Knife Sharpening suggestions

[pardus]

The bayonet stays in the armory.

:doh:

Well I guess you are MI but still.....

E.G. I read an article of a Marine unit surrounded and cut off in Iraq, they ran out of ammo, the officer in charge ordered them to pull out their knives to defend themselves!

I was like WTF!? you are such a dumbass you'd leave behind your bayonets and allow your men to fight H2H when they could be adding another couple of feet between them and the enemy with a bayonet and the rifle as a weapon?

This is an area of training where I think the US military has it wrong. :2c:

 

[x SF med]

That's what I'm going to have to do with a couple of knives I have.

Could you recommend a good way to actually grind down a very dull blade?

I was thinking of just going ahead and buying a very, very coarse stone, but this seems really labor intensive- especially with numerous, or very long blades.

Any shortcuts, or should I just grab a 6-pack of brew, and make an hour's work of it?

A 10" Mill Bastard (file) a good angle, no beer till you are done - about an hour's work to get a good rough angle, then go after it with a good DMT diamond honing set (blue and red)

 

[JBS]

I picked up a diamond hone, by the way.

That thing eats metal like nobody's business.

The only problem with it is it gets bogged down pretty quick, but is still does the job nicely.

I found it works better (and eats metal more agressively between wipe-downs) if I squirt it with lots of oil every couple'a minutes.

 

[x SF med]

DMTs are designed to be dry wiped as they get 'gunked'. For quick sharpening, try the Smith's Quick Sharp (small yellow, one side carbide, one side ceramic - good angle every time, sharp as shit).

Those are all I use any more - ask Eight Deuce about the guys who recommended them... plus those same guys will put a factory edge on any knife I own, if I bring beer, and maybe some Elk or Bison, or a cheesecake.:doh:

 

[Hard H2O]

DMTs are designed to be dry wiped as they get 'gunked'. For quick sharpening, try the Smith's Quick Sharp (small yellow, one side carbide, one side ceramic - good angle every time, sharp as shit).

Those are all I use any more - ask Eight Deuce about the guys who recommended them... plus those same guys will put a factory edge on any knife I own, if I bring beer, and maybe some Elk or Bison, or a cheesecake.:doh:

I would never drag a blade through a carbide scraper.

 

[pardus]

Why not? Please Inform the ignorant among us, Cheers.

 

[Hard H2O]

Why not? Please Inform the ignorant among us, Cheers.

From what I have heard and seen the carbide scrapers are just that. They scrape material from the sides of the bevel. Use them much and they will shorten the useful life of a blade.

I know guys that use them and are happy with the edges. They do quickly rebevel a blade and expose new metal. That comes at a cost.

I prefer to remove as little metal as possible to allow the two edge bevels meet.

The ceramic type pull throughs are okay if the angle on the knife matches the angle on the ceramic to start. That is why they sometimes come with a carbide type. The carbide scrapes the angle to match and the ceramic refines the edge.

I am not saying that they do not work. they do seem to improve a dull edge. It will decrease blade life and give you a rough almost serrated edge. If that is what you are after than you are good to go.

I prefer a more polished refined edge while extending edge life. I maintain my edges with a less destructive process. I use the extra fine and ceramic hones from the GATCO if needed and a leather strop. Once you have a good edge maintenance is the key to extending edge life and reducing the need for material removal to restore an edge.

 

[rangerpsych]

:doh:

Well I guess you are MI but still.....

E.G. I read an article of a Marine unit surrounded and cut off in Iraq, they ran out of ammo, the officer in charge ordered them to pull out their knives to defend themselves!

I was like WTF!? you are such a dumbass you'd leave behind your bayonets and allow your men to fight H2H when they could be adding another couple of feet between them and the enemy with a bayonet and the rifle as a weapon?

This is an area of training where I think the US military has it wrong. :2c:

We brought them along, but I never, ever, had one on my kit other than for Change of command and EIB.

Then again, I carried a belt fed weapon with a barrel that was rather handy as a club if removed, a 18" tip to pommel tanto, a 6" blade tanto, and a couple smaller folders all stashed throughout various pieces of kit.

If I had wire that needed cutting, we had wire cutters for that. Plus when 3 out of 4 weapons in a fire team didn't have the capacity to be able to mount a bayonet anyway due to primary weapon systems or simply not having a bayonet lug... it's dumb to haul it along.

Besides, when I could bean someone at 10 yards with a frag....... lol

 

[rangerpsych]

I picked up a diamond hone, by the way.

That thing eats metal like nobody's business.

The only problem with it is it gets bogged down pretty quick, but is still does the job nicely.

I found it works better (and eats metal more agressively between wipe-downs) if I squirt it with lots of oil every couple'a minutes.

inbetween casevacs in iraq I was known for being the Bn knife guru, sitting listening to the satcom while making the edges of my comrades knives stupidsharp while they were back for a day refitting... Even giving them spare dip.

