The NFL, Kneeling, Ratings, and the Flag

Nowhere did I say his opinion didn’t matter, and you’re the one implying that a black man didn’t think up the idea for himself. I firmly believe the protest was his own idea. I ALSO firmly believe that his girlfriend wouldn’t stick around if he was just an unemployed QB. Either CK needed to land a QB slot, or he needed to remain edgy and relevant in the ever-changing flow of social justice hierarchy. She was NOT going to go all Tammy Wynette and “stand by [her] maaaaaaan,” because her love most likely comes with conditions. He’s at least smart enough to see that.

As far as the overall issue, I think you’re well aware of what I do for volunteer work in the community. We could have discussions for days, but I’ve come to the conclusion that nobody wants a peaceful solution. I’ll leave it at that. Anything else is best left to PMs or other threads.
That's why I asked for an accurate characterization of your position. Sorry, it was early and my groggy reading of your post sounded like a very common complaint I heard of Nessa Diab from last year.

But now that you've clarified...I don't really understand what point you're trying to make.
 
I've said it before in this thread. Kaepernick wasn't protesting anything when he was first caught with a pouty face on the bench after he'd lost his job to Gabbert. He was just pouty. Now being the well educated man he is, he thought quick on his feet and said hey I'm protesting this. I'm now going to kneel. And everyone who's so woke in this world believes him.

Yet, when he started wearing Ernesto shirts and sang the praises of the Castro Ruz family when it comes to universal healthcare and literacy in Cuba. When the media and world didn't wake up and say, hold the phone here, this guy is full horse shit shows how uneducated our populace is.
 
A lot of people have pretty much written off the NFL for the rest of the season over this. People at work started conversations with, "Well, I'm done with the NFL for this year." One gal mentioned she called her cable/satellite company and cancelled her sports package and told them why.
 
A lot of people have pretty much written off the NFL for the rest of the season over this. People at work started conversations with, "Well, I'm done with the NFL for this year." One gal mentioned she called her cable/satellite company and cancelled her sports package and told them why.

To listen to the media 'those' people (admittedly I'm on the fence) are in the terribly small minority; yet, that's all I'm hearing/seeing on social media. People seem to be walking.
 
A lot of people have pretty much written off the NFL for the rest of the season over this. People at work started conversations with, "Well, I'm done with the NFL for this year." One gal mentioned she called her cable/satellite company and cancelled her sports package and told them why.

I'm questioning the effectiveness of it. The NFL has been declining in ratings for a few years now. Here's a pretty good explanation from last year.

A more compelling theory for the decline in NFL ratings

• The election. People have been so absorbed with Hillary vs. The Donald they just didn’t have the time or energy to … take a break and watch football. To which I say: Are you kidding? Who didn’t want three hours of distraction from that train wreck?

• Colin Kaepernick. Football fans are such hardened right-wingers that the sight of the 49ers quarterback and a handful of other black players protesting police violence is a deal breaker. You know, six guys “misbehaving” and it’s, “Screw the NFL.”

• No Peyton Manning. And no Tom Brady for the first few games of the season. These established stars are the main/only reason lifelong fans watch the games on TV. Right. Just like fans turned off their sets when Fran Tarkenton retired.

• Glut. The NFL decided Sundays weren’t enough omnipresence, and that the Disneys and CBSs of the world would pay fat fees for the rights to games on Thursdays, in addition to Sunday nights and Mondays. Even if you like candy, it tastes better if you binge on it only once a week, not every day.

• Shaking down taxpayers. All but the most blinkered get-a-life fans have grown restless with the way the NFL — one of the most profitable private enterprises in the country — has suckered local politicians into financing “public stadiums” for the league’s further enrichment. I like the smell of that one.

• Constant bad publicity. Locally, over the past 15 years, our beloved Vikings lead the league in arrests for DUI, domestic violence and on and on. And that’s just here. Nationally, “stars” like Pittsburgh’s Ben Roethlisberger, Tampa’s Jameis Winston have the kind of reputations for predatory sexual behavior mothers have warned their daughters about since time immemorial. And the picture isn’t a lot better with lesser-known players. Any fan with a conscience has a tough time cheering on a guy accused of rape … twice.

