# Rucking Muscle Use?



## Nbrac27 (Jan 6, 2015)

Hello Everyone,

I have a question about Rucking (Like it seems everyone does). I've read multiple posts on here in regards to it, and understand it's just like running, to get better at it you have just have to strap up and go do it.

But does anyone know which muscle groups are predominatly worked during a ruck?

For example, other than rucking, while at the gym would working that particular muscle group help out for the ruck? Like saying if I started to get more powerful legs by say squating, would that help towards rucking itself, or in the end just help with being able to put more weight on my back and lifting it up and down?

It sounds like a stupid question, but I ask because I remember after a few months of rucking often, I was putting up much more weight at the gym with my legs then I was before rucking often. So I'm curious if it works vice versa.

Now I'm not asking to try to find some magic loop hole to not ruck, but just to see if it is something to add to the tool box that will help out.

Thanks guys,

-Nick


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## TLDR20 (Jan 6, 2015)

I think that the best way to get better at Rucking is to do it. Squatting,  deadlift, cleans will all make you stronger, so you should do those as well. Don't forget about things like shrugs, having bigger shoulders might make it hurt a bit less.


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## TLDR20 (Jan 6, 2015)

@JBS post up what you did if you don't mind, that is an excellent post.


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## CDG (Jan 6, 2015)

Having a strong core and lower back are essential for rucking as well.  If you can't actually ruck, step-ups are probably the best substitute, although they are about the most mind-numbing exercise there is.


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## Nbrac27 (Jan 6, 2015)

Okay so every thing I have seen says for the MARSOC prep rucking to use 45lbs because that is what they use there, so would say doing 65-75lbs help more to prepare?

I've always been taught if you're aiming to do a certain thing, train further then it so when the time comes it is easier in the end. For example to train for the 3 mile for our PFT, run 4-5. Would that be the same concept here? Or would should I do more along the lines of just trying to stay at the 45lbs and increase my mileagle per ruck?

Also CDG, for the step-ups. If they are what I think they are, its basically just straight forward as it seems correct? Put weight on your back, get something about mid thigh level, and step up and down off it?


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## Nbrac27 (Jan 6, 2015)

I butchered that post with mispellings and incorrect grammer..


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## DA SWO (Jan 6, 2015)

Nbrac27 said:


> Okay so every thing I have seen says for the MARSOC prep rucking to use 45lbs because that is what they use there, so would say doing 65-75lbs help more to prepare?
> 
> I've always been taught if you're aiming to do a certain thing, train further then it so when the time comes it is easier in the end. For example to train for the 3 mile for our PFT, run 4-5. Would that be the same concept here? Or would should I do more along the lines of just trying to stay at the 45lbs and increase my mileagle per ruck?
> 
> Also CDG, for the step-ups. If they are what I think they are, its basically just straight forward as it seems correct? Put weight on your back, get something about mid thigh level, and step up and down off it?


Work yourself up to 45, then increased weight.
Same goes for distance, start with smaller distances, then work up.  
I started light and worked up to my required distance.  I then started adding weight and gear until I was fully kitted out and going the distance in the required time.


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## AKkeith (Jan 6, 2015)

Rucking is a great, easy way to hurt your self. Start light and short, then slowly move up the weight and distance, like @SOWT said.


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## CDG (Jan 6, 2015)

Nbrac27 said:


> Also CDG, for the step-ups. If they are what I think they are, its basically just straight forward as it seems correct? Put weight on your back, get something about mid thigh level, and step up and down off it?



Yep.  You still want to start light on the weight though.  The tendency with step-ups is to look down a lot more, so you don't want to fuck your back up by starting off too heavy.  Find something 16-20" tall and start stepping.


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## Nbrac27 (Jan 6, 2015)

Okay so for the starting off light and working up, I'm used to rucking (But by no means a mountain climbing monster), what would be a good start point for weight and distance? Im currently stationed in Pennsylvania, and it is by no means flat so wherever I go will have plenty of hills to add into the equation.

I still have a year and half before Im at my four year mark of my five year contract and able to put in for A&S so I have plenty of time to build up to the required time and (hopefully) get a good distance past that as well.


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## x SF med (Jan 6, 2015)

You should know where you are if you're stating you are used to rucking....  Try 30 lbs for 5 mi, no time limit, but time how long it takes you....   and work from there.


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## DA SWO (Jan 6, 2015)

Nbrac27 said:


> Okay so for the starting off light and working up, I'm used to rucking (But by no means a mountain climbing monster), what would be a good start point for weight and distance? Im currently stationed in Pennsylvania, and it is by no means flat so wherever I go will have plenty of hills to add into the equation.
> 
> I still have a year and half before Im at my four year mark of my five year contract and able to put in for A&S so I have plenty of time to build up to the required time and (hopefully) get a good distance past that as well.


