MarSOC battalion to take joint command

[0699]

I found this second to last comment very comical as well - when I was in Al Asad, I used to refer to at MCRD Al Asad - an indoor pool...seriously? Ramadi was the best time because it was all in the dirt, but as far as spending goes - I also know that one of our base operations areas spent $2k on a TV to display one PowerPoint slide. Sadly enough, I do know how it works with finances and how they break it all up...use it or lose it.

It's not like it was heated pool...

 

[vdat]

Actually - I believe it was - wasn't it? So let me catch up a bit on the initial intent of this thread - I don't mind us taking a joint command; however, I do not believe in the least we need to give the impression we are a sustainment force - one of the good things that General Conway has moved us away from...but...we do need to show more presence because as we all know all the other services are gunning to get rid of us - if you haven't seen the latest moves by the Air Force...and even the Navy....we have to keep what we have. Once again..America doesn't need us, they want us. Why don't they need us...because they can throw enough money at other programs to get the operations done - it may not be done right or efficiently like the Marines, but it will eventually get done. I'll step off the horse now.

 

[0699]

Actually - I believe it was - wasn't it? So let me catch up a bit on the initial intent of this thread - I don't mind us taking a joint command; however, I do not believe in the least we need to give the impression we are a sustainment force - one of the good things that General Conway has moved us away from...but...we do need to show more presence because as we all know all the other services are gunning to get rid of us - if you haven't seen the latest moves by the Air Force...and even the Navy....we have to keep what we have. Once again..America doesn't need us, they want us. Why don't they need us...because they can throw enough money at other programs to get the operations done - it may not be done right or efficiently like the Marines, but it will eventually get done. I'll step off the horse now.

Wasn't in 2007. Or maybe they just turned the heat off to be "hard corps"...

 

[Thumper]

No doubt about what you say. Especially about SF Battalions being most capable in the SOTF role. As you say they were designed that way.

So, maybe MARSOCs first time in the SOTF business is going to be tough. I can’t argue with that. I do not know in detail their staffing and C3 arrangements and I am vaguely familiar with the way SF runs them (mainly from Special Warfare articles).

But I got some points to make.

1) Marines have experience in complicated three dimensional expeditionary amphibious operations, obviously difficult to coordinate, and their MAGTF concept is considered very effective. It helps them a lot in Expeditionary C3.

2) Mostly their SOTF will control Marine Companies and I imagine they know how and have the means to do that.

3) By now it’s pretty obvious (if you put together pieces of open information and official comments) that long-term MARSOC aims to be an “expeditionary” SF-like force concentrated in certain areas of the world, more or less near the littorals.

So I bet you that this “first time” will aid them greatly in getting their version of an SF Battalion-SOTF (I am certain there is going to be a “Marine” version of it) together for next year.

After all, that’s what they did after their first SOF Company tours in Afghanistan during 2007. They redesigned them into a form that in a way resembles a SF company “task organised” with CS and CSS supporting elements (enablers and support as they call them)

I cant be specific (don’t have the info for that) but it seems that after 2007 they got a bit out of their ‘high tooth to tail ratio” mentality and their SOTF will have –at least broadly- comparable numbers regarding C3, CS and CSS capability, with a SF Battalion-SOTF.

By now they know what they want to do and I am pretty positive that they will make an effort to pull through without serious problems this first time, and to sustain their success , even if strains some of their “high demand low density” assets.

Very good comments, and very close to the "truth".

There have been and currently are numerous things that we as MARSOF operators / staff do very well as a SOTF (currently conducting numerous successful missions with ANA, MSOTs and ODA's). Two of our first MSOC's in Af actually had multiple ODAs under their control and were infact doing more than their original SOTF could provide for them due to long distant C&C relationships. Not trying to say that the MSOCs were doing it better than the SOTFs by any means, just saying that those Major's & MSgt's were doing really good things. Huge prop's go out to those ODAs who were extremely professional and were both accepting of our strengths / flaws.

Unfortunately, you are also right in your assumption that manning a SOTF for more than 12 to 18 months will be extremely tough on MARSOC. We don't have a lot of trained staff guys and are filling the SOTF with actual CSOs. This may make us stronger initially, but also could cripple us for years to come. We shall see as we grow under our new Commanding General and as our original Force Recon members rotate and the newly grown CSOs fill their places in deployments.

Great site and lots of "interesting" info flowing though the pages.