MV-22

SpitfireV

Strike first, strike hard, no mercy!
Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2006
Messages
5,105
Location
New Zealand
So now that the MV-22 has been in service for a few years and I think is in service in Iraq, how have you guys in the USMC found it? I think it's a cool looking aircraft and an interesting concept but I'd be interested to hear about it from a "boots" position and how it actually performs.

Chur.
 

0699

Verified Military
Joined
Jan 22, 2007
Messages
3,549
Location
NoVa
Good aircraft. I was a very minor part of the OT&E team and got a few hours on it back in the '90s. In Iraq in 2007-2008 I had the opportunity to fly on it many times and found that they worked out most of the bugs that were identified during testing. Fast and reliable.
 

JohnnyBoyUSMC

Click, click, boom.
Verified Military
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Messages
659
Location
the bat cave
Flew in it when they were getting some of the kinks out...they wanted to test it with a full combat loaded platoon of Marines...I gotta say I was impressed, we all had some gallow's humor before hand, but we all liked it, smooth and fast ride! hell I took a damn nice nap in the back on the way back from the landing zone!

~JohnnyBoy
 

Cayenne6

Semi-Old Fart
Rest In Peace
Joined
Jun 10, 2008
Messages
35
Location
St. Petersburg, Fl.
My question about the Osprey is how will it perform in a jungle environment. In Nam if we didn't have a sit down LZ we could blow one big enough to get a 46 in if there were no more than a couple of trees. Take a tailgate extract where the chopper backed up to the side of the mountain with the tailgate down. We'd crawl under the back rotor then launch onto the Hellgate. Try to beat the gooks to a sit down if we weren't surrounded. Or take a SPIE.

The Osprey is huge so blowing an LZ is out of the question. Looks like with the tail a tailgate is also impossible. No telling how far a team would have to run to get to an area big enough for a sit down. That leaves the SPIE which would seem to be what would have to be used most of the time. Even for inserts. Having experienced all the above except the SPIE (my experience was the 100 ft. ladder which just predated the SPIE) I can't see how the Osprey would be of much good. Coming out of a hot LZ on a SPIE leaves those on the rig almost helpless. Every gook within sight is trying to cap you and/or the bird. Effective return fire is not all that great. The Osprey is a huge target and most likely heavily armored but it can be brought down. I've tried to look at it from every direction but the Osprey in a jungle environment is a recipe for disaster. A lot of guys would die before some other means would come about. Seems to me that something light weight and smaller would have to be used. That's what made the 46 and the Huey so valuable. They still are but are old and need replaced. Visited the Purple Fox a few years ago. Lot of patched over bullet holes from Nam.

I realize the Osprey fits the present war where there is plenty of flat ground but there are also mountains. Again, it's limited or so I would think. Jungle warfare may be decades down the road but seems like the Corps would be better off investing all that money into a vehicle that could handle any type of terrain.

Am I missing something?

6
 

Ajax

WWJCVDD?
Verified SOF
Joined
May 6, 2008
Messages
297
Location
Pac NW
I'm not a Marine, but I've had my fair share of Osprey rides. Kind of catches you off guard the first time you take off. Taxi, taxi, taxi, and off and up like a rocket. When you take off in a helo, that foward flare kind of negates any g's that might thow you backwards. Not so with the Osprey. Hang on to something. I'd be lying if I said my asshole wasn't puckered on my first ride with all the negative press it had in the testing phase.

For Cayenne's comments, I don't know about jungle stuff. Everywhere I've been in the jungle, the rotary aviation platforms were either host nation or contracted. The Osprey doesn't fall into either of those categories. For insertion, it does have FRIES capability. I would assume that a unit could conduct a SPIES extraction with this as well, but I haven't heard of anyone doing SPIES in today's full battle rattle (anyone else want to chime in on that?).
 
7

7point62

Guest
Take a tailgate extract where the chopper backed up to the side of the mountain with the tailgate down. We'd crawl under the back rotor then launch onto the Hellgate.


We did a tailgate extract during Typhoon Kate when our AO flooded bad. The 46 had to hover above chest-deep paddy water and the crewchief & right seat had to pull us in with all our gear. It was OK because we got a few nights behind sandbags & wire at LZ Baldy.
 

