# Fins?



## Jmotivator (Jun 2, 2012)

Im headed to ITC in November, and I was wondering if any CSO's out there have any advice on what kind of fins I should get and/or any good instructional videos or advice on proper technique? Thanks in advance!


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## Hitman2/3 (Jun 2, 2012)

Different strokes for different folks. Everybody is different when it comes to fins some guys like them nice and stiff some like them really flexible, some like them long some like them short, some like them super high speed some like them old school and simple. You really have to try them out and find out what works for you. Fining is like rucking, when you first start doing it its going to suck and you'll probably only be able to swim a few hundred meters before your legs start cramping up, your not just putting along like a tourist, but the more you do it the easier it gets. There are tons of videos on you tube that will show you technique and give you tips. FYI they'll issue you fins and I'm not sure if they'll let you use your own.


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## Jmotivator (Jun 2, 2012)

Exactly what I needed to know. Thank you Hitman! I appreciate the info. My rackmate during ASPOC was an 0321 and he recommended I go with ScubaPro Twin Jet fins. I figured thats sound advice and should be somewhat similar to what ever get issued. By any chance do you know if we are allowed to use our own rucks? Or if not are we allowed to get thicker straps for the ruck? I have been looking around and Tactical Taylor can do some nice upgrades to the standard Alice pack if you send it to them, I was thinking that could be a good option. And finally, do you know if we are allowed to use non-issue boots for pt/rucking, etc? Once again thanks for the advice and info, I really appreciate it.


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## F.CASTLE (Jun 3, 2012)

Just out of curiosity, why aren't you contacting Stone Bay for this information?


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## Teufel (Jun 3, 2012)

Jmotivator said:


> Im headed to ITC in November, and I was wondering if any CSO's out there have any advice on what kind of fins I should get and/or any good instructional videos or advice on proper technique? Thanks in advance!


 
I don't know anything about ITC and fins but my favorite fins are scubapro frogfoots.  They don't sell them anymore but those fins are the heat.  Other than that I use the issued XL scubapro jets.  Twin jets are good fins but they aren't that great for pushing a ruck or treading tanks.  Split fins get over worked really easily and work better with a high paced small kick instead of the big seeping kicks that you use with a solid fin.  The big kicks are easier to sustain over a long period of time.


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## Jmotivator (Jun 3, 2012)

F.CASTLE -We asked at the ITC brief we got and the instructor just said "don't show up with some crazy shit", I called the school house the other day but the person that answered the phone said to call at a later date and that he dindnt know, so I figured I would ask any CSO's on here that would know. I actually went to look at houses today and one of my prospective neighboors is a CSO, and he advised me on the issue.

@Teufel- thanks you very much, that sounds like excellent advise.


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## Jmotivator (Jun 28, 2012)

Just another question on the issue gents. I have seen two different styles for finning on the YouTube videos that I have found. The modified Combat Side Stroke that the Seals use, as well as another that resembles our survival side stroke with only one arm out and a constant side kick. Which is the preferred or used method by CSO's? I am assuming that it would be the same for Recon.  On the other hand, assuming that there will be times that training will require finning/running on the beach, is there any particular type/brand of bootie that anyone recommends? One of my ASPOC instructors said he used Chuck Taylors under his fins. Does anyone else agree? Thanks in advance gentlemen.


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## SkrewzLoose (Jun 28, 2012)

I'm assuming this question pertains to right now and not once you're in ASPOC where they'll issue you everything you need.  Again, just an assumption.  Just go with an inexpensive neoprene bootie.  Should be under $20 for the pair.  The only real purpose they serve is to prevent your feet from getting torn up by the fins (heels and toes).


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## Jmotivator (Jun 28, 2012)

I already went through ASPOC/A&S. I am actually trying to prepare for ITC. I know they will issue us what ever gear is required but I just want to be prepared by the time I check in.  Sounds like good advice though, I was just wondering if any one experienced in having to fin in combination with running on the beach had a preference since I assume there will be training similar to that. I put on my Vibrams under my fins (Jet Pros) today, and that felt fine but everyone was right 300M and my feet started cramping up. I will definitely need to spend some quality time with them. Thanks again for the advice.


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## SkrewzLoose (Jun 28, 2012)

So you're trying to prepare for exiting the ocean/bay and moving directly to running on the beach with no time to change your gear accordingly (just taking your fins off and moving out)?  I only ask because I don't know.  If that's the case, then I'm not sure what the best choice would be.  A few guys around here would be able to answer that better than I can.
Also, make sure you're giving your hip flexors proper attention in regards to your finning as well.


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## Jmotivator (Jun 28, 2012)

Well...basically yes. I am new to this whole world, in my MOS now, a Marine's idea of being the field is sitting in a tent with AC, internet, and hot chow. I don't know what to expect really, but just from what I have heard from my classmates mostly the Recon guys, we will probably be doing that kind of stuff during the Amphib phase. I will make sure I pay attention to that, thanks again SkrewzLoose


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## SkrewzLoose (Jun 28, 2012)

No problem.  I hope it helps.  
Hopefully someone will come along and give you some better answers than I did.


