# Another U-Boat Found off NC



## AWP (Oct 21, 2014)

Rather amazing it is in such good shape. Unless the depth charges damaged the right side of the U-boat or a lucky round hit the right place, the silhouette is perfect.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/21/us/north-carolina-u-boat-wreck/index.html?hpt=hp_t2


> The German sub, the U-576, was found at the bottom of the Atlantic 30 miles off Cape Hatteras and just 240 yards from an American merchant ship, the merchant tanker Bluefields, which was part of a 24-ship U.S. convoy heading from Virginia to Key West, Florida, on July 14, 1942.


 
http://sanctuaries.noaa.gov/news/oct14/ks-520.html

http://monitor.noaa.gov/news/pdfs/pr102114.pdf


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## pardus (Oct 21, 2014)

Very cool!

I can't quite fathom why on earth the U-Boat commander surfaced following the attack. A seemingly foolish move, and a fatal one.


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## Kraut783 (Oct 21, 2014)

That is awesome......WWII is such an interesting conflict to look back on and analyze.


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## Blizzard (Oct 22, 2014)

Kraut783 said:
			
		

> That is awesome......WWII is such an interesting conflict to look back on and analyze.


The U boat stuff along the East Coast is very interesting.  Most people don't realize that at times U boats were even in our harbors, not just miles off shore, to the point where a handful of German saboteurs even came ashore.


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## AWP (Oct 22, 2014)

Blizzard said:


> The U boat stuff along the East Coast is very interesting.  Most people don't realize that at times U boats were even in our harbors, not just miles off shore, to the point where a handful of German saboteurs even came ashore.



A group landed IVO of what is now the PGA at Sawgrass. Clay Blair's excellent series even recounted subs which were 40' of water in broad daylight. At least one tanker in the Jacksonville, FL area burned bright enough to illuminate beachgoers one evening. The war was on our doorstep in '42. There is a sunken U-boat in the Gulf Mexico and they were torpedoing ships leaving the Mississippi.


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## pardus (Oct 22, 2014)

A pretty good write up of the Nazi saboteurs 

 http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/history/famous-cases/nazi-saboteurs


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## RackMaster (Oct 22, 2014)

There was battles in the Gulf of St Lawrence.

http://www.veterans.gc.ca/eng/remembrance/history/second-world-war/battle-gulf-st-lawrence/intro

Possible in the Labrador River.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfo...-may-be-at-bottom-of-labrador-river-1.1164735


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## Gunz (Oct 22, 2014)

Incredible sonar profile.

U-Boats typically surfaced to finish their merchant victims off with the deck-mount to save torpedoes. But in this case, the sub had suffered severe damage to its main ballast tank prior to the engagement, so the surfacing was most likely inadvertent.


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## Centermass (Oct 23, 2014)

Blizzard said:


> The U boat stuff along the East Coast is very interesting.  Most people don't realize that at times U boats were even in our harbors, not just miles off shore,* to the point where a handful of German saboteurs even came ashore.*



They were looking for a Starbucks.....which had yet to be invented......got pissed off and left. 

Now if only these guys can find that nuke off of Tybee Island.


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## 8654Maine (Oct 23, 2014)

Blizzard said:


> The U boat stuff along the East Coast is very interesting.  Most people don't realize that at times U boats were even in our harbors, not just miles off shore, to the point where a handful of German saboteurs even came ashore.



I explored U-853 which sits only a few miles off the coast of Rhode Island.  The depth is attainable w/ scuba but you'll have to allot for decompression times.  There's a big blast hole for the entry.  Still has stuff and skeletons on board.  There have been a few diver deaths on that rig.


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## Kraut783 (Oct 23, 2014)

"There have been a few diver deaths on that rig."

Mysterious deaths ?


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## RackMaster (Oct 23, 2014)

Kraut783 said:


> "There have been a few diver deaths on that rig."
> 
> Mysterious deaths ?



