United States & Gun Control discussion.

[JBS]

1) carry permits for veterans & retired first responders
2) rethink how we deal with mentally challenged people
3) rethink how we deal with criminals
4) rethink how media reports
For starters

The media is a HUGE part of what is happening right now.

In all honesty (and once again, this is going to sound insensitive to some, so pardon the fuck out of me, but...) I think the shooting itself has now been officially blown out of proportion. We're literally talking a week of 24/7 coverage, and mostly because of the severity and heinousness of the crime; everyone who is a parent can feel the fleeting pang of fear/anger/rage that wells up every time the topic comes up. These are powerful emotions and they are being milked for all they are worth. It's not being kept in proportion at all.

 

[pardus]

The media is a HUGE part of what is happening right now.

In all honesty (and once again, this is going to sound insensitive to some, so pardon the fuck out of me, but...) I think the shooting itself has now been officially blown out of proportion. We're literally talking a week of 24/7 coverage, and mostly because of the severity and heinousness of the crime; everyone who is a parent can feel the fleeting pang of fear/anger/rage that wells up every time the topic comes up. These are powerful emotions and they are being milked for all they are worth. It's not being kept in proportion at all.

Agreed.
Think about it, we (as a country) are seriously considering/advocating the removal/neutering of one of our fundamental rights.
All because one person was crazy and as a result killed some people.

 

[Gypsy]

There is always a risk of blue-on-blue when off-duty or plainclothes cops or armed civilians engage a goblin (hat tip to COL Cooper). However, by the logic expressed above no one should intervene in such a situation. The evidence directly contradicts that. There are documented instances of a single responder effectively stopping the violence. We know that many of these active killer types will kill themselves as soon as some pressure is applied, and we also know that introducing even one responder changes their focus. Both of these are good things.

The Oregon mall shooting. There was a guy who concealed carried he had his wife and kid with him, got them out or away from the scene. Evidently the shooter's weapon jammed and the civilian pulled his weapon. He (civvie) didn't shoot because there was another person close (behind?) but the shooter saw him and saw his weapon. The shooter then escaped to the stairwell and killed himself.

A single responder...he made a difference and saved countless lives.

 

[CDG]

Great article from policeone.com about active shooters in schools. Very aptly titled "The Enemy Is Denial".

"Pointing around the room as he spoke, Grossman continued, “But you’ve still got those fire sprinklers, those fire exit signs, fire hydrants outside, and fire trucks nearby! Are these fire guys crazy? Are these fire guys paranoid? No! This fire guy is our A+ student! Because this fire guy has redundant, overlapping layers of protection, not a single kid has been killed by school fire in the last 50 years!
“But you try to prepare for violence — the thing much more likely to kill our kids in schools, the thing hundreds of times more likely to kill our kids in schools — and people think you’re paranoid. They think you’re crazy. ...They’re in denial.”

http://www.policeone.com/active-sho...tive-shooters-in-schools-The-enemy-is-denial/

 

[Worldweaver]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-12-19/obama-backs-assault-weapons-ban-as-he-calls-for-action.html

...and away we go.

Obama said the Second Amendment to the Constitution guarantees the right of citizens to own firearms and that most gun owners abide by the law.
“I’m also betting that the majority, the vast majority of responsible law-abiding gun owners would be some of the first to say that we should be able to keep an irresponsible, law- breaking few from buying a weapon of war,” he said.

 

[Scotth]

Obama has no desire to avert a fiscal cliff. The Conservatives will either cave, and he will tax the rich more heavily, or they will hold fast, and the fiscal cliff will arrive- taxing the rich more heavily- and plunge us into a very deep recession, and probably worse.

Just because the Bush Tax cuts are allowed to expire doesn't mean the issue ends there. Mark my words if the Bush Tax Cut are allowed to expire, no later then the State of the Union speech Obama will announce his plan for a new round of middle class tax cuts. He is not going to agree to anymore 1/2 measures or deals that kick the can down the road. He done repeatedly fighting the same fight.

 

[Chopstick]

We have nothing to fear because our government is so very trustworthy and has everything under control.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...can-cartel-shootout-that-killed-beauty-queen/

How did a gun belonging to a former assistant special agent in charge at the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives end up at a crime scene in Mexico where five died, including a Mexican beauty queen?
That's the question being asked by congressional investigators and ATF officials in Phoenix.
A FN Five-Seven semi-automatic pistol, a high powered handgun originally
restricted to military and law enforcement customers, was recovered by Mexican police at the scene of a Nov. 23 shootout between the Sinaloa Cartel and the Mexican military.
Records show the gun was purchased in January 2010 by George Gillett, the former No. 2 in the ATF office in Phoenix. Gillett now works at ATF headquarters in Washington as a liaison to the federal Bureau of Prisons.
Gillett purchased the weapon at Legendary Arms, a Phoenix gun store. On the federal form 4473 used to buy the gun, Gillett used the ATF office address, 201 East Washington, and said "Apt 940." On subsequent purchase, Gillett used a commercial address, that of a strip mall.
Both actions are illegal, since ATF regulations require buyers use their residential address.

