# An armed guy walks into a Walmart....



## BloodStripe (Aug 9, 2019)

With regards to the off duty firefighter that held up a guy at Walmart who had body armor and an AR, did the "suspect" actually commit any crimes other than inciting fear? Could the firefighter be charged with unlawful detention?


----------



## Blizzard (Aug 9, 2019)

BloodStripe said:


> With regards to the off duty firefighter that held up a guy at Walmart who had body armor and an AR, did the "suspect" actually commit any crimes other than inciting fear? Could the firefighter be charged with unlawful detention?


Inciting fear/disorderly conduct/disturbing the peace...I'm sure the LEOs here could come up with some others.  Regardless of his intent, it was fucking stupid.  

No chance the firefighter would not be charged, especially in today's climate.


----------



## Bambi (Aug 9, 2019)

He apparently was recording himself shopping? Either he was planning to do harm and record it for the world to see, or he was one of those guys who go out and record themselves doing public demonstrations of open carry. But having over 100 rounds of ammunition, me thinks the first option. Either way, stupid to do.


----------



## medicchick (Aug 9, 2019)

Considering this wasn't just having a pistol on your hip and have been wearing it all day he had a plan. There is video of him in the parking lot putting everything on.  However I see them digging into his background and just getting a slap on the wrist. He's lucky he didn't pay the stupid tax.


----------



## LibraryLady (Aug 9, 2019)

medicchick said:


> ...He's lucky he didn't pay the stupid tax...


Wonder if it can be applied retroactively, just because...

LL


----------



## Gunz (Aug 9, 2019)

Here's one with his face not blurred...just in case you run into him. 

Looks like a dweeb mall ninja. My guess is, if he were planning to kill he would've started killing with the off-duty fire fighter. As it is, he'll get a shitload of charges, get a check-up from the neck up and be back on the street next week pending court appearances.

Pulling a stunt like this right after a mass shooting at Walmart, he needs a fucking bullet right between the peepers.

Honestly, under the circumstances, if I were at Walmart carrying and some dude sauntered in with that get-up, I'd have that 1911 out and pointed at his face.


----------



## BloodStripe (Aug 9, 2019)

Is it illegal to wear that? Or are we just going to start pointing guns at people dressed in a way we don't like?


----------



## Blizzard (Aug 9, 2019)

BloodStripe said:


> Is it illegal to wear that? Or are we just going to start pointing guns at people dressed in a way we don't like?


Illegal to wear? No.  Fucking stupid?  Hell, yeah!  

And keep in mind it wasn't just how he was dressed, it was also that this douche canoe had an AR strapped to him along with a pistol.  Context is important and just because something is legal doesn't necessarily make it a good idea.

Kudos to the firefighter for drawing down on him.


----------



## SaintKP (Aug 9, 2019)

I agree with @BloodStripe  on this, assuming the guy had all the proper documents he isn't breaking any laws that we can see.

Is he a raging cunt with no situational awareness that only buys 5.11 while hugging a ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ body pillow? Yeah, probably.

But the guy is only guilty of being an asshole.


----------



## BloodStripe (Aug 9, 2019)

Blizzard said:


> Illegal to wear? No.  Fucking stupid?  Hell, yeah!
> 
> And keep in mind it wasn't just how he was dressed, it was also that this douche canoe had an AR strapped to him along with a pistol.  Context is important and just because something is legal doesn't necessarily make it a good idea.
> 
> Kudos to the firefighter for drawing down on him.



So again, are we just going to point weapons at people dressed a way we don't like? I agree that he's a fucking dumb ass, but the firefighter is just that, a firefighter not a police officer. Unless he was breaking a law, we can't just run around pointing guns at people, that's called assault.


----------



## BloodStripe (Aug 9, 2019)

The firefighter is lucky in that the other guy didn't shoot him. Missouri is a stand your ground state. You point a weapon at me, I'm going to say my life is in danger.

Missouri Self-Defense Laws - FindLaw


----------



## Brill (Aug 9, 2019)

BloodStripe said:


> So again, are we just going to point weapons at people dressed a way we don't like?



Yes.

We should incorporate mandatory buybacks so law abiding citizens can voluntarily surrender their personal property so the property doesn’t hurt others.

The Left’s gun grab is just a smokescreen: they really want to confiscate our cars, which kill and injure way more Americans than guns. We must protect the children!


----------



## Grunt (Aug 9, 2019)

I would like to beat him with a baseball bat until I get tired and then rest a little and then beat him some more.

Clowns like that do nothing to fight for "their 2A rights" but they do hurt them! Congratulations idiot. Job well done.


