U.S. Special Forces ordered to shave off beards
- Thread starter Ravage
- Start date
Fuck it, I think from this point foward every service member should have to wear their dress uniform in Astan.......It just more professional.
Most of the dudes I saw wearing all that stupid skull and bones bullshit were contractors and dumb privates, of course that was Iraq. As for the beards, facial hair is a big deal in the muslim community. The muslim community is not only out side of the wire but also inside the wire. Also how fast can your grow a beard, to take on a mission outside the wire. Just b/c your fucking off in the rear today dosen't mean you will be there forever... As for ballcaps, the boonie works better anyway... If it was up to me I would wear my straw stetson around the FOB and a boonie/brain bucket when out and about.
Some one needs to go punch him self a few hundred times in the face for even wasting his "professional leadership" on such a stupid subject. :2c:
Most of the dudes I saw wearing all that stupid skull and bones bullshit were contractors and dumb privates, of course that was Iraq. As for the beards, facial hair is a big deal in the muslim community. The muslim community is not only out side of the wire but also inside the wire. Also how fast can your grow a beard, to take on a mission outside the wire. Just b/c your fucking off in the rear today dosen't mean you will be there forever... As for ballcaps, the boonie works better anyway... If it was up to me I would wear my straw stetson around the FOB and a boonie/brain bucket when out and about.
Some one needs to go punch him self a few hundred times in the face for even wasting his "professional leadership"
on such a stupid subject. :2c:
Maybe this is the Marine in me, but why not? What reason could wearing ball caps in CENTCOM serve? Improving morale?
I have NO problems changing/modifying uniform regulations to suit the situation (not that it's ever been my call...), but it seems like it should only be done for a reason that can be explained and understood pretty easily.
Easily understood: "We will be training/mentoring/living with Iraqi soldiers. Their culture places an importance on facial hair, so we will be allowing "full-size" mustaches in theater."
Not easily understood: "We're wearing ball caps and beards to "blend in" even though we never leave the FOB unless we're in full kit and don't stand a chance of hell of "blending in" while wearing our ball caps and multicam."
Please explain to me where I'm wrong. And I'm not being a smart ass, I'd really like to know.
I don't see a difference between a ball cap, patrol cap or 8-pt cap. It has a bill, is comfortable, and keeps the sun out of my eyes. I can velcro shit too it without too many people getting pissy. Issue multicam patrol caps if your offended by a ball cap, but give the guys going off fob a little leeway.
B
Boondocksaint375
Guest
This shouldn't even be an issue. We have way more important things to worry about than our warriors looking presentable in the field. It doesn't surprise me where the orders came from.
This shouldn't even be an issue. We have way more important things to worry about than our warriors looking presentable in the field. It doesn't surprise me where the orders came from.
Gen Patton had his troops wear ties:doh:
I'm not saying I agree with the late Gen, but he needed to instill discipline in the Africa Campaign, shake things up so to speak.
As was posted by the guys here that know whats up it will all work itself out:2c:
Exactly!
Now on another note. I have no intent of hijacking this thread. However, am I the only one who thinks to much emphasis is put on grooming standards at the wrong time and that some standards are outdated? Once after spending a month jobbing out in New Orleans in the wake of hurricane katrina. I got my ass handed to me by the Vice Wing Commander for my hair being out of regs when we were loading the plane to head home. Really?? I just spent the last month sleeping in a condemned gymnasium, flying 8-12 hrs a day, jumping, hoisting, rappeling...you name it, into that terrible mess of a city and that is the "job well done" I received.
This same leadership sent 6 ANG PJ's packing because they were growing there beards out for an upcoming deployment(under our AFI and the permission of their CC). A deployment that was 2 weeks away. Here they are about to leave for the sandbox away from there family and friends for 6 months and they would rather be there helping out. They were told "shave or go home." I have a buddy who's convoy got hit by an IED and while he was taking cover behind is vehicle he was told that he needed to blouse his fucking boots!
One last thing and I'll get off my soapbox. I think a neatly groomed beard looks professional as well as a mustache that isn't trimmed like a member of the Third Reich.
