Sig XM7

[Gunz]

1st Battalion, 506th Infantry Regiment, 101st, have now begun officially fielding this.

 

[Vulky]

1st Battalion, 506th Infantry Regiment, 101st, have now begun officially fielding this baby. Me wants.

View attachment 44396

Oooh she’s sexy…

 

[AWP]

Looking forward to the internet gun experts posting wherever 6-12 months from now about how they have a friend who said they were part of the test program and the weapon is (Insert Mad Libs gun review here).

AR15.com is gonna' be lit.

 

[Marauder06]

I was up at the SIG academy in New Hampshire last week and they have one on display that you can handle. It’s pretty heavy, but it has a lot of interesting features. They also had the new machine guns out.

View attachment IMG_0980.jpeg

 

[AWP]

It’s pretty heavy, but it has a lot of interesting features.

"How can our warfighter carry this in Afghanistan?!?!?!"
Bitch, the AFG isn't a thing.
"But, BUT....mountains!!!!!!!!!!"
Okay.
"It is too heavy!!!!!!!! Remember Vietnam!!!!!!!"
What the fuck?
"The Perfumed Princes don't care about the warfighter!!!"
Fuck off and pad your post count elsewhere.
"The Chinese will win because of the transgender agenda!!!!!!!"

And THAT thread will appear on "other sites" within a year. Bet a dollar. Any takers?

 

[Gunz]

I was up at the SIG academy in New Hampshire last week and they have one on display that you can handle. It’s pretty heavy, but it has a lot of interesting features. They also had the new machine guns out.

View attachment 44402

One of the few firearms companies still left in New England…the rest have fled south.

 

[R.Caerbannog]

I was up at the SIG academy in New Hampshire last week and they have one on display that you can handle. It’s pretty heavy, but it has a lot of interesting features. They also had the new machine guns out.

View attachment 44402

How heavy is it? From a MOUT perspective do you think it will fuck with guys ability to move and function? Cause it feels like the shit that's being designed is being engineered by pencil pushers, who don't have to hump that weight day in and day out.

"How can our warfighter carry this in Afghanistan?!?!?!"
Bitch, the AFG isn't a thing.
"But, BUT....mountains!!!!!!!!!!"
Okay.
"It is too heavy!!!!!!!! Remember Vietnam!!!!!!!"
What the fuck?
"The Perfumed Princes don't care about the warfighter!!!"
Fuck off and pad your post count elsewhere.
"The Chinese will win because of the transgender agenda!!!!!!!"

And THAT thread will appear on "other sites" within a year. Bet a dollar. Any takers?

Not trying to sound like a dick, but I thought you were a pog. When does carrying heavy shit, other than a to-go plate, bother you? Cause heavy weight will break you over time.

Also, next wars will likely be MOUT stuff and if we ever take the fight to the cartels the mountains again. Fun fact Northern Mexico has terrain very similar to A-stan.

 

[R.Caerbannog]

@AWP I say the above with love. I know we all are dependent on support.

 

[AWP]

How heavy is it? From a MOUT perspective do you think it will fuck with guys ability to move and function? Cause it feels like the shit that's being designed is being engineered by pencil pushers, who don't have to hump that weight day in and day out.


Not trying to sound like a dick, but I thought you were a pog. When does carrying heavy shit, other than a to-go plate, bother you? Cause heavy weight will break you over time.

Also, next wars will likely be MOUT stuff and if we ever take the fight to the cartels the mountains again. Fun fact Northern Mexico has terrain very similar to A-stan.

I'd explain my sarcasm, but you were infantry and probably not smart enough to get it.

Much love, we all need shooters.

 

[R.Caerbannog]

 

[Marauder06]

How heavy is it? From a MOUT perspective do you think it will fuck with guys ability to move and function? Cause it feels like the shit that's being designed is being engineered by pencil pushers, who don't have to hump that weight day in and day out.

It's heavy, but I didn't think it was unwieldy. It definitely weighs more than an M4, but it also had a big optic and a suppressor on it. IIRC the but stock folds, and I think (I have never fired it) you can fire it from that position if you are in super tight environments.

In IOBC I carried the SAW, and not only because that meant I didn't have to do road guard on forced marches and that I got put into the "support by sleep" position during our attacks and ambushes. That was a heavy and more-unwieldy weapon than this one. When I was a PL in the 101st I carried an M203 for a while for signaling over distance because it looked cool, and that was pretty heavy too. Which is one of the reasons I ultimately stopped carrying it :) That, and we never got any ammunition for it. Cool guy factor only goes so far.