Nazi ghosts taking their souls... :-/


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## AWP (Oct 23, 2014)

Kraut783 said:


> "There have been a few diver deaths on that rig."
> 
> Mysterious deaths ?


 
Some U-boats have claimed a few. Depth involved, guys getting trapped in the wreck, etc.


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## 8654Maine (Oct 24, 2014)

Kraut783 said:


> "There have been a few diver deaths on that rig."
> 
> Mysterious deaths ?



I don't know the circumstances.

On one of my dives, I got caught on something.  I had to ditch out of my BC and unhook my hose from a jagged protrusion.

No biggie but it could have went side ways.  There are tight spaces.

I do not scoff at the power of Davy Jones' Locker.


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## BloodStripe (Oct 25, 2014)

http://abc7chicago.com/archive/9108423/

I'd love dive down and see that. Hard to believe it went unknown in location for 70 years. 

Chicago also has another U boat, but that one it's in a museum.


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## AWP (Oct 25, 2014)

SOTGWarrior said:


> Chicago also has another U boat, but that one it's in a museum.


 
U-505 is a great exhibit. Anyone near Chicago should go take the tour.


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## AWP (Aug 9, 2015)

I'm necroposting this old thread because I (well, anyone) can.

I've posted about reading Blair's two part U-Boat series. Long, a bit dry, but fascinating books. That had me think things like how many boats were there, losses on one patrol, losses with all hands, etc.

Because I'm me (and stupid...okay, that's redundant) I decided to answer those questions.

The German U-boats of WWII (Kriegsmarine) and WWI (Kaiserliche Marine) - uboat.net

Using links from the above I created a spreadsheet with some basic data. I only bothered with simple math for the numbers below. I intend to dump these into a database to play with the total statistics later. Data I pulled from those links included # of Patrols, Year for the First Patrol, Was it Sunk on the First Patrol, Total # of Days Spent on Patrol, and whether or not the boat was lost with all hands.

For the 3 or 4 of you still reading....

Total # of boats commissioned: 1156. 301 never made a patrol (too late, schoolhouse, etc.) so 74% of the force made at least one patrol (I called these boats "Active"). Of those 301, 172 were the new Type XXI and XXIII "Elektro boats*."

428 boats were lost with all hands, 421 of those were Active. The remaining 7 were lost on works-ups or as part of the schoolhouse. Sorry about not being MOSQ'ed, you're dead. 49% of the Active U-boats were lost with all hands.

Of boats with only one patrol, 182 were lost on their first with 130 going down with all hands; 21% and 71% respectively.

Roughly 3 out of 4 U-boat sailors were casualties and somewhere around 750 boats were lost.

* - To add some perspective on the technology and evolutionary change in tactics to take advantage of this technology, many of these boats spent 6 months to a full year in work-ups and training. Only a handful (I think it was 7) made combat patrols with a few sinking ships. Several went into a convoy without detection. We seriously had nothing to combat these craft once they submerged.


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## Kraut783 (Aug 9, 2015)

Interesting locations of the U-Boat surrenders.


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## AWP (Aug 9, 2015)

pardus said:


> Very cool!
> 
> I can't quite fathom why on earth the U-Boat commander surfaced following the attack. A seemingly foolish move, and a fatal one.



I'm only up to '43 or so in the war, but some many of those cases were things like heavy damage to the boat, perceived heavy damage to the boat (some captains lost their nerve, some thought chlorine gas* was escaping, a few thought they could escape on the surface, I think one thought he could surface and use the gun to sink a merchant ship...but it was armed and both went down, etc. Some were just ineptly handled and a few had an "itchy neck" and were a bit overzealous in their pursuit of a Knight's Cross.

U-boat losses have some odd stories. Quite a few were rammed, mined, plain luck by an attacking ship or aircraft, I think one or two were lost when a captain an engineering officer didn't communicate and the latter scuttled the ship. More than a few boats were damaged and forced down to over 700 feet (one made it to a thousand without loss), a few commanders had a nervous breakdown, and one killed himself in the control room.