Cayenne6

Semi-Old Fart
Rest In Peace
Joined
Jun 10, 2008
Messages
35
Location
St. Petersburg, Fl.
Don't know that I ever new the storms name. Googled it to see when it was. Remember it well. Spent the night on a one foot ledge with our backs up against a rock formation. Tied our sling ropes to the guy beside us. We had hit a basecamp that afternoon in the Que Sons and had finally left loaded down with what we had captured just before dark. Stupid PL was trying to make us hump out of the draw in the dark. As point I was feeling the ground with the butt of my 16. Got out on that ledge and it started raining. PL didn't want to stop or go back to flat ground. Got to a point where my 16 hit nothing. Backed up and laid down sticking the 16 below me to see if there was anything there. Nothing. Told the PL it was insane to try any more and refused to go forward. He refused to go back. Miserable night. Afraid to go to sleep for fear off falling off the ledge. Nod off to feel the guys next to me pulling on the sling ropes to keep me from falling forward or catching the guys beside me falling forward. Only good thing was we were out of most of the wind.

Next morning when it got light enough to see there was enough open ground 15 feet below us to hold an entire plt. There was another 30 feet of ledge more narrow than where we were. Looked down the draw towards DaNang to see nothing but water in the valley. As bad as the night was I was thankful I wasn't a grunt.

Wasn't Baldy in the Que Sons? I was on so many LZs I can't remember most of them.

6
 

JJOIFVET

Verified SOF
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Messages
298
Location
Usually in a big desert
Last year I flew in an MH 53 that the airforce has, and this same aircraft was actually on the SON TAY RAID. It still had patched up bullet holes in it. I think it has since been retired, but very cool flying in a chopper that has that much history.
 

Pete S

Unverified
Joined
May 20, 2008
Messages
94
Location
Puget, WA
I don't like that the only weapon on the bird is on the ramp with a limited sector of fire.
Supposedly that is going to be fixed by a belly mounted 360 degree fire by wire gun.
I still haven't heard how the belly gun will affect fast roping.
Another thing I haven't heard is wheather or not the gun can be fired while the bird is set down.
I have heard from friends still in the Fleet that the rotor down wash while fastroping is
much worse then the CH-53.

Cayenne6, supposedly the MV-22 takes up similar LZ space as a 46.

Good idea, but I'm not sold on it yet.
Still wondering why the USMC didn't go with the Blackhawk.
 
7

7point62

Guest
Cayenne 6, LZ Baldy was about 8 klicks SW of Hoi An. Near Hawk Hill. Our AO was between Dien Ban and An Hoa.
 
7

7point62

Guest
I don't like that the only weapon on the bird is on the ramp with a limited sector of fire.
Supposedly that is going to be fixed by a belly mounted 360 degree fire by wire gun.
I still haven't heard how the belly gun will affect fast roping.
Another thing I haven't heard is wheather or not the gun can be fired while the bird is set down.
I have heard from friends still in the Fleet that the rotor down wash while fastroping is
much worse then the CH-53.

Cayenne6, supposedly the MV-22 takes up similar LZ space as a 46.

Good idea, but I'm not sold on it yet.
Still wondering why the USMC didn't go with the Blackhawk.

From what I've read and heard from winger buds the 22 is shaping up to be a great aircraft. I know Recon's been jumping from them, I'm sure MARSOC has. I love 46s, bro, I trust them and they got me out of some hot zones, but I'd sure like to ride an Osprey.

I don't know why the Corps didn't go with the BH, but it was kind of radical to go with the MV22...like the Harrier.
 
7

7point62

Guest
Last year I flew in an MH 53 that the airforce has, and this same aircraft was actually on the SON TAY RAID. It still had patched up bullet holes in it. I think it has since been retired, but very cool flying in a chopper that has that much history.



That's incredible.
 

Cayenne6

Semi-Old Fart
Rest In Peace
Joined
Jun 10, 2008
Messages
35
Location
St. Petersburg, Fl.
I don't like that the only weapon on the bird is on the ramp with a limited sector of fire.
Supposedly that is going to be fixed by a belly mounted 360 degree fire by wire gun.
I still haven't heard how the belly gun will affect fast roping.
Another thing I haven't heard is wheather or not the gun can be fired while the bird is set down.
I have heard from friends still in the Fleet that the rotor down wash while fastroping is
much worse then the CH-53.

Cayenne6, supposedly the MV-22 takes up similar LZ space as a 46.

Good idea, but I'm not sold on it yet.
Still wondering why the USMC didn't go with the Blackhawk.

