pardus
Verified Military
- Joined
- Sep 7, 2006
- Messages
- 10,535
Kiwi Ranger Course
- Thread starter pardus
- Start date
Cool photos. Looks like the photographer paid attention! The exercise about making an improvised shotgun brought back memories of a trip to the Police Armoury, where they showed us a bunch of them made by gang members. Very simple to make.
J Hats are a mixed bag dude but the wide brims are still around. You can literally get issued a diesel pattern J Hat from the Q.
The Aumangea course, ummm yeah. I'm glad the tab doesn't say Ranger because it would be the biggest act of disrespect we committed to the USA since we sent Temuera Morrison over there.
The Aumangea course, ummm yeah. I'm glad the tab doesn't say Ranger because it would be the biggest act of disrespect we committed to the USA since we sent Temuera Morrison over there.
What's with the meditation? Cloud bursting?
Nah... you sent us Pardus too, that was damned disrespectful of you friggin kiwis....
and you sent him here through a bunch of other Commonwealth and non-Commonwealth countries that insisted he move on...:eek:Friggin bastiges, no wonder we hate you kiwis... :-|
Good initial post from Pardus, bad follow up by Mac....
Flagg
Verified Military
Yoga.
It's been done on all three Courses to date.
Trying to help reduce injuries and medical withdrawals.
I did the 2nd one, helped with the 3rd, and currently working on prep for the 4th.
No staring at goats. Eating goats maybe, but no staring. :)
So he's ruined?
Flagg
Verified Military
Happy to share more about it from a candidate's perspective and junior instructor's perspective.
There are skeptics and there are supporters, including folks in the Unit and positions of influence throughout the DF.
It's still a bit of a laboratory as each one has been a bit different but achieving the same endstate.
Having had a lot of face time with the Course manager/creator, including this entire past week, I understand what he is trying to accomplish and why.
I'm what got pooped out the back end of the course and I'm personnaly quite grateful for the opportunity to have had so much face time with some legends in our own community. It is truly the hardest thing I've ever done.
Sorry for the necro response I only just found this thread on a Google mission regarding course version 4.0.
Happy to answer any questions if I can.
Hopefully over time the course continues to grow, evolve, and build it's own independant sense of Mana.
Time will tell.
pardus
Verified Military
- Joined
- Sep 7, 2006
- Messages
- 10,535
He had nothing good to say about the course. I sat with him and an RSM (CSM) from the Australian and Dutch (IIRC) Army. They just ranted about the shitty instructors and shitty instruction given.
Said they were being taught stuff I learnt in my JNCO course in NZ.
The Aussie RSM was being forced to become an Instructor there for a year and was going out of his mind he was so pissed! lol
They did say the guys attending the course were good however, with particular praise for the 82nd and 101st E9's. Also said the fitness portion of the course was pretty demanding.
Flagg, I only observed the first two courses, wasn't able to attend the first one as Recon Ptl Comds was my focus at the time. However I am pretty sceptical about it. And yes, Danny B gave me his used car salesman speech about it 
I don't know where the course is at now. I know the last CO was sending all the new ruperts to BN on it as a matter of course.
I (and a lot of others in 2/1) had high hopes that the course would lead to the re-establishment of Ranger Coy in the Battalions but it didn't as you well know. To be honest it wasn't a course that interested me once I learned that, I had all the course quals that you walked out the end of it with already, if I felt the need to inflict some extra pain on myself I would have gone back up for a 9 day job interview. The BN didn't see it as a priority for Cpls and it wasn't in my banding stream so like a lot of other guys it became something that so and so went and did.
I think putting the tag "Ranger" on it is a bit like putting a Porshe emblem on a VW, sure they are both made in Germany but they aren't the same. However that seems to be SOP for NZDF these days. Say its just as good as such and such and it magically becomes so.
I don't know where the course is at now. I know the last CO was sending all the new ruperts to BN on it as a matter of course.
I (and a lot of others in 2/1) had high hopes that the course would lead to the re-establishment of Ranger Coy in the Battalions but it didn't as you well know. To be honest it wasn't a course that interested me once I learned that, I had all the course quals that you walked out the end of it with already, if I felt the need to inflict some extra pain on myself I would have gone back up for a 9 day job interview. The BN didn't see it as a priority for Cpls and it wasn't in my banding stream so like a lot of other guys it became something that so and so went and did.
