US swaps Saudi for Iran

CQB

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Ive just been T-Boned by this one. Pretty interesting information. Now with no dependence on ME oil...

The nuclear talks, French diplomats suspect, are just one part of a strategic rapprochement with Iran. Washington has practically sub-contracted the war against the Islamic State’s forces in Iraq to Iranian special forces and Tehran’s Iraqi militia proxies. The French view this as a potentially counter-productive move, one more part of Washington’s turn away from its Sunni allies and toward Tehran.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/03/30/how-france-became-an-iran-hawk/
 

Marauder06

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Who would we "side" against by partnering with Iran? Unless we want to fight quite literally ALL of our allies in the region, from Israel to Afghanistan, it doesn't make any sense at all to "partner" with Iran. "Negotiate?" sure. But "partner?" No way.
 

Brill

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Kraut783

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you know, I always thought the "Holy War" in the middle east would be Islam vs Christian........now, thinking it's shaping up to be Shi'a vs Sunni....
 

Salt USMC

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Abu Bakr has the experience AND some would say the approval of Muhammad himself, but will his age hamper him in the later rounds?

My money is on Ali. He's young and eager. He makes up for a smaller number of followers with grit and determination. This darkhorse fighter could prove troublesome for Abu Bakr!
 

CQB

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you know, I always thought the "Holy War" in the middle east would be Islam vs Christian........now, thinking it's shaping up to be Shi'a vs Sunni....
Looks like it. I have mixed feelings about my original post with the only take away being I agree with the French position. The only thing in favour of the Shia is that the Kurds have taken in Christian and Yasidi minorities & I think (correct me here) there are still Jewish communities in Iran. There's none in Iraq & Christians ie: Assyrians et al have been sent packing.
 

comrade-z

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Looks like it. I have mixed feelings about my original post with the only take away being I agree with the French position. The only thing in favour of the Shia is that the Kurds have taken in Christian and Yasidi minorities & I think (correct me here) there are still Jewish communities in Iran. There's none in Iraq & Christians ie: Assyrians et al have been sent packing.

There are some Jews indeed still in Iran (approx. 8,500). The majority left around the time of the revolution; those families have some interesting stories about all that, but that is a different topic.
 

pardus

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Looks like it. I have mixed feelings about my original post with the only take away being I agree with the French position. The only thing in favour of the Shia is that the Kurds have taken in Christian and Yasidi minorities & I think (correct me here) there are still Jewish communities in Iran. There's none in Iraq & Christians ie: Assyrians et al have been sent packing.

Are you saying that the Kurds are Shia? The majority are actually Sunni.
 

AWP

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What makes me pause are the sheer numbers.

http://www.pewforum.org/2009/10/07/mapping-the-global-muslim-population/

In four countries – Iran, Azerbaijan, Bahrain and Iraq – Shia Muslims make up a majority of the total population.

We'd side with a vast minority (10-15% of the world's Muslim population) because....ISIL? One of the four above are our outright enemies, Azerbaijan figures into our foreign policy how, leaving Bahrain (Navy base) and Iraq as our "friends?"

Madness.
 

Marauder06

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Hey, good news about our new partners-to-be, the Iranians!

There is one reason we are pushing so hard on this issue, and that is domestic politics. I don't think anyone really thinks there is a shot at Iran being legit partners with us, our interests are fundamentally and diametrically opposed. The President would very much like this to be a "win," and John Kerry... well, with John Kerry involved I'm pretty sure this one is going to end up in the "L" column too.
 

pardus

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We know the Iranians will "cheat" on any agreement, so I wonder why POTUS is so determined to lift sanctions?

I wouldn't be surprised if it was just a fuck you to Israel and Netanyahu. IMO Obama hates Israel, he certainly seems to be doing whatever he can to weaken it's positon.
 

Salt USMC

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We know the Iranians will "cheat" on any agreement, so I wonder why POTUS is so determined to lift sanctions?
Someone pointed out to me the other day that the Iranians adhered completely to the Algiers Accords, even while shouting "Marg bar Amrika!" from the pulpit.

I think we ought not get too far ahead of ourselves. The most important reason being that there's not even a deal yet. All we can do is make broad generalizations about any country might do.

I heard something interesting the other day when someone addressed the US' past calls for "regime change" in Iran. Typically, those kinds of talks were couched in the rhetoric of military action, or support to myriad opposition groups (such as the MeK). This person pointed out that hard-liners in Iran are best-served by the status quo because they can "Marg bar Amrika" all day and their supporters will support them. Because of sanctions, many of Irans imports/exports are cut off from the world market and they are not subject to a lot of international norms because of it. In a way they are isolated, though obviously not to the extent that North Korea is. They still accept tourists, even from America. But the lack of transparency in government and, to a lesser extent media, hampers communication. Having talks with the P5+1 group already de-legitimizes these entrenched hardliners, somewhat. Getting a deal done and easing trade sanctions would open up Iran to world markets, which would force adoption of the standards of the international community. This would be an even bigger blow to the hardliners, which he asserted would be a "soft regime change." It wouldn't necessarily oust anyone, at least not immediately, but it's harder to "Marg bar Amrika" when you "Mo'amele ba Amrika" (trade with America).
 
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Salt USMC

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Today is Seezdeh Bedar, and important holiday in Persian culture celebrated 13 days after Nowruz.

What a great day to announce that negotiators have reached a deal on the framework for a draft nuclear deal!
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/02/iran-nuclear-talks-breakthrough-lausanne

Iran nuclear talks: officials claim breakthrough

Iranian and western officials claimed to have made a breakthrough in nuclear negotiations in Lausanne on Thursday night, and said they were drafting a joint statement.

After eight days of talks, often going late into the night, the Iranian foreign minister Mohammed Javad Zarif tweeted: “Found solutions. Ready to start drafting immediately.”


It's not a finalized deal, obviously, but this is very exciting news. Even if you don't like the idea, with the framework settled we can at least get an idea of what specific items a potential deal will involve. This is a good way to go into the weekend :thumbsup:
 

Gunz

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I wouldn't be surprised if it was just a fuck you to Israel and Netanyahu. IMO Obama hates Israel, he certainly seems to be doing whatever he can to weaken it's positon.

Absolutely. What I find hypocritical is this liberal administration's apparent determination to side with a state that sponsors terrorism, oppresses human rights and treats women like slaves. It makes no sense to me. We are empowering Iran to move into positions of great political influence in Iraq and elsewhere, facilitating their nuclear ambitions. Somehow, American liberals have re-educated themselves to ignore all Iran's evils.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/28/w...-have-worsened-un-investigator-says.html?_r=0
 

pardus

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Absolutely. What I find hypocritical is this liberal administration's apparent determination to side with a state that sponsors terrorism, oppresses human rights and treats women like slaves. It makes no sense to me. We are empowering Iran to move into positions of great political influence in Iraq and elsewhere, facilitating their nuclear ambitions. Somehow, American liberals have re-educated themselves to ignore all Iran's evils.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/28/w...-have-worsened-un-investigator-says.html?_r=0

Yep and taken to it's logical conclusion, the left is advocating the genocide of the Jews in Israel. Just like their demi god Clinton was "totally cool bro", with the genocide in Rwanda.
 
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