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## Uncle Petey (Jun 29, 2012)

Last I heard, just like the old ARS, you can bring whatever version of the mountain ruck you like.  I advise you get the typical Alice Frame type ruck with the gucci pockets and the Camel Bak Pouches.  They are way better than what you will be issued.  But, have a regular Alice type Mountain ruck ( you can switch them off the frame in case they change the policy.) Go to my rucking tab in the Mentor section. 

Fins: I think, not confirmed that you will be issued Rocket Fins.  Use them, unless you've been finning for awhile and have something better.  But I expect you'll be using Rockets.


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## Hitman2/3 (Jul 1, 2012)

Chuck T's with dive socks are my booties of choice, but not sure if you'll be able to wear them at ITC. They make booties that are actually made to go straight from water to running around on rough ground. Never used them though so I couldn't tell you how they are on a run. Old jungles or desserts work pretty good to because they're thin at the toes. But you really need to try that stuff out to see what works for you. ITC is probably not when you want to figure out that what you got is probably not the right choice.


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## Tony (Jul 3, 2012)

Jmotivator said:


> Just another question on the issue gents. I have seen two different styles for finning on the YouTube videos that I have found. The modified Combat Side Stroke that the Seals use, as well as another that resembles our survival side stroke with only one arm out and a constant side kick. Which is the preferred or used method by CSO's? I am assuming that it would be the same for Recon.  On the other hand, assuming that there will be times that training will require finning/running on the beach, is there any particular type/brand of bootie that anyone recommends? One of my ASPOC instructors said he used Chuck Taylors under his fins. Does anyone else agree? Thanks in advance gentlemen.[
> 
> Alright...there really isn't going to be a specific method of finning you can use I'm not in marsoc but im almost positive you will fin with a ruck. So if you have a ruck more than likely your going to want to push it in front of you because unless your superman towing it sucks. So really it helps to practice finning with a kick board in front of you of you don't have a Ruck and as for booties I use deep sea with a decent amount of padding because if you don't then the rocks are going to kill your feet.


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## Jmotivator (Jul 4, 2012)

Thank you very much for your advice Uncle Petey , Tony and Hitman2/3 . I have an Alice with mountain frame that works well for me, I have seen a few upgrades that you can do it, like adding the Camel Back pouch, so I think I will be sticking to that. I bought a pair of Scuba Pro(Jet Fins), but I was told recently by a recent graduate that they issue Twin Jets, so I will try to get some of those in the near future. One of my CSO instructors during ASPOC also recommended the Chuck T/Dive sock combo, I will definitely look into it. Once again I can't thank you gentlemen enough for the help. Hope you all enjoy the holiday celebrating our great nation. S/F


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## Tony (Jul 4, 2012)

No problem man...any jets are good or rockets. And Alice frame with tactical tailors rucks are pretty good it's what I use. Any question just pm me


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## OverthrowMediocrity (Jul 6, 2012)

Jmotivator- I'm only a month into ITC right now so we have not hit amphib phase yet, but we have done a good amount of finning and so I will attempt to answer your questions. The class before me was issued Twin jets I believe, but due to them all being issued out all they had left for my class was Rockets and so that's what we all have. I would highly recommend that you practice with the Rockets as they are super stiff and heavy and they will toughen up your ankles and hip flexors in a hurry. I went out and bought some ScubaPro Seawing Nova's and they are incredibly easy to kick after using the rockets. Half of my team bought the same fins and we have all improved our times significantly, especially on the longer fins. We are allowed to wear Chuck T's but I prefer the issued booties since we haven't been doing any transitions from finning to running on land. As for your stroke, we have been pushing our rucks everytime we have been out so I suggest just practicing a good strong and long scissor kick with a paddleboard (very slight bend in the knees, movement comes from the hips).

My class and the class before us are allowed to use non-USMC boots for PT and ruck runs, but not day to day movements. We are also allowed to use different rucks, so long as they are similar in appearance to the mountain rucks and have the same capabilities as far as equipment loading. Most just use the issued ruck and modify it to their liking.

Just so you are aware, ITC is a rapidly evolving course and my class has done a lot of things different than the previous class. Do not be surprised if you are not allowed to have a different ruck/boots/fins, etc., as the lieniancy of allowing us to use non-issued equipment rests with your Proctor and team TAC. Your class may do things completely different so I would refrain from purchasing any high speed gear until cleared to do so by your team TAC. Good luck and hope this helps.


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## Jmotivator (Jul 6, 2012)

This is awesome. Thank you so much! Ill pm you right now.


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## SkrewzLoose (Jul 6, 2012)

How did anyone ever pass an SOF training pipeline without the interwebz!?


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