Israel and Iran
- Thread starter TLDR20
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2020, my new CC or select, I don't think he was even at Dhafra, was at a commander's call, conference, whatever at Shaw. AFCENT CC walked up to him and by way of introduction said "Get it moved. Now!" or words to that effect, talking about KINGPIN. (726 ACS, AFCENT's C2 node, it's all over af.mil and the like).
Why? Pretty obvious to you and the like, AFCENT's C2 node is a 3-5 minute flight away for Iranian cruise missiles. TBM's? We had Patriots, but those have limitations and the Pats are there to protect? KINGPIN. Move your C2 and you can move the Pats.
May 2021, KINGPIN is out of Dhafra. We knew we could not protect a one-of-a-kind C2 node and its predecessor building at the Deid was already torn down. There's no backup.
And that same AF didn't want to protect the E-3's? The same AF that originally killed (walked back as you predicted) the E-7 purchase even if it currently is in much smaller numbers. The same airframe we're sending to the Boneyard because they are too much to maintain and fly.
Shacked by a $30k drone we've known about for years.
Our AF does amazing things in spite of itself. We have the world's best at basically everything led by potatoes and politicians. Our guys and gals deserve better.
ThunderHorse
Verified Military
Have we ever used hardened shelters like our enemies have? Serious question as I don't know of US Airbases in the US with plane bunkers.
Nobody is really talking about these hits that have been going on all over Iraq for the past month now. In addition to the more secretive use of airspace which it looks like nobody is talking about. A little background, Iraq used "Popular Mobilization Forces" (militias) to help fight ISIS back in 2014-2016 and the original plan was to fold them into the Iraqi army. Some of these groups are part of the Islamic Resistance of Iraq ( IRI, jihad Iranian backed). Khataib Hezbollah and Suraiya Al-Dem or Company of the Blood are a couple of the big ones. Same groups that shoot drones and rockets at U.S. bases. Some shot missiles at Israel since Oct. 7. Not all of the PMF forces take part in that. Most just man checkpoints etc.
"We" the U.S. have been taking out IRI commanders at facilities almost daily. Local news has shown a few funerals. Some of the stories claim "Iraqi military" have been targeted but it's pretty clear that these are the Iranian backed militias being targeted.
A-10 fans can find some brrrrrrrrrrrtt videos all over Insta. Seems to be the weapon of choice against these IRI guys.
Breaking: Airstrikes target PMF positions in northern Iraq - Iraqi News
Attacks in Iraq kill PMF fighters; Kurdish region president ‘targeted’
"We" the U.S. have been taking out IRI commanders at facilities almost daily. Local news has shown a few funerals. Some of the stories claim "Iraqi military" have been targeted but it's pretty clear that these are the Iranian backed militias being targeted.
A-10 fans can find some brrrrrrrrrrrtt videos all over Insta. Seems to be the weapon of choice against these IRI guys.
Breaking: Airstrikes target PMF positions in northern Iraq - Iraqi News
Attacks in Iraq kill PMF fighters; Kurdish region president ‘targeted’
In Europe during the cold war, I assume some bases still use them.
The Russian-Ukraine war has changed the dynamic, China buying land near all our airbases should be a clue. We need to start building semi-hardened shelters to counter the drone threat.
The Quartermaster
Verified Military
Did drones take out something?
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This article says it a bit better than I could type out: Images Show E-3 Sentry Totally Destroyed From Iranian Strike (Updated)
The Quartermaster
Verified Military
Thanks.
Serious question, does anyone know if the USAF has any AAA at all? And if not, WHY TF NOT!?
Army owns ADA and has only invested in Patriots and SHORAD based on the Sidewinder missile I believe. C-RAM is controlled by artillery units and designed for counter rocket and mortar as the name states, but I’d presume can be used against aircraft. Or did they move those to ADA? I forget.
I’d hope this half-billion-ish dollar loss will cause some people to wake up and fix the problem. Seeing a head or two roll would be nice, but I don’t think we do the accountability thing these days.
The Quartermaster
Verified Military
Is the Army owning ADA a sarcasm or an actual thing just like the USAF wanted Army Aviation limited in fixed wing and owns fixed wings themselves? Not sure otherwise how to respond to this. All I know is that the Avenger was band-aid fix over the never replaced M42 Duster that the SGT York was supposed to replace and also replaced the never replaced Chaparral as merger band aid slash stopgap.
They won't wake up. They've been asleep ever since the Cold War ended. And I would arguably say asleep even before that.
Hot take: The USAF needs rotations at NTC with trying to defend a forward deployed airfield. Put anyone not in ADA, Artillery, or Aviation to OC them so we can finally see a fair assessment of what went wrong and how to fix things without those three branches doing biased branch influenced BS.
Kraut783
SOF Support
Would also add this footage of drone looking in aircraft bunker, finding it empty...moving on to another target at base in Iraq....
FPV drone slams into US military base in Iraq
It's a real thing. Army owns all of the ground base air defense assets.
I know the Avengers were mostly relegated to the ARNG, but there was talk a few years ago about bringing them back to the active duty side. Pretty sure they were developing a 25mm cannon version at some point, but decided to move forward with a "directed energy weapon" (laser) instead. IIRC, current models are stingers with an M3.
On my last deployment, I remember my BN CO telling us how he kept pushing the drone defense issue up to higher HQ. We'd (the unit) learned a ton from the Ukrainians and had been working additional counter measures, but he said people just assumed our current ADA could beat it. He said "that's like duck hunting with a 30.06. You'll miss the fuckers more than often than not."
I don't remember exactly when this conversation happened, but it was a few days before/after Tower 22 was attacked.
ThunderHorse
Verified Military
Based on a quick deep dive, I don't think the Air Force has had any air defense assets in decades. They had their own missiles in the 60s but seems scant since. I know that based on MOS, Air Defenders are the most deployed MOS in the Army. They're sent all over, some deployments are quite austere and some are in European or tropical paradises. I'm not certain this is purely because the Army owns Air Defense. Does the Army own Coastal Defense because we haven't had coastal artillery in decades.
The stick jockey service is run by fighter pilots so not surprising at the lack of air defense assets that are organic to their service. But you'd think that Security Forces might want to add an AFSC?
If we talk about actually artillery, we managed that until ~1950s. We also managed anti-air "coastal" sites until the late 1970s.
It all pretty much went away in the 80s when Regan started the Strategic Defense Initiative.
You should read up on the Key West agreement.
Kraut783
SOF Support
Ya, the Key West agreement was a huge FU to the Army...couldn't believe it lasted as long as it did.
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Huge FU to the AF too, we wanted to field the Rapier SAM system in Europe and the Army used the Key West Agreement to block it. We had to have RAF Reservists man the system.
The Quartermaster
Verified Military
We are failing the health and welfare of our own servicemen regardless of branch or departments over of all things...egocentric pride.
Thanks for mentioning Key West. What a shame and embarrassment.
Thanks for mentioning Key West. What a shame and embarrassment.