----------



## Blizzard (Aug 9, 2019)

BloodStripe said:


> The firefighter is lucky in that the other guy didn't shoot him. Missouri is a stand your ground state. You point a weapon at me, I'm going to say my life is in danger.
> 
> Missouri Self-Defense Laws - FindLaw


Similarly, the guy is lucky the firefighter exercised self control.  I'm sure he wouldn't receive much criticism and, I almost guarantee, no prosecutor would bring charges had he decided to put a few rounds into the guys face.


----------



## BloodStripe (Aug 9, 2019)

Walking around with open carry is now a justifiable reason to use deadly force? Man, glad I don't live around you guys. Could you imagine how many more people would die by guns if we just shot every law abiding citizen who was carrying a firearm?


----------



## Grunt (Aug 9, 2019)

BloodStripe said:


> Walking around with open carry is now a justifiable reason to use deadly force? Man, glad I don't live around you guys. Could you imagine how many more people would die by guns if we just shot every law abiding citizen who was carrying a firearm?



If you are talking to me, I didn't say or imply that. But, I do think he is probably one of the same tools that gripes about LE dressing like that because they are too "militarized." I see people open carry all the time and never ever contemplate using deadly force on them. But hey, to each their own.


----------



## BloodStripe (Aug 9, 2019)

Grunt said:


> If you are talking to me, I didn't say or imply that. But, I do think he is probably one of the same tools that gripes about LE dressing like that because they are too "militarized." I see people open carry all the time and never ever contemplate using deadly force on them. But hey, to each their own.


Negative brother, it was for @Blizzard. While hard to take the side of the dumb ass, I don't think we should be allowed to shoot whomever we want just because. We are a land of laws and until it is illegal to carry, we shouldn't have open season on law abiding citizens.


----------



## Grunt (Aug 9, 2019)

BloodStripe said:


> Negative brother, it was for @Blizzard. While hard to take the side of the dumb ass, I don't think we should be allowed to shoot whomever we want just because. We are a land of laws and until it is illegal to carry, we shouldn't have open season on law abiding citizens.



Gotcha. Sorry if it came across as me being a tool. I do agree wholeheartedly with you concerning this quoted post. Personally, I hate when people do what that guy did. If he wants to open carry in Walmart, there are ways to do it without being a tool. There are some things that "just because one can do it" doesn't necessarily mean they *should* as I believe the case to be with this guy. I just think he could make his point in a better way to where even gun supporters like myself don't find him to be acting like a clown.

But, at the end of the day...it doesn't mean he should be shot for it either....


----------



## BloodStripe (Aug 9, 2019)

It's all good, bro. While I may disagree with him on this particular matter, we are still a family here. We may not always agree on everything, but if you fuck with my family, you are fucking with me too.


----------



## Blizzard (Aug 9, 2019)

BloodStripe said:


> Negative brother, it was for @Blizzard. While hard to take the side of the dumb ass, I don't think we should be allowed to shoot whomever we want just because. We are a land of laws and until it is illegal to carry, we shouldn't have open season on law abiding citizens.


I understand your viewpoint and, in principle, you're not wrong.  However, as I said earlier, context is everything (saddling up in the parking lot of a Walmart and strolling on in while filming himself....that's not normal behavior).  If a person is stupid enough to put themselves into this situation given recent events of the past week or so, no one should be surprised if someone else challenges and possibly shoots that person dead on the spot.  Maybe the shooter would technically be in the wrong but the ding-dong would be dead.  Lose-lose.  Actions have consequences.  Do you think any prosecutor would bring charges in this circumstance?  I don't.


----------



## Brill (Aug 10, 2019)

BloodStripe said:


> every law abiding citizen who was carrying a firearm



Is considered a criminal in my state.


----------



## Gunz (Aug 10, 2019)

BloodStripe said:


> Is it illegal to wear that? Or are we just going to start pointing guns at people dressed in a way we don't like?



You're minimizing the perception. Look at that kid. He walks into a Walmart a week after two mass shootings--one at a Walmart--geared up like that...you see him and you're going to think, hey, this is normal? Just another good citizen exercising his 2A rights? All I'm saying is under those circumstances, my hand is on my gun and I'm mentally prepping for contact or flight.

Do you think the off-duty firefighter should not have intervened? If that kid didn't intend to kill anybody, he was at least sure to set off a panic.


----------



## LibraryLady (Aug 10, 2019)

Can we say scrambling for an excuse for a hopefully, eventually, terminal case of stupid?