• The NFL hates fun. Seattle Seahawks star Richard Sherman (a Stanford guy who actually graduated) recently said: “The league isn't fun anymore. Every other league, you see the players have a good time. It's a game. This isn't politics. This isn't justice. This is entertainment. And they're no longer allowing the players to entertain. They're no longer allowing the players to show any kind of personality, any kind of uniqueness, any individuality. Because they want to control the product. They want to control the messaging, etc., etc.’" On the other hand, if you have an authoritarian streak and prefer your entertainment controlled by heavy-handed, military-like rules, the NFL is your game.

Millennial tech heads. Young fans aren’t umbilically linked to their 60-inch Vizios. They’re watching on other “devices,” which Nielsen hasn’t figured out a way to detect and survey. Never mind that the best guess from experts is that people actuallywatching entire games on cell phones is in the hundred thousands, not the millions that would explain the ratings decline.

• NFL RedZone. The NFL’s coziness with fantasy betting has created a new generation of fans who care less about the strategies and drama of the game itself and more about the scoring highlights, which NFL RedZone compresses into a streaming highlight reel … without 200-300 commercials. On that latter point, we may be getting somewhere.


Things haven't changed all that much, but have player's salaries changed? There is currently $19 billion in active contracts and $863 million in free agents to players in the NFL.
 
As an X 49er fan this is my boycott trigger
Colin Kaepernick. Football fans are such hardened right-wingers that the sight of the 49ers quarterback and a handful of other black players protesting police violence is a deal breaker. You know, six guys “misbehaving” and it’s, “Screw the NFL.”

I always prefer the NHL with any and all rugby. Even 7s(🏉union mo betta)
 
Whatever don't watch.

Don't play fantasy football either.

Don't talk about the stuff you aren't watching, it is solved. We can go back to watching, and talking about football here.

"A lot" of people have stopped? Ratings may be down but enough people obviously watch for a team kneeling or sitting out to blow up Facebook.

I'm proud of the players and what they did. I'm ashamed of our President and what he said.
 
I don't think proud is the word that comes to mind when thinking about what they have done.

I believe they do have the right to stand, kneel, sit, ect during the anthem, but is that really the greatest form of protest these guys can come up with? Why can't they do something that isn't disrespectful, such as donating their money to inner cities or better training for police departments.

If having NFL players who are here for mine and everyone's entertainment disrespect the flag, anthem, and police is the answer to combating racism and social divide then honestly where is this country heading ?
 
I don't think proud is the word that comes to mind when thinking about what they have done.

I believe they do have the right to stand, kneel, sit, ect during the anthem, but is that really the greatest form of protest these guys can come up with? Why can't they do something that isn't disrespectful, such as donating their money to inner cities or better training for police departments.

If having NFL players who are here for mine and everyone's entertainment disrespect the flag, anthem, and police is the answer to combating racism and social divide then honestly where is this country heading ?

What is so disrespectful? Seriously?

I wrote this elsewhere and I'll post it here again:

Seeing a lot of people posting about how this kneeling is anti-American, anti-veteran, and anti-military, I have to say this:

What does this has to do with veterans? I am proud to have served a country and upheld a constitution that allows for the protest to take place in the first place. I think my fellow veterans would or should say the same thing.

The armed forces and veterans are not the only ones represented by the anthem or the flag. It should represent all people, if some Americans feel it doesn't, it is their right to kneel, sit, or stay in the locker room.

I think it is the very patriotic to stand for what you believe in to make America a better place for all of our citizens, even if I personally wouldn't participate in this form of protest.

My friend David posted this and I think it applies to another aspect quite well:

"I shouldn't be surprised, but the hypocrisy demonstrated by the "Free speech" crowd is just baffling.

When student groups and society at large deem your words and ideas socially unacceptable, it's a precipitous assault on first amendment rights. The first amendment is inviolable, sacrosanct, and we should be ashamed that we allow this to happen.