 

[R.Caerbannog]

It's heavy, but I didn't think it was unwieldy. It definitely weighs more than an M4, but it also had a big optic and a suppressor on it. IIRC the but stock folds, and I think (I have never fired it) you can fire it from that position if you are in super tight environments.

In IOBC I carried the SAW, and not only because that meant I didn't have to do road guard on forced marches and that I got put into the "support by sleep" position during our attacks and ambushes. That was a heavy and more-unwieldy weapon than this one. When I was a PL in the 101st I carried an M203 for a while for signaling over distance because it looked cool, and that was pretty heavy too. Which is one of the reasons I ultimately stopped carrying it :) That, and we never got any ammunition for it. Cool guy factor only goes so far.

Honestly, it sounds like Joe is just gonna be carrying more weight. Here's hoping that optic and new round do what they're supposed to. One thing I keep seeing is that the weight of arms and armor keeps getting higher. Add drones in the open or CQB in a city and I dunno how things are gonna pan out.

Even if Joe comes out relatively unscathed, bro's body is fucked later on in life. If it's fixable good luck getting the VA to fix it or look forward to a lifetime of physical therapy.

Any word on exoskeletons?

 

[Marauder06]

Honestly, it sounds like Joe is just gonna be carrying more weight. Here's hoping that optic and new round do what they're supposed to. One thing I keep seeing is that the weight of arms and armor keeps getting higher. Add drones in the open or CQB in a city and I dunno how things are gonna pan out.

Even if Joe comes out relatively unscathed, bro's body is fucked later on in life. If it's fixable good luck getting the VA to fix it or look forward to a lifetime of physical therapy.

Any word on exoskeletons?

I recall a study I read once that an infantryman's load has stayed pretty consistent throughout the ages. I don't remember what the article was, I never fact checked it, and I could be remembering it wrong. But it makes sense to me. A conditioned human being can only carry so much weight. So maybe we don't need metal armor and steel weapons anymore, so now you can carry more powder and food.

We can now preserve food and have tablets to give you clean water, so now you can carry heavier weapons. Weapons just got lighter, more ammo. Now we have advanced body armor and a bunch of heavy comms gear? Fewer freedom seeds. So with some variance, in the last several hundred years the weight has generally been the same. Allegedly.

 

[R.Caerbannog]

I recall a study I read once that an infantryman's load has stayed pretty consistent throughout the ages. I don't remember what the article was, I never fact checked it, and I could be remembering it wrong. But it makes sense to me. A conditioned human being can only carry so much weight. So maybe we don't need metal armor and steel weapons anymore, so now you can carry more powder and food.

We can now preserve food and have tablets to give you clean water, so now you can carry heavier weapons. Weapons just got lighter, more ammo. Now we have advanced body armor and a bunch of heavy comms gear? Fewer freedom seeds. So with some variance, in the last several hundred years the weight has generally been the same. Allegedly.

I dunno brother. From what I've seen, Infantry units were chronically short on people. It meant you had to carry your gear and the equivalent gear of missing personnel. This was before they let women into combat arms. Even then we had slackers who would try and shunt off shit to others. Now add female soldiers to the mix.

Do you think Pvt Jill is going to carry her weight or have it shunted off to Pvt Snuffy?

I'm glad the infantry and common Joe is getting better shit. Just kinda wondering if it's not to little too late. Between shit funding, low recruitment, and enforced diversity, I wonder if the DoD is actually trying to make better warfighters. Cause I know for certain that the State Dept and the commie diversity hires in DC are either hindrances or outright enemies to Joe.

 

[Marauder06]

The average Jill has never been able to, nor will they probably ever, be able to shoulder the same load as the average Joe.

And you're right about the chronic shortages of personnel; the reason I could get an M203 in my Infantry platoon is that we didn't have enough people to man all of the systems. In my company, a D Co in the 101st, we had 5 platoons and I think at one point we could man 3. Not good times.

 

[Gunz]

"How can our warfighter carry this in Afghanistan?!?!?!"
Bitch, the AFG isn't a thing.
"But, BUT....mountains!!!!!!!!!!"
Okay.
"It is too heavy!!!!!!!! Remember Vietnam!!!!!!!"
What the fuck?
"The Perfumed Princes don't care about the warfighter!!!"
Fuck off and pad your post count elsewhere.
"The Chinese will win because of the transgender agenda!!!!!!!"

