Need help with the options my recruiter gave me

[CC1992]

I have been talking to my national guard recruiter and will be joining within the next month or so. I have already taken my asvab and have my application filled out I am just waiting to meet with him sometime this week. When i first meet with my recruiter I informed him that i did not want a job that i could do as a civilian because I already have a certificate for my trade, have ran a small business, and attend college. None of these have satisfied my desire to make a difference in the world so I told him I would like to go special forces. I scored a 85 on my asvab and 124 on the gt section which was needed. My states ng does not have an sf unit but a state close by does. I had to explain to my recruiter what the rep 63 option is and he did some more research on it for me. The problem is that now he has me thinking because he told me most people with no prior service rarely make it through the selection process even if they may qualify one day and that if i don't make it i would just go to an MOS at the needs of the army. He recommended for me to sign with my states ng as a 68w and i will be going in as an e-3. he said after 18 months i would be able to tryout for special forces with the other state and would be able to switch if i wanted to. I do find this hard to believe and my brother in law who is currently serving says it sounds like he just wants me to sign up with him. I guess my real question is which option i should take to achieve my goal of becoming a special forces soldier.

A.)enlist as an e-3 68w in my state and try out for special forces in another state after 18 months (if this is even possible)

B.) enlist in the other state with the rep 63 option and hope i make it.

trust me i know right now i am nowhere close to what a special forces soldier is even if my physical standards are "good". But I am in good shape (around a 280 on pt just have to get my 2 mile run down) and have always been one to persevere and go outside of the norm. i would like to thank everyone on here who has served for your service and let you all know that i will look up to everyone who has served before me when i become a soldier. thanks for your answers as well.

 

[DA SWO]

Go one state over and talk to a Recruiter.
Your Recruiter can not give you a Rep63 if the state does not have a SF unit.

 

[Red Flag 1]

This is from your intro: Hey guys my names Carmine. Im 23 years old and have finally mad my decision to join the national guard after a few years of college and vocational school. I can honestly say I've never been more excited for this opportunity but have so many different questions and routes I can take and want to make sure i make the right decisions. looking forward to talking with everyone on this site. Thanks

Take the time to look at what you write. It is the first impression we, or anyone else, have of you. We all make typos, and I am one of the worst, but take a look at what you wrote to start this thread. We would like to see you do well in the military, so written skills should be at the top of your list. Best of luck with your plans.

 

[CC1992]

This is from your intro: Hey guys my names Carmine. Im 23 years old and have finally mad my decision to join the national guard after a few years of college and vocational school. I can honestly say I've never been more excited for this opportunity but have so many different questions and routes I can take and want to make sure i make the right decisions. looking forward to talking with everyone on this site. Thanks

Take the time to look at what you write. It is the first impression we, or anyone else, have of you. We all make typos, and I am one of the worst, but take a look at what you wrote to start this thread. We would like to see you do well in the military, so written skills should be at the top of your list. Best of luck with your plans.

Sorry. I did not realize my post are expected to be grammatically correct. I will use spell check in the future.

 

[pardus]

Sorry. I did not realize my post are expected to be grammatically correct. I will use spell check in the future.

You have joined a Special Operations forum, with a stated goal to become a member of Special Forces, and you didn't think displaying attention to detail would be important?
Take some time and look around the site, get a feel for it. Trust me, you'll be doing yourself a big favor if you do enlist.
68W is a good job and a good skill to have. You should have no problem dropping a packet to go to SF, regardless of what state you are in.

 

[compforce]

Talk to the SF Recruiter from that Group in the next state. They can sign someone up in any state where they have a presence. They'll also have the straight info on Rep63 and Selection. The National Guard SF Groups have programs to get a Rep63 candidate ready for Selection. Frankly, they won't let you go until you are ready. Additionally, most NGSF units have "tryouts" that will give you a taste of what to expect before you sign on the dotted line and which give them the opportunity to assess whether they think you will be able to make it.

BTW, if you are planning to go into Special Operations, you may want to change your screen name, assuming that is your real last name.

 

[AWP]

A Rep63 pipeline will "give" you an MOS before you report for SFAS/ SOPC or whatever the beginning consists of these days. DO NOT sign with your home state and hope it will release you to another. DO. NOT. DO. IT. A state is under no obligation to release you and there are plenty of guys who have enlisted in a different state just to go to an SF unit. Find the SF recruiter for the state and talk to him.

Also, you need to show up and utterly crush the PT test. A state won't burn a slot on mediocrity or even "very good." Crush the PT test.

Good luck.