30-35 lbs (or whatever your units standard is)
Start short (1-3 miles) or do what @x SF med said.
Rucking does a lot for you, and to you.
1.You are trying to increase the weight you can semi-comfortable carry.
2.You are working to increase the distance you can go.
3.You are working to increase the speed that you can go with weight and distance in mind.

Speed is a factor of stride, short choppy steps slow you down, you need to have a decent stride or you'll have a hard time making time/distance.
Don't run with a heavy ruck, you may need to "walk fast" on occasion, but running with a ruck just fucks you over.
Don't be afraid to take a break, or insert a lite workout day if your body needs a rest.
Train in all weather conditions, training doesn't get reduced because it's hot, cold, windy,rainy, etc.


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## JBS (Jan 6, 2015)

I'd posted earlier what helped me alot:

Deadlifting, squats, bent over rows, and seated rows- power movements with heavier weight and fewer reps- these are all exercises that will help you with rucking.   In addition, I saw many injuries occur on uneven terrain.  You can build up the tiny support muscles by doing other kinds of excercises, like lunges with dumbells.  These will hit the quads and hams, plus muscles that support the knees.   Incorporate calf raises in your trainign regimen in at least 3 positions- feet parallel, toes pointed in, and toes pointed out.  This can help reduce the chance of ankle injuries by touching those rarely used little support muscles supporting the ankle.

These aren't even military science, this is just basic athleticism.  If you get bigger and stronger, you'll have an easier time moving, carrying, and lifting heavy things.   For Marine Corps infantry, for example, that extra strength translates to helping you in other parts of your job, as well.   It might be humping an 81mm mortar base plate weighing 45 lbs...  It could be filling sandbags and hastily stacking them,  or slapping a 240G on top of your existing gear, or in other cases maybe helping an injured team mate by throwing his ruck on top of your own, and humping it back in for him.


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## Nbrac27 (Jan 6, 2015)

The reason I asked for a good base plate to start off of was due to not wanting to try to go balls to the wall as a start point and injuring something. I normally feel I do too little, and then end up doing too much. But thank you everyone for the solid feed back and help.

Heres another question, that relates to my last statement. Rucking and swimming on the same days, would that be more helpful or harmful? I used to do two a days in the gym, plus whatever it is we did for PT that day, and ended up doing more harm than good. Would that be walking that gray line of 'over working' muscles?


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## ShadowSpear (Jan 6, 2015)

Nbrac27 said:


> The reason I asked for a good base plate to start off of was due to not wanting to try to go balls to the wall as a start point and injuring something. I normally feel I do too little, and then end up doing too much. But thank you everyone for the solid feed back and help.
> 
> Heres another question, that relates to my last statement. Rucking and swimming on the same days, would that be more helpful or harmful? I used to do two a days in the gym, plus whatever it is we did for PT that day, and ended up doing more harm than good. Would that be walking that gray line of 'over working' muscles?



Just work yourself from a to z at a reasonable pace, but don't be afraid to push yourself.  There's nothing wrong with rucking and swimming (not at the same time ), mainly because there isn't any impact in the latter.  The last thing you want is shin splints/stress fractures from being too gung-ho, so keep the "impact" to your bones in the back of your mind.


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## DA SWO (Jan 6, 2015)

ShadowSpear said:


> Just work yourself from a to z at a reasonable pace, but don't be afraid to push yourself.  There's nothing wrong with rucking and swimming (not at the same time ), mainly because there isn't any impact in the latter.  The last thing you want is shin splints/stress fractures from being too gung-ho, so keep the "impact" to your bones in the back of your mind.


Just remember your arms and legs use different motions when swimming, so start slow, and start finning early on as that is another entirely different motion.


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## Ooh-Rah (Jan 6, 2015)

@Nbrac27 , should be obvious, but I've seen lots of folks trying to hit a certain weight fill their packs with rock salt.  Please do not do this, it will carry differently on your shoulders (pulling straight down).  Find enough clothing, gear, and maybe one small 10 pound weight packed in the middle.

Also, watch a few Youtube videos on carrying a pack, amazing how different it can be if you know what all those little straps do!


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## Nbrac27 (Jan 7, 2015)

Thank you everyone, you've given me more useful information that I could've hoped for from this. I'm going to be incorpating every thing I can into what I already do and what I'll be starting.

Going to be working hard on the rucking and swimming (no fins) to begin, and then will move into tackling the finning beast once I can find a good place to do so (I dont think my local gym will allow to me to use fins in their pool) and someone to mentor me in the ways of doing so correctly and effectively. It seems everything I've read on here and researched about finning is that it is its own monster in itself and there are a lot of ways to do it incorrectly.


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## BloodStripe (Jan 8, 2015)

Are you not AD?