And THAT thread will appear on "other sites" within a year. Bet a dollar. Any takers?

They’re too busy debating what’s better, 9mm or 45.

 

[R.Caerbannog]

The average Jill has never been able to, nor will they probably ever, be able to shoulder the same load as the average Joe.

And you're right about the chronic shortages of personnel; the reason I could get an M203 in my Infantry platoon is that we didn't have enough people to man all of the systems. In my company, a D Co in the 101st, we had 5 platoons and I think at one point we could man 3. Not good times.

You are exactly right and that is what worries me. We have more tail than teeth and I'm unsure how much of a gamechanger this new rifle will be. Add drones, anti drone technology, maybe a few dudes with scatterguns, and shit is gonna get heavy.

I also get the sneaky suspicion that we're going to have to incorporate offensive drones down to the company or maybe platoon level; if we want Joe to have survivability in the new battlefields we're seeing. Which is going to mean Joe lugging around more weight.

 

[AWP]

I recall a study I read once that an infantryman's load has stayed pretty consistent throughout the ages. I don't remember what the article was, I never fact checked it, and I could be remembering it wrong. But it makes sense to me. A conditioned human being can only carry so much weight. So maybe we don't need metal armor and steel weapons anymore, so now you can carry more powder and food.

We can now preserve food and have tablets to give you clean water, so now you can carry heavier weapons. Weapons just got lighter, more ammo. Now we have advanced body armor and a bunch of heavy comms gear? Fewer freedom seeds. So with some variance, in the last several hundred years the weight has generally been the same. Allegedly.

Admittedly, the physical toll of carrying to-go trays may have caused some cognitive issues, but I don't see how the weight has remained roughly the same. At least in some circumstances.

We had the old Y harness/ belt combo, 2 canteens of water, a basic load of 210 rounds, compass, and many in my unit used buttpacks for whatever like MREs. Fast forward, now we have plate carriers with 4 plates, comms, water, ammo, IFAK, and whatever else. From my lofty perch at a Bagram DFAC, I could see the working class going on patrols with all of the above, plus a 3-day pack or whatever with additional ammo, frags, medical, etc. Even without the 3-day pack, Joe's patrol weight easily doubled.

You go from the M-16A2 to the M-4. You shaved off a little over a pound, but added an optic, light, laser, and whatever. Lethality has increased, but you now have a heavier weapon, or one close to the model it replaced.

A ruck, I can see where those numbers are relatively constant, but a basic dismounted patrol setup, there's no way that remained roughly the same.

Something else to consider. I knew a number of skinny team guys in the 90's. After a few years with all of the new lightweight gear, all of them packed on muscle to support carrying the load and prevent/ minimize musculoskeletal injuries. This wasn't some evolution in nutrition or training, it was a realization that their bodies needed "more" to do the job.

If the overall load has remained the same or similar, and given the addition of plates, IFAK, comms, etc., which are worn and not packed into a ruck...how have the packing lists evolved to keep the weight at a rough constant?

 

[AWP]

I also get the sneaky suspicion that we're going to have to incorporate offensive drones down to the company or maybe platoon level; if we want Joe to have survivability in the new battlefields we're seeing. Which is going to mean Joe lugging around more weight.

Which I think we should, and I think you're right. In a perfect world, the infantry platoon MTO&E would change to incorporate a drone crew or whatever. I fear what you've posted will happen. Joe will be told "fuck it, figure it out" and those savings are passed on to an already undermanned, overworked rifle platoon.

Another thing, and I know enlisted like to shit on officers, but add a drone to some new PL's toolbox. That's insane. That poor bastard's workload will go through the roof. The LT with a compass meme will have nothing on an LT with a drone.

 

[R.Caerbannog]

Which I think we should, and I think you're right. In a perfect world, the infantry platoon MTO&E would change to incorporate a drone crew or whatever. I fear what you've posted will happen. Joe will be told "fuck it, figure it out" and those savings are passed on to an already undermanned, overworked rifle platoon.

Another thing, and I know enlisted like to shit on officers, but add a drone to some new PL's toolbox. That's insane. That poor bastard's workload will go through the roof. The LT with a compass meme will have nothing on an LT with a drone.

Yup. We're either going to create supermen or we're going to break a fuck load of men. I'm leaning towards the latter. Joe will rise to the occasion, but his body is going to pay.