I think putting the tag "Ranger" on it is a bit like putting a Porshe emblem on a VW, sure they are both made in Germany but they aren't the same. However that seems to be SOP for NZDF these days. Say its just as good as such and such and it magically becomes so.
Flagg
Verified Military
Yeah I was disappointed as well that Ranger Coy wasn't stood to.
As an aside to that last year I was given a copy of the NZ 1st Ranger Coy Op Ord, the NZ Army Ranger Manual, and a collection of photo slides from a few of the Original Rangers from 89-90. I'm hoping to publish it all in 2013, the 150th anniversary of the Bush Rangers.
I'm glad that used the word Aumangea on the tab. I feel that way for a number of reasons, not the least of which is the fact it is an assessment course rather than a very tough leadership school(as I understand it).
As far as the part about if you're interested in Selection you might as well do the real thing I wouldn't disagree as it's not a pre-Selection or prep course, but it would appear to be quite useful for those so inclined as the pass rate for Selection is a good bit higher for those who have completed the course. However the sample sizes are still small, so it's best to hold fire on that claim but the initial results look quite promising.
Another key point is folks asking what skills you gain from the course.
While candidates get hit with a firehose of knowledge and access to a further wealth of knowledge there are no qualifications gained. NO qualifications.
The focus of the course is assessing and developing qualities. Developing an SF like mindset to try and bridge a part of the divide between RF and SF. And that's where I believe it's the best course I've taken and a lot of other guys who've taken it are keen to be a part of it again.
I think I know all the 2/1 fellas who've been thru. A very good bunch of officers, JNCOs, and baggies. Some were peers, some were under assessment but I really do like and respect them all. 2/1 did take the effort to send some of their very best I reckon. They stood out in a good way as a home unit.
I've heard a lot of folks saying stuff like "Jumanji course". And the response is usually "give it a crack then take the piss".
I think the hard part is high ops tempo, critical manning, promotion/banding courses, needs of the unit type stuff and we come in behind all that with a course that has seen average weight loss around the 11+KG mark on average.
So where do we fit in the mix?
Last course was WAY oversubscribed, which apparantly upset some in 2/1 not getting as many slots as they had hoped since they were strong early supporters. This one not so much(oversubscribed that is).
But the course has seen those coming out the back end getting promoted earlier and having a much better than average chance of success completing Selection.
It's also opened up a lot of doors to folks in our community I wouldn't have had the chance to meet or get much facetime with. Now they are mentors happy to share the knowledge they gained on an ongoing basis.
How often do guys get the opportunity to have access to an ex Unit RSM keen to share his knowledge? And many others of his calibre as well.
One thing I have picked up on(in my perception) is that while training and equipment have improved in this last decade+ of conflict, has the average mindset changed to match the evolving threat?
Out of every 10 riflemen, when given an individual effort activity, how many will actually approach their true and honest potential?
I have a LOT of respect for the RF in the RNZIR, but I don't think the number would be very high. 1,2,3 at most in my opinion, without being given the tools to improve those percentages. It's human nature and naturalbhuman "programming".
The psychological side of it has been a very eye opening experience for me.
It was easy for me to say I KNOW I could physically achieve more than my mind will typically allow me to do(out of perceived self preservation).
But it really had a lot more gravity when I did it.
So while I also wonder where we fit in as well at times, I know that when the vast majority of the guys who did the course advocate for it and are gagging to help out on it(if released) is the measure of it for me.
If guys who did the course were really bagging it I'd be worried.
Just my opinion and experience with it.
I thought guys were coming off it with CLS and CQB Loaded onto Atlas?
Flagg
Verified Military
Nah mate. I could be wrong but I'm not aware of it being loaded as such on Atlas.
Both CQB and CLS are covered relentlessly.
And while I believe the guys achieve a very good standard, the skills training isn't really the purpose of the training if you get my drift.
Both CQB and CLS are covered relentlessly.
And while I believe the guys achieve a very good standard, the skills training isn't really the purpose of the training if you get my drift.
That part honestly suprised me.