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## pardus (Jan 8, 2015)

Complicated question...

Some members here have extensive knowledge and experience with rucking.

First of all, purchase a copy of Get Selected For Special Forces 

Like others have said, the best way to train for rucking, is to ruck.
Start light, start low mileage. @x SF med gave you a good start point. Don't go over 55lbs.

Feet and boots are paramount. Prepare them both VERY well.
Not all rucking is the same. Some are fast and furious <12 miles, some are longer and rougher, cross country 40miles (ish).

What I found particularly important muscle wise were hip flexors (particularly for fast rucking), shins and trapezius. Though all the back, legs and core were heavily involved. 
Exaggerated, across body arm swing is very important for fast rucking, carrying a rifle, stick etc... helps with this. 
Bottom line, read the book I suggested above, find someone who is truly proficient in rucking to give you personal instruction.

Remember, rucking sucks (sometimes in a good way), pain is normal, but injury isn't. 

It's a mental game, good luck.


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## x SF med (Jan 8, 2015)

Nbrac27 said:


> Thank you everyone, you've given me more useful information that I could've hoped for from this. I'm going to be incorpating every thing I can into what I already do and what I'll be starting.
> 
> Going to be working hard on the rucking and swimming (no fins) to begin, and then will move into tackling the finning beast once I can find a good place to do so (I dont think my local gym will allow to me to use fins in their pool) and someone to mentor me in the ways of doing so correctly and effectively. It seems everything I've read on here and researched about finning is that it is its own monster in itself and there are a lot of ways to do it incorrectly.





And now to finning....   relax your knees, use your quads, glutes and gut for the power use your gut and back for stabilization, but relax.  think how a walrus or a flat fish undulates to get p0wer, and use the rhythm of both legs to propel you.   Start on back finning, then switch to belly and then learn to roll right and left to switch.


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## policemedic (Jan 8, 2015)

You're in PA... Are you near Philly?


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## Nbrac27 (Jan 8, 2015)

@ SOTGWarrior I am AD, I'm just filling an I&I billet currently so I'm stuck as one of the AD Marines on a Reserve Station overseeing and making sure the Reserve Unit does what it needs and gets the training and what not that it requires.

@pardus I will defnitely get a copy of that book and start reading through it, thank you for the info!


@x SF med I will have to start practicing finning once I can find a good outlet to do so. I've read a lot on here and various other MARSOC articles about not getting good fins due to using what you are issued, so should I just look into a run of the mill average pair to start working with?

@policemedic No unfortunetly I am right outside of Pittsburgh.


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## x SF med (Jan 8, 2015)

Nbrac27 said:


> @ SOTGWarrior I am AD, I'm just filling an I&I billet currently so I'm stuck as one of the AD Marines on a Reserve Station overseeing and making sure the Reserve Unit does what it needs and gets the training and what not that it requires.
> 
> @pardus I will defnitely get a copy of that book and start reading through it, thank you for the info!
> 
> ...



I'm not sure what you'll be issued at A&S...  Plain old jet fins with scuba booties.


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## policemedic (Jan 8, 2015)

Nbrac27 said:


> @policemedic No unfortunetly I am right outside of Pittsburgh.



You poor bastard.   

There is a rucking group in Philly run by a prior service Marine who is now a cop.  If you ever get over to Philly, you may be able to hook up with them. Should you ever get here, PM me and I'll give you the info.


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## x SF med (Jan 9, 2015)

Here's the link to the fins we used when I was in....   http://www.scubapro.com/en-US/USA/fins/products/jet-fins.aspx


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## surgicalcric (Jan 18, 2015)

TLDR20 said:


> ...having bigger shoulders might make it hurt a bit less.



From someone with large shoulders, having large trapezius muscles actually makes it hurt worse due to the straps riding on muscle instead of bony structures. 

To the OP:   Others have said it so I won't repeat the overall point.  As for the gym, gains in overall power, strength and endurance can be gained in the gym.  Squats, deadlifts, weighted calf raises, leg press w/ lower weight higher reps will all help if you are limited in the time available to train.  However if time is a premium I would spend it under a ruck not doing a WOD or curls..

Crip


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## 8654Maine (Jan 19, 2015)

Vary the terrain.

Don't just follow trails or paths.

Ruck up and down hills.  Ruck in wet mud and swamps.  Ruck when it's hot, cold, and wet.

Ruck through the nastiest, gnarliest vines and bushes you can find.

Whatever you do, always let someone know where you are.

Sleep with your ruck, rest with your ruck, eat with it.

When rucking becomes second nature, when it becomes just another tool for you to accomplish something else, then you will own it, instead of it owning you.

Rucking is a means to an end.  Don't let it get a life of it's own.

Also, work out, eat right, and jack off whenever you can.


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