 

[CDG]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-12-19/obama-backs-assault-weapons-ban-as-he-calls-for-action.html

...and away we go.

Obama said the Second Amendment to the Constitution guarantees the right of citizens to own firearms and that most gun owners abide by the law.
“I’m also betting that the majority, the vast majority of responsible law-abiding gun owners would be some of the first to say that we should be able to keep an irresponsible, law- breaking few from buying a weapon of war,” he said.

I could have sworn this was already in place, Mr. President. The Newtown shooter didn't buy his guns. He stole them from his own mother. He also killed her. So more restrictive gun laws would help because.......? Oh that's right, they won't. You just don't know anything about guns because the closest you've ever been to one is walking next to a Secret Service agent charged with saving your life in the event of an attempt on it. God knows you lack any ability or experience in that regard.

 

[Worldweaver]

Entertaining video, especially when Piers call the guest "stupid" and "idiot"

 

[Marine0311]

I love debates with ad hommin personal attacks.

Please S/S community contact your elected officials. Please vote. Please get involved in our governing systems.

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

Entertaining video, especially when Piers call the guest "stupid" and "idiot"

Good lord, and this guy is a reporter?

Reasons for the AR15 and similar type magazine fed semi auto rifles:
1. Defense of life and property from a group of attackers.
2. Increased distance in keeping attackers a bay.
3. More stable and accurate then a pistol or shotgun.
4. Competition (High Power, 3 Gun, etc).
5. But one of the most important is that this country has the second amendment that guarantees this type of weapon for the very specific reason that every able bodied; of age person is the militia and are responsible for the safety and security of their state.

The arguments that it’s too lethal or that the need to fight off large groups, be part of the militia, are all ignorance from a lack of historical understanding. These types of rifles were recently used by lawful owners to protect life and property during the LA riots, the Hurricane Andrew looters, Hurricane Katrina looters, etc. They were borrowed from civilian gun store owners during the LA shootings from LEO’s who were not armed with rifles. These are just a very few incidents that are very well known, and there are many times more, that are not as well known but just as relevant.

Again, stop trying to punish lawful gun-owners for crimes they are not committing.

 

[Lefty375]

Piers Morgan is one of the worst people to ever have a show. I really don't understand how people watch him.

 

[policemedic]

Is Piers Morgan a citizen of the US?

 

[Deleted member 2517]

What an unprofessional, illogical ass. No wonder Joan Rivers beat his ass on the "Apprentice"

 

[Totentanz]

Piers Morgan is one of the worst people to ever have a show. I really don't understand how people watch him.

Agree entirely. Hands-down the most vapid garbage I've had the misfortune of witnessing (the few times I found my TV tuned to CNN while he was on) on a "news" network. That EMI should be shelved right next to History Channel's latest show on dumpster diving.

 

[TH15]

Piers Morgan is a fucking useless piece of shit- and that's being generous. The guy handled this limey prick quite well given the circumstances.

 

[JBS]

Wow. Just lost the last shred of respect I had for Morgan.

The guest handled himself very nicely.

This is the lunacy we are up against, gents (and ladies). The facts really are irrelevant to the extreme Leftists pushing this agenda.

 

[Marine0311]

The people are not to be disarmed of their weapons. They are left in full posession of them."
Zachariah Johnson
Elliot's Debates, vol. 3 "The Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution."

"The greatest danger to American freedom is a government that ignores the Constitution."
Thomas Jefferson
Third President of the United States

and an extreme view for gun control:

"This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!"
Adolph Hitler
Chancellor, Germany, 1933

 

[Jettie]

Here is one of Piers Pantya**'s tweets today:
@coelkhntr I think you are somewhat gleeful that a tragedy happened to help you push your cause
@piersmorgan Of course I am, you moron > RT @coelkhntr I think you are somewhat gleeful that a tragedy happened to help you push your cause

You can e-mail your disgust and help to get this puerile nanny-trained tantrum boy fired.
http://www.cnn.com/feedback/

 

[JBS]

Is Piers Morgan a citizen of the US?

Who better to lecture America on gun culture than a Brit?