 

[tweeder]

First off, good luck. Should you try to enlist in another state as a Rep-63, not only should you kill the PT, but you must represent yourself as an absolute professional during your interview. I would encourage you to learn military customs and courtesies so that when you meet senior NCOs, you know how to behave. No matter how cool that E-8 is, he's not your "bro".

Remember, this isn't an active duty recruiting office where you check the box and get a contract, you are asking these people to invest in you. Do not be shocked if you crush everything and get denied a contract only to be asked to enlist in their state to try again later, the process requires your full commitment and they may be unsure of yours.

Again, best of luck.

Tweeder

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

I can't give any advice on the SF recruitment and or processes. I can only state that if I wanted to be SF, I would only enlist with a Rep 63.

Here are a few things to think about, that are not readily available or common knowledge.

Once you enlist into the NG your assigned to a unit, that units manpower and readiness is specifically linked to you're position within that unit. We call this paragraph and line numbers of the unit MTOE. Every single person is assigned a specific para/line and every unit uses this to report there readiness. I have never seen a NG unit fully manned, and generally while using "recruits" on the manning roster, they are around 70-80% and generally 30% of that are guys holding rank or positions who are to old to perform and are non deployable. Why this is important is b/c each unit commander can only allow his unit readiness strength to go so low to insure deployment readiness. What that means is that once you belong to a unit in trouble (which any good recruiters will attempt to fill first) you are stuck like chuck. Want to transfer to a better unit, closer to home, HSLD unit? Sorry the current unit comes first.

The way around this, is what is called an interstate transfer, you basically get an address near the unit of whichever state you want to go, and you show up fill out a few forms and swear into that unit/state. This is highly discouraged for obvious reasons, but it is about the only tool you have when you get locked into a unit. The problem, however, is that without an SF contract, you have to attend SF drills from a conventional unit and you don't get assigned until they feel you are ready and complete SFAS. This means that whatever unit you interstate transfer to, must be willing to release you for SF. Not saying that its impossible or even hard, but its a mine field of bullshit you need to watch out for. The good thing is that most states that have SF companies, encourage soldier from all units to try out, and I'm sure once you've completed the SF drills "whatever they are called now" you will have little to no trouble going to SFAS (at least from your parent unit).

The other big problem that is an issue within the NG, is after you get fucked a few times in a conventional unit, you stop giving a fuck. Not completely, but just enough to make you tainted goods for any HSLD unit. Motivation can be lost, not getting promoted, not getting schools, getting dicked around by a shitty unit. Be very careful not to fall into that category, and hints my opinion on the Rep 63 vs spending time in a conventional unit.

If you do decide to join into a conventional unit, feel free to PM any questions regarding the NG, recruitment and transfers. For the SF stuff, there are more than a few NG SF soldiers on here, and you can never go wrong talking with an SF recruiter...

 

[x SF med]

@CC1992 - you realize that is you get a REP 63 for 18D, pass SFRE, go to Basic, AIT, Airborne, get selected at SFAS, then attend the SFQC you will essentially not see home for over 3 years, right? If your trade has required CEC you will have to accomplish them on your own time (if you have any) in order to maintain licensure/standing, and that your commitment to your military training and education MUST come first. Should you then pass SFQC, especially as an 18D, you are required to maintain those CECs including extended training away from home.

SF especially NG SF is a commitment - and you will be putting in much more than one weekend a month and 2 weeks in the summer, A LOT MORE.

Read all of the SF related threads here before you make a decision, make sure you know what you are asking to join/become/commit to, it's a daunting but exhilarating journey, and a commitment that has ruined marriages and cost people families.

I suggest you read this thread before you choose: Why do we do this? Items to consider.

 

[CC1992]

@CC1992 - you realize that is you get a REP 63 for 18D, pass SFRE, go to Basic, AIT, Airborne, get selected at SFAS, then attend the SFQC you will essentially not see home for over 3 years, right? If your trade has required CEC you will have to accomplish them on your own time (if you have any) in order to maintain licensure/standing, and that your commitment to your military training and education MUST come first. Should you then pass SFQC, especially as an 18D, you are required to maintain those CECs including extended training away from home.

SF especially NG SF is a commitment - and you will be putting in much more than one weekend a month and 2 weeks in the summer, A LOT MORE.

Read all of the SF related threads here before you make a decision, make sure you know what you are asking to join/become/commit to, it's a daunting but exhilarating journey, and a commitment that has ruined marriages and cost people families.

I suggest you read this thread before you choose: Why do we do this? Items to consider.

