HEMOSTATIC Preferences?

[Diamondback 2/2]

I wanted to get some input on what the medics think is good or bad, what they prefer and why. I am stocking up on medical supplies and I am trying to figure out which direction I should go. What I am looking at right now is:

CELOX Gauze for wound packing and CELOX granules for deeper arterial bleeds.
Vs
Quick Clot Gauze & Granules for the same, just wondering the differences in effectiveness between the two.

I am also looking at Hemcon bandages for arterial bleeds, trying to decide if the 2x2’s would be a good choice or if I should go with 4x4’s (about a $120 difference between the two). I have 2 Hemcon bandages from my old IFAK’s but both are expired, do I need to replace them or with they still be serviceable (they are properly sealed and have been stored in the IFAK’s).

Also I have some of the older Israel bandages, all of them are expired but are still sealed and in good shape. Should I replace these as well? Would you recommend restocking the same bandage or something else, like the H compression bandages, etc.

I do have 5 or 6 H&H compressed gauze and roughly 10 assorted ace wraps as well, should I build up on these, instead of buying a specific bandage?

 

[x SF med]

The old school medic in me says stock up on kerlix, ab pads, plain 4x4/6x6, regular roll gauze and a couple or 4 tourniquets first... then go with the Celox set for next level........... I do like the older Israeli bandages too.

Sealed packages of non impregnated bandages are generally good for 3 years or more past the dates as long as they havent gotten wet or exposed to extreme temps/sunlight... the impregnated ones, well they'll be good for a while after expiry but will not be as effective as the fresher ones.

ETA... H bandages are good too.

 

[policemedic]

Short answer- I like Combat Gauze and OLAES; more later.

 

[TLDR20]

Combat Gauze, celox applicator.

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

I had to look up the celox applicator and the OLAES bandage, good shit.

What's the thoughts on the Hemcon pads? Are they worth the money?

 

[Muppet]

We (tac med. team) and my squad I work for use combat guaze and found it to be good. IMHO, hemmcon is really expensive, as you know but I never used it. I would not waste the money. Buy more tourniquets and combat guaze.

F.M.

 

[Ranger Psych]

I had to look up the celox applicator and the OLAES bandage, good shit.

What's the thoughts on the Hemcon pads? Are they worth the money?

Hemcon works, civ-side I would say getting it while unexpired and sealed, at a discount... yeah, worth tossing in. But, combat gauze + Celox cover the same group, basically.

 

[surgicalcric]

Pack, Pressure, and Pray is my preferred hemostatic.

 

[TLDR20]

I had to look up the celox applicator and the OLAES bandage, good shit.

What's the thoughts on the Hemcon pads? Are they worth the money?

Hemcon pads suck! You need to hold sirect pressure for 5 mins, making it difficult to really hold pressure. Best bet is either Chito Gauze( like combat gauze) or combat gauze in conjunction with kerlix and ace wrap.

 

[amlove21]

I used to swear by the Celox applicator, but I have since moved away from it to the Chito gauze (radio opaque) and the OLAES. I can not say enough about the OLAES- best piece of kit out in the last couple years. Small, light, multi use, actually useful- there is definitely a place for kerlix and ace wrap, but if you have the money to spend, OLAES is the ferrari.

And x2 on the HEMCON patches. Those things lick balls (and not in the good way).

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

Thanks guys, great info as always... just made an order of 4 each (4" & 6") OLAES from TacMed. Where can I get chito gauze?

 

[TLDR20]

The Olaes bandage is just ace wrap, with an eye cup and Velcro throughout, save your money and get kerlix ace-wrap and some good instruction on how to use them, then transition to combat gauze in conjunction with kerlix an ace wrap. Then i would move onto more advanced stuff. Before any of that should come tourniquet application.

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

That’s a pretty good point and something worth discussing IMO.

How should you properly pack a wound, and at what point do you apply a hemostatic product?

For deep open wounds with hemorrhaging I was taught (CLS & Adv CLS, I’m not a medic) to immediately apply pressure to the wound with a kerlix roll, apply a tourniquet if the wound is on a limb, pull the kerlix back and try to identify the source of the bleed. If able to ID the bleed, apply quick clot or hemcon, and then use kerlix to pack towards the bleed, filling the entire wound cavity. After filling the wound cavity, apply a pressure bandage over the packed wound, or use an ace wrap.

I am guessing that this is dated info, being that the hemcon pads & quick clot granules are no longer issued in the IFAK or CLS kits (at least that’s what I was told a few weeks ago). Is there a different or better way of dealing with this type of wound? How would you (Medics) deal with a deep open wound that is hemorrhaging (let say it’s a leg or arm)?

 

[TLDR20]

There are non tourniquet able hemorrhages that are what most of your hemostatics are for. Upper arm upper leg stuff. Anything outside of that, for on the X bleeds a tourniquet is what you want, followed by a bandage over the wound site in later parts of evac. I as a medic am going to TQ, direct or maintain a stop-gap while checking Airway and breathing, occluding chest wounds, then applying a pressure dressing to a non TQable bleed and possibly directing BLS and C-spine. That is pretty much the standard I think as far as a initial assessment of bleeding would go for me.

 

[policemedic]

Short answer- I like Combat Gauze and OLAES; more later.

Pack, Pressure, and Pray is my preferred hemostatic.

The old school medic in me says stock up on kerlix, ab pads, plain 4x4/6x6, regular roll gauze and a couple or 4 tourniquets first... then go with the Celox set for next level........... I do like the older Israeli bandages too.

Sealed packages of non impregnated bandages are generally good for 3 years or more past the dates as long as they havent gotten wet or exposed to extreme temps/sunlight... the impregnated ones, well they'll be good for a while after expiry but will not be as effective as the fresher ones.

ETA... H bandages are good too.

And this is why I tagged this for later.

The trick--if it's a trick at all--to managing wounds is to have good solid basic skills. Fancy tech like Combat Gauze and space age bandages are great adjuncts, but only serve to increase the efficiency of properly executed bleeding control techniques-they don't substitute for them.

With that said, if I'm packing I use Combat Gauze first to get the hemostatic agent directly onto the bleeder(s), then use non-hemostatic gauze to fill the rest of the cavity/create additional pressure, etc.

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

Hey guys I really appreciate the info and I agree 110% on training and learning the proper way vs relying on new tech, etc. I am not a medic, not an expert, I’ve only packed 1 wound and I am sure it was piss poor job compared to any of you medics… The main reason I posted this thread was to get some info on what is the best stuff to buy for hemostatic, so that I can update my med supplies (mainly my range first-aid bag for classes I put on) and find out what is working the best.

Based on the info here I’ve ordered OLAES bandages, two of the celox applicator and two Z packed Combat Gauze. I have more than enough kerlix gauze and other assorted gauze. I will order some Chito Gauze in a few weeks (just to have/try out on a deer this season or something).

I really appreciate the info…

One last question on the training end, would taking the TC3 course be something worth doing? I’m enrolled to take the EMT-B course Jan/Feb, and then start the EMT-P course next summer. However, there is a group down here that puts on the TC3 course, would it be worth taking before the EMT-B?

 

[policemedic]

Cypress Creek?

 

[TLDR20]

Shit you come to NC I will give you a tc3 class.

 

[Muppet]

Shit you come to NC I will give you a tc3 class.

Hell, can you get me TC-3 instructor cert.?

F.M.

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

Cback PM sent.