Navy says it is ready to end ban on women in submarines

Scotth

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Washington (CNN) -- Secretary of Defense Robert Gates has notified Congress of plans to allow women to serve aboard submarines, a Defense Department official said Tuesday.

Letters of intent were sent Monday to Congress, which has requested briefings on the matter, said the official, who asked not to be identified. There will be no vote on the matter in Congress.

The change was recommended by the chief of naval operations and the secretary of the Navy in addition to Gates, the official said, adding that there was no opposition to the move among Navy leaders.

A phased approach is being considered under which officers -- who already have separate living quarters -- would be the first to go co-ed, followed by crews, with the women bunking together, the official said. Crew space would have to be modified prior to that happening, the official added.

The submarines expected to carry women initially would be the larger ones -- nuclear-power, missile-carrying submarines known as SSBN and SSGN, the official said.

Women joined the crews of the Navy's surface ships in 1993, but officials had previously cited limited privacy and the cost of reconfiguring the vessels in arguing against their joining sub crews.

Last September, Chief of Naval Operations Adm. Gary Roughead described himself as "very comfortable addressing integrating women into the submarine force."

"Accommodations are a factor, but not insurmountable," he said
http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/02/23/women.sub.duty/index.html?hpt=T1

Never thought I would see this day in my life.
 

AWP

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I don't think this is a good idea, pretty surprised to see it.

I'm with you on this. One big issue will be if you modify berthing spaces for women, to make use of them you would essentially need to keep the same number of women on the boat at all times; do a 1-for-1 swap when one leaves. Otherwise, they will receive different living arrangements than men and that will breed some resentment.

Some things have changed here, but on some camps women once had the same number of toilets and showers as the men despite making up around 10% or so of the camp's population. I have no issue with women serving so long as they are treated the same as men.....which they are not and that is a problem.
 

HOLLiS

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A frog friend said of Sub-Mariners, 100 sailors go down, 50 couples come up. I wonder if he knew about this. The New Subs, are ships. I have a friend who is skipper of a squadron, I use to tease him about pig boats (old WWII diesels subs).
 

DA SWO

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Waste of money. We can't afford shit we need, but can afford $$$ to refit subs for wat reason? Will this enhance combat capabilities, and if so how? Good news is the SEALs get some tail when they are on the modified boats now.
 

Ranger Psych

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Other than the crew getting along in close quarters, I don't think it'd truly be THAT hard to do integration. You don't need new bathrooms, and you don't need new showers. If anything, schedule shift rotation so the women are getting off shift for shit and shower time where the males and females aren't vying for the showers. Normal duty day head calls just have a magnetic sign on the head door and bulkhead near it... if it's on the door it's whoever's using it. stand by till they're done.. if it's off the door it's free game. Toss a lock on the door so you don't have johnny jackass breaking in on jane taking a shit, or vice versa.
 

Scotth

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I agree with points made by both SOWT and Ranger Psych. Spending money to retrofit boats to make this work would be a big No Go, there are bigger priorities. If they can make it work with crapper signage and some kind of workable sleeping arrangement so be it. My buddy was on subs back in the 80's and he said they had a higher standard to get on a boat and if they hold women to the same standard that's what is important in my eyes.
 

QC

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"The submarines expected to carry women initially would be the larger ones." What are they? Ballast! }:-)
 

Manolito

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We have allowed women to go on sea trials on subs for years. Granted these are short periods of time compared to a see the world at eight knots cruise. I believe there are things in life that can be done but often shouldn't be done. Just another thing for the wifes of the sailors to worry about. They don't know where their husbands are at and now can worry about who is playing hide the little guy. I know about the mile high club and I wonder what they will call it on subs. Test depth being the ultimate goal? I got it in the sonar dome during an emergency blow. A little play on words. Welcome aboard!
 

MsKitty

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We have allowed women to go on sea trials on subs for years. Granted these are short periods of time compared to a see the world at eight knots cruise. I believe there are things in life that can be done but often shouldn't be done. Just another thing for the wifes of the sailors to worry about. They don't know where their husbands are at and now can worry about who is playing hide the little guy. I know about the mile high club and I wonder what they will call it on subs. Test depth being the ultimate goal? I got it in the sonar dome during an emergency blow. A little play on words. Welcome aboard!

OMG I'm laughing so hard...spoken like a true Navy guy!



I dated a bubblehead and lived near Kingsbay Sub base for 5 years, yes, sadly, I confess that. This has been the talk for years to let the women on the subs, most of the men are mixed opinions on this. Most of the guys don't even joke about the potential for fraternization as much as the things they'd have to deal with PMSing ALL at the same time, and the emotions that could occur after the first 30 days under and no land surfacing. Ironically, most of the wives that have the gold crew husbands and the blue crew boyfriends (or visa versa) complained about the potential for affairs, etc. I wonder if they would make birth control mandatory for any woman that goes on a boat. I'd like to know the statistics for pregnancies or SDT's that happen after a 90 day out cruise.

Next thing you know, someone will try to push for women SEALs......blasphemy!
 

LongTabSigO

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Why is it when the Dems are in power, they are hell-bent on screwing up the military?

As with open gays DADT changes, the question needs to be answered (and never is) is: How will the world's best military be made BETTER by the change?

Not "how do we appear better" or "how do we make certain segments of the population feel better about themselves".

Will this markedly improve the force such that all the upheaval it creates is justified?

Haven't heard a strong case for either situation made. Only the social engineering cases.
 

Scotth

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My buddy that was on subs back in the 80's had his boat dry-docked for upgrades. He always told me when he was in port going to a club it wasn't hard to get laid, it was hard to get laid by a single women.
 

AWP

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As with open gays DADT changes, the question needs to be answered (and never is) is: How will the world's best military be made BETTER by the change?

Exactly.

Our military doesn't exist to play for hugs and gold stars. we should look for better ways to do things, not the most "fair" for all parties involved.
 
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