Sorry Mods I blacked out there for a second. Delete/move post as needed...
But like Boon said...you would think there are more important things to worry about.
MS_girl
Member
I thought beards /Afghanistan sign of respect
Mustache/Iraq sign of respect I never really see them with beards ...
Mustache/Iraq sign of respect I never really see them with beards ...
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You can send me your Oakley's and your caps.
What, so you can now look like Jack Nicholson in Anger Management?
SSdoc272
Verified Military
This shouldn't even be an issue. We have way more important things to worry about than our warriors looking presentable in the field. It doesn't surprise me where the orders came from.
I agree with a lot of different things that you guys have all said. It really shouldn't be an issue though. The only problem facial hair might bring is proper sealing of your gas-mask, but when the hell was the last time we used those? Hell from what I've seen we get more use out of them by doing runs with them and disciplining boots. As far as looking professional, ok so make some grooming standards so the guys don't look like Santa in the desert, but there's obviously more important things to worry about that higher could focus on. They tell us its because we all need to look uniform and that helps keep us from being ambushed if the enemy sees us on patrol. Last time I checked they DGAF if we all look the same or if we're patrolling in jeans and tshirts. If they see the chance to kill our guys they take it. They also say its to win the hearts and minds of the people. Doing our job wins the hearts and minds of the people, not shaving our faces.
Sorry (ranting). The point is who cares? The higher aren't over there boots on the ground fighting and getting killed. My brothers-in-arms are. Hows about they focus on something to help keep us more safe or fight more efficient. :2c:
Wait and see how it is after 2.4 more years of Obama!
SSdoc272
Verified Military
Sad part is if I don't stay in that'll be the exact time I'm getting out :doh:
Go to Doctor school and don't worry about it.
LMAO!
I'd say the rationale is to stop the fobbits that are running around BAF and KAF with full beards for no reason. Unfortunately the majority of the people you see rocking the ZZ top look have no reason to have a beard in the first place. Lets not read too much into this. People who require relaxed grooming standards will still have them.
PS- I still have a beard
I agree with what you have said here.
Fuck it, I think from this point foward every service member should have to wear their dress uniform in Astan.......It just more professional.
Most of the dudes I saw wearing all that stupid skull and bones bullshit were contractors and dumb privates, of course that was Iraq. As for the beards, facial hair is a big deal in the muslim community. The muslim community is not only out side of the wire but also inside the wire. Also how fast can your grow a beard, to take on a mission outside the wire. Just b/c your fucking off in the rear today dosen't mean you will be there forever... As for ballcaps, the boonie works better anyway... If it was up to me I would wear my straw stetson around the FOB and a boonie/brain bucket when out and about.
Some one needs to go punch him self a few hundred times in the face for even wasting his "professional leadership"
Yeah, but none of the Muslims on base really give a crap if we have beards or not. And who are all these people who need to grow beards? I'm still not buying it. You're telling me that guy I saw walking around the FOB EVERY DAY needed a beard? No shit, we had a guy on our base from one of the TFs. NEVER left the FOB the entire time I was there, yet wore a beard. What's the point? Honestly, he would have blended in his environment better being clean-shaven, wearing marked DCUs and carrying an M16A2. With the beard and crap, he just made himself standout more and have people asking questions.
Again, I'm all on board with modified anything if there's a reason behind it, but a lot of the examples being thrown out here don't seem realistic to me. I think for a lot of people, it's more about the cool guy factor than anything else.
And as far as a ballcap vice patrol cap, or beards looking professional, I've got no issues with that either, but let's just change the damn regulations and get it over with. Hell, hands in the pockets don't bug me. But let's come up with rules that make sense and stick to them...
I agree with the FOBBITs not needing the beard. The guy at your FOB; what was his job? I was in a unit that sent O's and Sr E's out as mission planners. They did the same spin up training as the Operators. They had relaxed grooming standards, the logic was they could temporarily fill in if someone was injured and unable to perform. So I had bearded guys never leaving the FOB. That said, I never grew a beard and would have filled in if necessary (or if I could have justified it). I'd tell my bearded FOBbits to wear 5.11 pants and tell folks you were a contractor ;)
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