When the President of the United States, the chief executive of the nation, makes official statements on behalf of the US Government encouraging a private organization (the NFL) to curtail the first amendment rights of its employees, it's totally not a big deal."
 
Glad we did this. (Thread separation). Come Sunday I just want to watch football I'm getting too tired to be outraged by a player who wants to protest something by not standing up. All I want to read about in the Football thread, is football.

If I were a betting man, (and I am I), all Trump did with that last blurb was make it safe...hell, even heroic, to pick up Kaepernick this season.
 
I like to think being an American means more than waving a flag on Sunday. I like to think being an American means having the courage to do what you feel is right, despite the outrage. Kneeling for the anthem is a hell of a lot less harmful than other forms of protest, some of which we have covered as naseum on this forum.

If I see injustice I hope I stand up for my beliefs in the face of outrage. IMO as veterans we should be defending these actions, as they are a form of the free speech we swore to defend in our oath.
 
What is so disrespectful? Seriously?

I wrote this elsewhere and I'll post it here again:

Seeing a lot of people posting about how this kneeling is anti-American, anti-veteran, and anti-military, I have to say this:

What does this has to do with veterans? I am proud to have served a country and upheld a constitution that allows for the protest to take place in the first place. I think my fellow veterans would or should say the same thing.

The armed forces and veterans are not the only ones represented by the anthem or the flag. It should represent all people, if some Americans feel it doesn't, it is their right to kneel, sit, or stay in the locker room.

I think it is the very patriotic to stand for what you believe in to make America a better place for all of our citizens, even if I personally wouldn't participate in this form of protest.

My friend David posted this and I think it applies to another aspect quite well:

"I shouldn't be surprised, but the hypocrisy demonstrated by the "Free speech" crowd is just baffling.

When student groups and society at large deem your words and ideas socially unacceptable, it's a precipitous assault on first amendment rights. The first amendment is inviolable, sacrosanct, and we should be ashamed that we allow this to happen.

When the President of the United States, the chief executive of the nation, makes official statements on behalf of the US Government encouraging a private organization (the NFL) to curtail the first amendment rights of its employees, it's totally not a big deal."

I completely agree it is their right to not stand, doesn't make it right in any way though. It's also (I know these comparison don't exactly equal each other, but the base is there) in an individuals right to be a white supremacists, but that doesn't make it right either.

I'm not here to spout, "Oh everyone died for this flag, I've got buddies and whatnot", we've all heard or read it before. I do believe the flag represents more than President Trump and more than veteran sacrifices. It's a symbol of this countries freedoms and so is the anthem. So to pick that one thing, that particular song to protest to me, is disrespectful to every American.

In the end, once again, do they need to pick sitting for the anthem as their platform to protest instead of something more beneficial? What is sitting out doing, because honestly it's creating more divide.

Shouldn't we rally together for America?
 
I don't think proud is the word that comes to mind when thinking about what they have done.

I believe they do have the right to stand, kneel, sit, ect during the anthem, but is that really the greatest form of protest these guys can come up with? Why can't they do something that isn't disrespectful, such as donating their money to inner cities or better training for police departments.

If having NFL players who are here for mine and everyone's entertainment disrespect the flag, anthem, and police is the answer to combating racism and social divide then honestly where is this country heading ?
Kaepernick actually donates a bunch of his time and money to youth programs while continuing his protest.

Look, America complains about violence from BLM, and protesters blocking traffic, and myriad other things that distract from the message. People say, "Why can't you follow the example of MLK and protest peacefully?" So NFL players go ahead and do that, and people still lose their minds. It's literally the most peaceful form of protest and America still isn't good with it. I mean, what good is a protest if it doesn't generate some measure of controversy? What are black activists supposed to do? Ask nicely?
 
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Some other things to consider: why do we play the national anthem at sporting events? Why do we have the military there?

The anthem is played because it’s a large public gathering.

The military presence? PR, nothing else. Given the league’s attitude the military should pull their support/presence.
 
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