I understand the commitment and I am ready to put as much time that is necessary if I have the opportunity. I have been going through all of the threads on here which are very helpful and I really appreciate the link you sent me to read. Please understand I do not want this for the money as I would stay home and continue to run my business if that were the case and being the cool guy has never been my thing. As I stated before I have a desire to make a difference and do not think I've done that in my life yet. Thank you for the information.

I can't give any advice on the SF recruitment and or processes. I can only state that if I wanted to be SF, I would only enlist with a Rep 63.

Here are a few things to think about, that are not readily available or common knowledge.

Once you enlist into the NG your assigned to a unit, that units manpower and readiness is specifically linked to you're position within that unit. We call this paragraph and line numbers of the unit MTOE. Every single person is assigned a specific para/line and every unit uses this to report there readiness. I have never seen a NG unit fully manned, and generally while using "recruits" on the manning roster, they are around 70-80% and generally 30% of that are guys holding rank or positions who are to old to perform and are non deployable. Why this is important is b/c each unit commander can only allow his unit readiness strength to go so low to insure deployment readiness. What that means is that once you belong to a unit in trouble (which any good recruiters will attempt to fill first) you are stuck like chuck. Want to transfer to a better unit, closer to home, HSLD unit? Sorry the current unit comes first.

The way around this, is what is called an interstate transfer, you basically get an address near the unit of whichever state you want to go, and you show up fill out a few forms and swear into that unit/state. This is highly discouraged for obvious reasons, but it is about the only tool you have when you get locked into a unit. The problem, however, is that without an SF contract, you have to attend SF drills from a conventional unit and you don't get assigned until they feel you are ready and complete SFAS. This means that whatever unit you interstate transfer to, must be willing to release you for SF. Not saying that its impossible or even hard, but its a mine field of bullshit you need to watch out for. The good thing is that most states that have SF companies, encourage soldier from all units to try out, and I'm sure once you've completed the SF drills "whatever they are called now" you will have little to no trouble going to SFAS (at least from your parent unit).

The other big problem that is an issue within the NG, is after you get fucked a few times in a conventional unit, you stop giving a fuck. Not completely, but just enough to make you tainted goods for any HSLD unit. Motivation can be lost, not getting promoted, not getting schools, getting dicked around by a shitty unit. Be very careful not to fall into that category, and hints my opinion on the Rep 63 vs spending time in a conventional unit.

If you do decide to join into a conventional unit, feel free to PM any questions regarding the NG, recruitment and transfers. For the SF stuff, there are more than a few NG SF soldiers on here, and you can never go wrong talking with an SF recruiter...

Thank you for this information. It is very helpful. After talking with my recruiter today I think I will be joining in my states NG. Though a lot of people have told me not to trust everything a recruiter says, this guy seems to be very honest and upfront with me as well as understanding of my goals. He informed me that when I sign he will make sure I get put on an infantry unit as a 68W so I could receive more training which will help me with SF later on. He also promised I would be able to try out for SF when I become an E4 and go to drill in the state to prepare me for selection. As I said before I know I am not yet ready to be an SF soldier as I have never even been a soldier but I do believe one day I will have what it takes. I guess all I can do is sign the paperwork and work my ass of to get where I need to be.

Talk to the SF Recruiter from that Group in the next state. They can sign someone up in any state where they have a presence. They'll also have the straight info on Rep63 and Selection. The National Guard SF Groups have programs to get a Rep63 candidate ready for Selection. Frankly, they won't let you go until you are ready. Additionally, most NGSF units have "tryouts" that will give you a taste of what to expect before you sign on the dotted line and which give them the opportunity to assess whether they think you will be able to make it.

BTW, if you are planning to go into Special Operations, you may want to change your screen name, assuming that is your real last name.

Thank you. I did request to have my name changed.

 

[Polar Bear]

I changed it Cathy. Good luck

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

He also promised I would be able to try out for SF when I become an E4 and go to drill in the state to prepare me for selection..

You do realize once you've completed BCT/AIT and are assigned to your home unit, your recruiter has zero influence or say over what goes on in your career?

Did he promise that to you or was it more of a "oh yeah you'll be able to do all that" type conversation?

Good rule of thumb, unless its in a contract (in writing) it doesn't exist.

Just trying to save you some heartache.

 

[CC1992]

You do realize once you've completed BCT/AIT and are assigned to your home unit, your recruiter has zero influence or say over what goes on in your career?

Did he promise that to you or was it more of a "oh yeah you'll be able to do all that" type conversation?

Good rule of thumb, unless its in a contract (in writing) it doesn't exist.

Just trying to save you some heartache.