I think the most "amazing"  loss is the U-boat (1206) sunk when its toilet malfunctioned with another (132) by a ship it targeted...when the ship blew up.


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## pardus (Aug 9, 2015)

Freefalling said:


> I'm only up to '43 or so in the war, but some many of those cases were things like heavy damage to the boat, perceived heavy damage to the boat (some captains lost their nerve, some thought chlorine gas* was escaping, a few thought they could escape on the surface, I think one thought he could surface and use the gun to sink a merchant ship...but it was armed and both went down, etc. Some were just ineptly handled and a few had an "itchy neck" and were a bit overzealous in their pursuit of a Knight's Cross.
> 
> U-boat losses have some odd stories. Quite a few were rammed, mined, plain luck by an attacking ship or aircraft, I think one or two were lost when a captain an engineering officer didn't communicate and the latter scuttled the ship. More than a few boats were damaged and forced down to over 700 feet (one made it to a thousand without loss), a few commanders had a nervous breakdown, and one killed himself in the control room.
> 
> I think the most "amazing"  loss is the U-boat (1206) sunk when its toilet malfunctioned with another (132) by a ship it targeted...when the ship blew up.



Fascinating. A mate of mine dove a U Boat in Long Island sound years ago, that would be an amazing experience (the bastard also dove Truk Lagoon and Scapa Flow).

Have you by chance read Iron Coffins by Herbert Werner?


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## AWP (Aug 9, 2015)

pardus said:


> Fascinating. A mate of mine dove a U Boat in Long Island sound years ago, that would be an amazing experience (the bastard also dove Truk Lagoon and Scapa Flow).
> 
> Have you by chance read Iron Coffins by Herbert Werner?



No, but that's on a lengthy list of books I want to read.


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## pardus (Aug 9, 2015)

Freefalling said:


> No, but that's on a lengthy list of books I want to read.



You and me both...


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## Red Flag 1 (Aug 10, 2015)

The Eastcoast of the US was great place for the Greman U-boats to run up some tonnage. The DOD saw no reason to dim/blacken the Eastvoast. All the U-boats had to do was get there. They would observe Naval/Merchant traffic with great backlighting from every house, business, and auto traffic. They sank all manner of allied sailing vessels. It stands to reason, that with so many German U-boats taking part in the action, that there are quite a few U-boats that were sank there as well.


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## Red Flag 1 (Aug 10, 2015)

pardus said:


> Fascinating. A mate of mine dove a U Boat in Long Island sound years ago, that would be an amazing experience (the bastard also dove Truk Lagoon and Scapa Flow).
> 
> Have you by chance read Iron Coffins by Herbert Werner?




That is one of the better books written by naval U-boaters!!!!


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## AWP (Aug 10, 2015)

Red Flag 1 said:


> The Eastcoast of the US was great place for the Greman U-boats to run up some tonnage. The DOD saw no reason to dim/blacken the Eastvoast. All the U-boats had to do was get there. They would observe Naval/Merchant traffic with great backlighting from every house, business, and auto traffic. They sank all manner of allied sailing vessels. It stands to reason, that with so many German U-boats taking part in the action, that there are quite a few U-boats that were sank there as well.



Blair disputes this somewhat based in part upon interviews with surviving skippers (Reinhard Hardegen who sank a tanker off the coast of Jacksonville Beach, FL is still alive. He had either the highest or second highest tonnage sunk off of the US coast). His contention (and Blair was a US sub officer in the Pacific) is that a number of environmental factors had to be right for coastal lights to help the U-boats. They weren't the 24/7 menace they are made out to be. He did state that several skippers benefitted from our lack of a blackout, but the bulk of our losses in early 42 were due to bad decisions, lack of available air and surface craft, and poor TTPs. He touched upon the economic argument made by local governments, but never took a side or followed up his paragraph or two on the subject.


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