LL

An armed man who caused panic at a Walmart in Missouri says it was a 'social experiment'


----------



## Brill (Aug 10, 2019)

LibraryLady said:


> Can we say scrambling for an excuse for a hopefully, eventually, terminal case of stupid?
> 
> LL
> 
> An armed man who caused panic at a Walmart in Missouri says it was a 'social experiment'



Agree it wasn’t smart but DA Patterson’s assertion that the accused’s ACTIONS were equivalent to SPEECH is a bit of a reach.

Here’s same story from NYP but different spin.

Man who walked into Walmart with ‘tactical rifle’ says he was testing 2nd amendment

An article about MO’s terrorist threat law:

Here's How Missouri Law Defines Making A Terrorist Threat, Second Degree

I think criminalizing the conduct lawful activities will make for an interesting precedent.

Personally, I wouldn't open carry (where lawful) in a building (outside of Alaska) because presence of gun minus badge scares people. Concealed, in my opinion, is the way to go and don’t see any advantage over open.


----------



## Gunz (Aug 10, 2019)

I've carried concealed for 40 years. Best to be the Gray Man.


----------



## Ooh-Rah (Aug 10, 2019)

*25 posts...too much discussion for a random thread.

Merged and new thread created.*


----------



## Isiah6:8 (Aug 10, 2019)

Isn’t there a recording from the phone of the AR carrier?  I only ask because from an article I read and now am having trouble finding the fireman initially approached the person, asked a question or questions then drew. If that is accurate, I believe from the woman in the car perspective, was he justified in drawing and holding the AR person there if there was a lot of chaos going on from the AR person?

I guess if the phone was still recording that would probably answer more questions.


----------



## Diamondback 2/2 (Aug 12, 2019)

If everyone carried an AR15 there wouldn't be mass shootings.

That said, I haven't seen a video or read the story so my opinion is moot. I was not a fan of the open carry Texas movement, I think they caused a lot of uproar,  however they did get some towns to get right on the laws of the State and they did get some laws changed. So I guess it wasn't all bad.

It's one thing to have a weapon chow slung, or in a holster as you are out doing whatever, it's another thing to have it slung at the ready walking around being a tactical clownshoe. In todays social setting people have to be situationally aware and on guard. If that means a dumbass doing dumbass shit right after two mass shootings gets a gun put in his face, well it's better than the alternative.


----------



## DocCallahan (Aug 12, 2019)

The kid made a poor decision upon poor judgement. 

It’s a poor argument to say are we going to point weapons at people based on how they’re dressed? No, not at all. However we might point guns at someone based on their threat posture. I mean it’s not an outfit, who wakes up and looks at their clothes and thinks “I’ll wear my plates so I can get extra warm and sling my rifle so it can get in the way of me carrying things or bounce off my legs with every step”?

Plate carrier, AR15 with mag inserted and ready for draw, he was attempting to make a statement. Unbeknownst to me, however that’s a bad move. 

I’m all for my AR’s and having them around, but I don’t go around striking fear in mostly unarmed civilians. It’s unbecoming and unprofessional. If you’re that afraid of Walmart, you shouldn’t shop at Walmart. 

Plus I sure get sick and tired of wearing plates and toting my M4 around for no reason at all, why would anyone want to do it in civie mode?

Did the civilian make the right call? He is a firefighter but he is off duty, he’s not acting as a firefighter. 

Should he have confronted the kid unarmed and risk having a weapon in his face? Should he draw on the kid and risk a charge on himself based on his personal assessment of the risk to the greater population around him?
Would the kid been friendly and clear he is expressing his rights? Would he quickly agitate and raise his weapon? 

All we know for certain is the man who confronted the kid carried for protection and was not a threat to the public, we do not know the kids intent. Based off their posture.

I may be wrong, maybe I’m not. 

I like my guns, I like your guns.


----------



## Marauder06 (Aug 13, 2019)

I loathe open carry of long guns in public places, especially as part of “Second Amendment audit” attention whoring. But I’m pretty sure it’s not illegal.  

Pointing a gun at someone who isn’t doing anything illegal is... illegal.


----------



## policemedic (Aug 13, 2019)

Tagged for later.


----------



## Gunz (Aug 13, 2019)

Common sense. There is none in this case. Stupid should hurt.


----------



## LibraryLady (Aug 13, 2019)

Ocoka said:


> Common sense. There is none in this case. Stupid should hurt.


Common sense... isn't.

Stupid should hurt though generally it doesn't, but occasionally Darwin Awards. Chlorinating The Gene Pool.

LL


----------