Guaranteed it. He said he talked to the NG recruiter from the other state who I also talked to a couple weeks ago and he said anyone an E4 or above can tryout. No guarantees to get it but theres also no guarantee with the Rep 63 contract. I really hope he isn't bullshitting me cause he said he really wants to see me go SF cause it would also make him look good and he knows how hard I've been training myself for it.

 

[DA SWO]

Guaranteed it. He said he talked to the NG recruiter from the other state who I also talked to a couple weeks ago and he said anyone an E4 or above can tryout. No guarantees to get it but theres also no guarantee with the Rep 63 contract. I really hope he isn't bullshitting me cause he said he really wants to see me go SF cause it would also make him look good and he knows how hard I've been training myself for it.

He's bullshittig you.
What state?

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

Guaranteed it. He said he talked to the NG recruiter from the other state who I also talked to a couple weeks ago and he said anyone an E4 or above can tryout. No guarantees to get it but theres also no guarantee with the Rep 63 contract. I really hope he isn't bullshitting me cause he said he really wants to see me go SF cause it would also make him look good and he knows how hard I've been training myself for it.

Well I gave my $.02, good luck to you and your future goals.

 

[Totentanz]

You do realize once you've completed BCT/AIT and are assigned to your home unit, your recruiter has zero influence or say over what goes on in your career?

Did he promise that to you or was it more of a "oh yeah you'll be able to do all that" type conversation?

Good rule of thumb, unless its in a contract (in writing) it doesn't exist.

Just trying to save you some heartache.

I'll just emphasize the above, as well as the big bold letters at the bottom of page 1 of form DD 4/1 (Enlistment/Reenlistment Contract):

"Agreements in this section and attached annex(es) are all the promises made to me by the Government. ANYTHING ELSE ANYONE HAS PROMISED ME IS NOT VALID AND WILL NOT BE HONORED."

 

[digrar]

I'd say you're being led up the garden path, accept no guarantees that are not in writing.

 

[compforce]

Guaranteed it. He said he talked to the NG recruiter from the other state who I also talked to a couple weeks ago and he said anyone an E4 or above can tryout. No guarantees to get it but theres also no guarantee with the Rep 63 contract. I really hope he isn't bullshitting me cause he said he really wants to see me go SF cause it would also make him look good and he knows how hard I've been training myself for it.

Absolute bullshit. I'm not saying the recruiter is lying to you deliberately. 99% of recruiters (even in the same state with an SF unit) have absolutely no idea about how SF works or how to enlist someone in SF in the National Guard. The truth is that you will be assigned to an Infantry unit as a 68W and then you are on your own to...

* make E4
* Contact the SF unit
* Talk your Chain of Command into letting you split drill with the SF unit for several months (they will not want to do this in most cases because you are filling a slot in their MTOE but not useful to them)
* Talk your Chain of Command into an interstate transfer when the time comes for selection. As mentioned above, this isn't a "gimme". They will have invested in your training and will not want to send an MOS qualified person to another state.

Talk to the SF recruiter. Whether it's 19th or 20th SFG(A), you need to get the straight scoop from a recruiter assigned to HHC. It's always someone that is either SF or SF Support. They will know the real deal and have all of the right contacts to get your questions answered.

Try calling this number. It's the main line for 20th SFG(A)'s Group Support Battalion. They should be able to get you in contact with the recruiter.
(256) 680-3660 I'd give you a better number but they reorganized since I left and I don't know if my roster is still current. If you are trying to get to 19th SFG(A), still call them, get the 20th Recruiter's number and then ask him for the 19th Group recruiter's number. They have each other's contact info.

BTW, there are 68W slots in the support battalion too (not many). If you want to get the best chance to go SF starting as a 68W, then why not serve in GSB where you will get all of the support you need to accomplish your goal and not have to deal with the challenges of the transfer?

 

[AWP]

He informed me that when I sign he will make sure I get put on an infantry unit as a 68W so I could receive more training which will help me with SF later on. He also promised I would be able to try out for SF when I become an E4 and go to drill in the state to prepare me for selection.

The recruiter promised.....Look, if you want to believe a guy who has ZERO say in what happens to you after you depart MEPS, then go ahead. I'm not saying he's lying to you, but I wouldn't trust him. Pay your money and take your chances. We've given you solid information and advice, if you want to go against that, it's on you.

The NG has an SF website and we have one or more Sticky threads with that info (hint, hint).

I'm going to be blunt and I'll say this based upon "I forgot how many people I've talked to over the last 20+ years plus my personal experience:

You're a damn fool if you trust your recruiter. If it isn't in writing it never happened.

Good luck.