Man, it's hard to believe something that big could take up similar LZ space as a 46. I'm a doubting Thomas on that.

A 46 only had two door gunners but there were plenty of windows to pop out. Doesn't look like it on the Osprey. Belly gun would seem to be useless on the ground.

The Osprey would be a replacement for the 53 in my books. They are as old as the 46s. Blackhawk would have been a better alternative.

6
 

Cayenne6

Semi-Old Fart
Rest In Peace
Joined
Jun 10, 2008
Messages
35
Location
St. Petersburg, Fl.
I think it has since been retired, but very cool flying in a chopper that has that much history.

The day I visited the Fox I wondered how many of the holes had been rounds aimed in my direction. Rode the Fox many a time. A huge honor helping to live their history. Still have one of their Give A Shit cards.

6
 

Cayenne6

Semi-Old Fart
Rest In Peace
Joined
Jun 10, 2008
Messages
35
Location
St. Petersburg, Fl.
Cayenne 6, LZ Baldy was about 8 klicks SW of Hoi An. Near Hawk Hill. Our AO was between Dien Ban and An Hoa.

I'm lost. Hoi An sounds familiar but don't know where it was. Spent my first three months in country with India 3/5 and operated out of An Hoa and the Hills around the Arizona. Have no idea where Hawk or Dien Ban were. After transferring to 1st Recon I operated in the mountains from NW of DaNang to down to Charlie Ridge then around to the Que Sons.

6
 

Pete S

Unverified
Joined
May 20, 2008
Messages
94
Location
Puget, WA
Man, it's hard to believe something that big could take up similar LZ space as a 46. I'm a doubting Thomas on that.

A 46 only had two door gunners but there were plenty of windows to pop out. Doesn't look like it on the Osprey. Belly gun would seem to be useless on the ground.

The Osprey would be a replacement for the 53 in my books. They are as old as the 46s. Blackhawk would have been a better alternative.

6

Considering how long the rotors on the 46 are I can believe it.
Think 46 side ways with shorter rotors.
Similar sized LZ, but the 46 will have one more oval and the MV-22 will have one more square/round.
 

Cayenne6

Semi-Old Fart
Rest In Peace
Joined
Jun 10, 2008
Messages
35
Location
St. Petersburg, Fl.
Considering how long the rotors on the 46 are I can believe it.
Think 46 side ways with shorter rotors.
Similar sized LZ, but the 46 will have one more oval and the MV-22 will have one more square/round.

Here is a flick of the new belly gun which would be useless on the ground. http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/ORD_RWS_RGS_on_MV-22_Slide_lg.jpg It also shows the two windows. Firing out them would be hampered by the engines.

Saw them in 05 from the fence surrounding the area. Would like to take a ride but no matter how I look at it the bird/plane wouldn't hold up to the requirements in a jungle environment.

Like I said, I could be way out in left field. By the time we fight a jungle war it may be older than the 46 and replaced or by something else coming into existence.

6
 

0699

Verified Military
Joined
Jan 22, 2007
Messages
3,549
Location
NoVa
Still wondering why the USMC didn't go with the Blackhawk.

Range, speed, carrying capacity. Osprey beats the BH in all these categories. I personally like the BH (got over 1500 crew hrs in them) but after being part of the OT&E team I understand why we chose the Osprey.
 
7

7point62

Guest
I'm lost. Hoi An sounds familiar but don't know where it was. Spent my first three months in country with India 3/5 and operated out of An Hoa and the Hills around the Arizona. Have no idea where Hawk or Dien Ban were. After transferring to 1st Recon I operated in the mountains from NW of DaNang to down to Charlie Ridge then around to the Que Sons.

6



Never thought I'd have to show a Recon guy a map. Baldy is over the hill from An Hoa. Hoi An's up on the coast. I know Ariz and Charlie Ridge. Dien Ban is also on the map, just N of the river.

que_son_valley1.jpg
 

Cayenne6

Semi-Old Fart
Rest In Peace
Joined
Jun 10, 2008
Messages
35
Location
St. Petersburg, Fl.
Never thought I'd have to show a Recon guy a map. QUOTE]

Sooner or later there is a first time for everything. Baldy was farther east than I thought it was. Might be wrong but I doubt I hit that vacation spot. Know for sure I was never at Ho An. So many spots with so little time.

6
 
Top