I just used the rough stone on my gatco for the blades that were damn-near destroyed, and worked my way from there... I would soak the stone in CLP and wipe it off with a trashed tshirt I kept on my lap... then when I returned the knives I'd give a small list of don'ts for the guys to keep their blades working..

no matter how "cool" you think it looks, don't ever stab a knife into the ground. I'll punt you in the nuts.

 

[pardus]

Plus when 3 out of 4 weapons in a fire team didn't have the capacity to be able to mount a bayonet anyway due to primary weapon systems or simply not having a bayonet lug... it's dumb to haul it along.

Can't argue with that.
If you cant use it, it's no good.

 

[JBS]

We do train with them, though, Pardus- as you surely know. Unfortunately, it seems to be one of those skills that gets put on the back burner, in favor of other things.

That brings to mind a highly respected unit that recently fixed bayonets on an enemy- was it in Iraq?

I am trying to recall... (goes looking for the article)

 

[pardus]

We do train with them, though, Pardus- as you surely know. Unfortunately, it seems to be one of those skills that gets put on the back burner, in favor of other things.

That brings to mind a highly respected unit that recently fixed bayonets on an enemy- was it in Iraq?

I am trying to recall... (goes looking for the article)

There was a Brit unit that did it IIRC, Scottish maybe....

Yeah I know you guys train with them.

 

[JBS]

I thought I had come across it before:

From The Sun, 17 May 2004:


OUTNUMBERED British soldiers killed 35 Iraqi attackers in the Army’s first bayonet charge since the Falklands War 22 years ago.

The fearless Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders stormed rebel positions after being ambushed and pinned down.

Despite being outnumbered five to one, they suffered only three minor wounds in the hand-to-hand fighting near the city of Amara.

The battle erupted after Land Rovers carrying 20 Argylls came under attack on a highway.

After radioing for back-up, they fixed bayonets and charged at 100 rebels using tactics learned in drills.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article88661.ece


And, from the London Daily Mail:

THE Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders are coming home from Iraq next month. Twenty of their ranks, in unarmed Land Rovers, came under mortar and machinegun fire outside Amara in Iraq in May. They fought themselves out in classic fashion - with bayonets. Three of them were wounded, while more than 35 of their attackers were killed. These are the men who made the first bayonet charge by the British Army in 22 years. They may also be the men who have made the last British bayonet charge in history.

http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-118463306.html

 

[pardus]

....

OUTNUMBERED British soldiers killed 35 Iraqi attackers in the Army’s first bayonet charge since the Falklands War 22 years ago.

The fearless Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders stormed rebel positions after being ambushed and pinned down.

Despite being outnumbered five to one, they suffered only three minor wounds in the hand-to-hand fighting near the city of Amara.

The battle erupted after Land Rovers carrying 20 Argylls came under attack on a highway.

After radioing for back-up, they fixed bayonets and charged at 100 rebels using tactics learned in drills.

 

[pardus]

LOL!!!

 

[JBS]

That just warms my heart!

 

[pardus]

They may also be the men who have made the last British bayonet charge in history.

Ah, yes here is an article showing the effectiveness of a weapon and now we wont ever use it again

People are stupid.

 

[JBS]

In my opinion, it is feats of professional movement, skill, and bravery like these ole' boys that brings a reward that may last for decades.


When a particular group of trouble makers gets word- for example- that the Argylles are in town, it absolutely must have an impact.

There are but a handful of units out there, that receive instant respect when they set foot on any given territory- and a reputation like that saves lives in the long run. Groups like outlaw militias (and the like) might be more likely to lay low, and refrain from making problems when such units are around.


This might sound strange, but this is why I am personally against using military in photo-ops with little kids, etc. in a careless way.

 

[Typhoon]

Ah, yes here is an article showing the effectiveness of a weapon and now we wont ever use it again...People are stupid.

I recall reading about this story a few months ago and it just reminds me of how, despite the technology, we are in many ways fighting a 19th Century type of war...

You have to be ready for all contingencies, and it sure looks like the highlanders had the right training and preparations for that one. It warms my highlander blood! :cool:

 

[pardus]

In my opinion, it is feats of professional movement, skill, and bravery like these ole' boys that brings a reward that may last for decades.


When a particular group of trouble makers gets word- for example- that the Argylles are in town, it absolutely must have an impact.

There are but a handful of units out there, that receive instant respect when they set foot on any given territory- and a reputation like that saves lives in the long run. Groups like outlaw militias (and the like) might be more likely to lay low, and refrain from making problems when such units are around.


This might sound strange, but this is why I am personally against using military in photo-ops with little kids, etc. in a careless way.

Agreed, the Brit Paras patrolled in Northern Ireland without helmets wearing their berets to show who was in town! :cool: