Kraut783
SOF Support
Thanks guys, this kind of stuff is always crazy.
A sad day for the soldier/seaman/airman on the ground.... (A-10/CAS Discussion)
- Thread starter Kraut783
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Nice to see the F-35 is on track. 
Only one of six Air Force F-35s could actually take off during testing
Only one of six Air Force F-35s could actually take off during testing
Devildoc
Verified Military
Nice to see the F-35 is on track.
Only one of six Air Force F-35s could actually take off during testing
I am a voracious reader, particularly news, one of my favorite sites is www.realclearpolitics.com. It's kind of a clearing house, and it has sub-categories, one of which is defense. Almost everyday there is at least one article about how effed up the F-35 project is. I don't know if it is or isn't, or if it just has early-stage teething problems like the Osprey had, but most of the press on it is quite negative.
TLDR20
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I saw a couple of them flying down in Charleston a few weeks back. They are pretty airplanes.
Devildoc
Verified Military
That they are. I saw the flying demo a couple years ago at the air show at Cherry Point. Cherry Point is the east coast base for the F-35 for the Marines so I imagine we'll see them more around the coast.
The F-35 is symptomatic of a larger, broken acquisition process. Instead of delivering a product that's mission capable we're delivering a product with the knowledge it isn't ready, but we'll fix it as we go. That drives up the cost substantially and one could argue increases the length of time it takes for IOC. It doesn't help that we're trying to build the "same" aircraft for 3 services. A Navy/ AF variant would benefit from not being saddled with the F-35B's VTOL accommodating fuselage. Look at the USS Gerald Ford and the LCS; this isn't a uniquely USAF problem.
I think the -35 will ultimately prove to be a badass, but way, way, way over budget, late to the billionth degree, and a jack-of-some-trades, master of none. I honestly don't think we need that many and would better served placing our money in existing technologies like the Silent Eagle and developing better data-sharing to leverage the -22 and -35's sensor arrays. Even the Navy acknowledges the -35 isn't a true solution, intending to field the F/A-18 until at least 2040. This doesn't even cover:
1. Using UAV's to handle SEAD/ DEAD, freeing up airframes and reducing that mission's risk.
2. Our overreliance on stealth which can be negated and a/c like the Silent Eagle or other semi-stealth/ low observable platforms have options available to them.
3. Quantity has a quality all its own.
4. "CAS, LOL" as the AF's position clearly indicates.
I think the -35 will ultimately prove to be a badass, but way, way, way over budget, late to the billionth degree, and a jack-of-some-trades, master of none. I honestly don't think we need that many and would better served placing our money in existing technologies like the Silent Eagle and developing better data-sharing to leverage the -22 and -35's sensor arrays. Even the Navy acknowledges the -35 isn't a true solution, intending to field the F/A-18 until at least 2040. This doesn't even cover:
1. Using UAV's to handle SEAD/ DEAD, freeing up airframes and reducing that mission's risk.
2. Our overreliance on stealth which can be negated and a/c like the Silent Eagle or other semi-stealth/ low observable platforms have options available to them.
3. Quantity has a quality all its own.
4. "CAS, LOL" as the AF's position clearly indicates.
TLDR20
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@Freefalling As to the UAV doing the SEAD mission I just read a book about a wild weasel F16 pilot, he talks at great length how the UAV would be almost useless in that role.
The guy with the most SAM kills? I haven't read it but I've seen an interview. It is on my To Read list.
TLDR20
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Yeah Viper Pilot by Dan Hampton. It is an enjoyable read. The dude is obviously quite full of himself though.
Well duh, he's a fighter pilot
Kraut783
SOF Support
a breath of fresh air....?
"McSally said she appreciates the pressure the Air Force is under to find cost savings, while at the same time modernizing its fleet, but argued that the A-10 and its close-air support capabilities are historically underappreciated."
"McSally also pointed out that, at least compared to some aircraft in the Air Force’s inventory, the A-10s aren’t even that old. The youngest B-52 bomber is 54 years old, yet the Air Force intends to fly that plane through 2040. By contrast, the A-10s were built in the late 1970s and were originally planned to fly until 2028."
McSally Wants To Tie A-10 Retirement To F-35 Flyoff
"McSally said she appreciates the pressure the Air Force is under to find cost savings, while at the same time modernizing its fleet, but argued that the A-10 and its close-air support capabilities are historically underappreciated."
"McSally also pointed out that, at least compared to some aircraft in the Air Force’s inventory, the A-10s aren’t even that old. The youngest B-52 bomber is 54 years old, yet the Air Force intends to fly that plane through 2040. By contrast, the A-10s were built in the late 1970s and were originally planned to fly until 2028."
McSally Wants To Tie A-10 Retirement To F-35 Flyoff
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A-10 would do well in Korea.
Iran may be a stretch, but again I think the crews would do well.
Iran may be a stretch, but again I think the crews would do well.
SpongeBob*24
Verified Military
I love this plane.....comms on this guy are the best out there right now.....
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Below the weather because it's 60s technology required him to be.
We'll be ok without the A-10, times have changed.
This is also a direct contradiction to the competence of the pilots. The wrong aircraft with the wrong tools, doing a job that he shouldn't be doing.
We have HARMs so pilots don't have to overfly missle sites in slow planes.
Agree, for some reason they were tasking A-10's to fly north and keeping the F-16's south, that changed shortly after this event. (I believe the book is called Warthog, A-10's in Desert Storm, my books are packed in anticipation of a move so I can't grab it.)
SpongeBob*24
Verified Military
The Charlie's are all upgraded....no more 1971 called and wants their cockpit back! The pilots can do word puzzles up there while jamming 9 lines and telling you about the Stanley Cup match u missed....
Dan Hampton is a former F-16CJ pilot who wrote a book about his career. Allegedly he had more SAM site kills than anyone at the time of his retirement and as a career CJ pilot his primary mission was SEAD/ DEAD/ Iron Hand/ Wild Weasel....whatever folks want to call it. He hated HARM's and carried CBU's when given the option. His argument was the same as many of the WW pilots in -105's during Vietnam. Even if you kill the radar (not a given) the missiles and techs are still alive; bombs prevent that from happening.
Was his book Viper Pilot?
Yes. Good book, classic fighter pilot arrogance, but is overall worth it considering his whole career, minus a stint with the Egyptians, was in CJ's doing the SEAD mission from Germany in the 80's, to both Iraq wars.
