh, you're either hard or you're not. Not exactly something that can be taught, really. Skills can be taught, mentality and intestinal fortitude is more something you grow up with and retain into adulthood.


----------



## Teufel (Sep 23, 2015)

buzzkill.0621 said:


> Personally what I think causes the drops is that there isn't any age restrictions that I've seen. I've never gone so I really don't know what the course entirely consists of, I've just heard that it's a "man course" meaning that an 18 year old boy would be more likely to DOR or fail. I see there being a need to attract an older, more seasoned crowd coming through. Bottom line is that it takes time to develop a harden the fuck up mentality if you will.



The data shows a different result.  Lat movers and officers are notorious for quitting BRC and these two groups usually fare far worse percentage-wise than the recruited off the street crowd.  It should be the opposite but it is not.  The course is extremely difficult and I think the younger Marines have more drive and are forged by that fire.  You either have it or you don't, I don't care how old you are. 

BRC is easy.  There isn't any selection or assessment.  Meet the entry standards, maintain standards throughout the course and don't quit.  It's not that hard. That being said, 70-90% of a class will take their ropes off their backs and find another line of work.


----------



## buzzkill.0621 (Sep 23, 2015)

That is a interesting insight. 

Would you think that more lat movers are interested in it for the bonus money as opposed to truly wanting it and that being their downfall?
I think it's a sad day when people can't/won't bite down and push through the trials.


----------



## digrar (Sep 23, 2015)

Is MARSOC taking the most likely candidates away from your pipeline?


----------



## Teufel (Sep 23, 2015)

buzzkill.0621 said:


> That is a interesting insight.
> 
> Would you think that more lat movers are interested in it for the bonus money as opposed to truly wanting it and that being their downfall?
> I think it's a sad day when people can't/won't bite down and push through the trials.



I don't think they are there for the bonus money.  I think they want it but not enough to make it over the finish line.

@digrar we have seen a significant drop in lat movers since MARSOC stood up.  We get most of our Marines from an off the street recon contract now.


----------



## The Hate Ape (Sep 25, 2015)

See you next year.


----------



## ritterk (Sep 27, 2015)

I think the biggest problem with lat movers and officers attending brc is that they go from running the show to a place where they have to prove their worth and their rank doesn't hold much weight.


----------



## The Hate Ape (Sep 27, 2015)

What about drowning? I hear this is a big-ticket item.


----------



## Teufel (Sep 27, 2015)

ritterk said:


> I think the biggest problem with lat movers and officers attending brc is that they go from running the show to a place where they have to prove their worth and their rank doesn't hold much weight.


 
I think that is part of it.  It's also tough when a lot of the recon students are faster and stronger than you are.  They are also rougher on officers at the course.  My tac instructor gave me a "ground sensor kit" to carry on patrol which consisted of a pelican case full of rocks.  This is in addition to a radio, a 50lb sand bag and full combat load. My tac instructor told me it was extremely complicated piece of equipment that required a college degree to operate. The pelican case had two zip ties on it and everytime we stopped for whatever reason I had to take it out of my pack and stick the zip tie ends up to "arm the sensors".


----------



## Ranger Psych (Sep 27, 2015)

I'm sure that you'd agree that it's a necessary evil, though.  Those who are to lead the best, should be the best...  and while it may also be an outlet for some good old fashioned ribbing, it also makes sure that you don't have a turd leading studs.


----------



## Teufel (Sep 28, 2015)

Ranger Psych said:


> I'm sure that you'd agree that it's a necessary evil, though.  Those who are to lead the best, should be the best...  and while it may also be an outlet for some good old fashioned ribbing, it also makes sure that you don't have a turd leading studs.



I agree with you 100%.  Officers and enlisted need to go through the same course and meet the same, if not higher standards, to get the MOS.  It also helps our young officer leaders realize that we do things a little differently in the reconnaissance community.


----------



## Rcjames1 (Nov 4, 2015)

Teufel said:


> I agree with you 100%.  Officers and enlisted need to go through the same course and meet the same, if not higher standards, to get the MOS.  It also helps our young officer leaders realize that we do things a little differently in the reconnaissance community.



I'm really glad to see that officers and enlisted do get the same training in at least recon. I feel like an off-the-street college grad going into officer (which is what I'd be doing) either might feel undertrained or unexperienced in comparison to the enlistees. Feel free to correct me as I am new to this.

RJ


----------



## Rcjames1 (Nov 4, 2015)

Sorry for the double post, but is there much difference between Ground Intel (0203) and Recon (0321) other than 0203 is an officer position? 

Thank you again.

RJ


----------



## Teufel (Nov 4, 2015)

Officers normally go to recon after completing one or two deployments in the infantry. They don't go straight into reconnaissance. Ground intelligence (0203) is a military specialty and most of those officers do not serve in reconnaissance.


----------



## Rcjames1 (Nov 4, 2015)

Thank you. Then what differentiates intelligence from reconnaissance? From what I have gathered, it seems that Ground Intel unit supports the Ground Combat unit. Sorry, it's all very confusing.


----------



## The Hate Ape (Nov 4, 2015)

That is correct; I cannot see how this is confusing

Remove your photo from your avatar - you'll thank yourself for doing this years down the road.

Especially if you enter the service under any mos you have mentioned.




H/A


----------



## Rcjames1 (Nov 4, 2015)

Thank you for the advice, sir. 

RJ


----------



## Bonesaw (Nov 21, 2015)

BRPC 1-16 is barely three weeks into the suck. Went from 80 to 55 and it's hardly begun. None of the drops have been officers or NCOs. Seems like it's the MCT/ITB volunteers who didn't understand what they were about to undertake or didn't have time to prepare.


----------



## Brandon E (Nov 22, 2015)

ritterk said:


> I think the biggest problem with lat movers and officers attending brc is that they go from running the show to a place where they have to prove their worth and their rank doesn't hold much weight.


That has been a trend in this class so far by some lat-movers. It is causing unneeded friction in an already high-friction course. Some of these guys are more concerned with "squaring away" the new guys than they are about their personal performance and influence. Personally, I'd prefer rank be officially put into perspective so that those who need to tone it down do so in order to allow a closer-knit class. Some guys can put the stripes away when needed and some have a little harder time doing so.


----------



## Mr.Langdizzle (Nov 23, 2015)

Brandon E said:


> That has been a trend in this class so far by some lat-movers. It is causing unneeded friction in an already high-friction course. Some of these guys are more concerned with "squaring away" the new guys than they are about their personal performance and influence. Personally, I'd prefer rank be officially put into perspective so that those who need to tone it down do so in order to allow a closer-knit class. Some guys can put the stripes away when needed and some have a little harder time doing so.


Just out of curiosity how much are you guys swimming in BRPC?


----------



## Bonesaw (Nov 26, 2015)

The focus is less on swimming and more on treading and finning. Preparation should focus heavily on the treading. Just a heads up, don't expect to tread at all with you hands.


----------

