Poser Busting

I'll have to scroll back and start reading to figure out how support got into the poser buster thread as it has evolved into. But in the Air Force support has many different connotations as some organizations and AFSCs (MOSs) have long origins history of being Army Support and as far as the 9 Functional areas structure of the Air Forces occupations are setup all AFSCs that don't start with a 1 are technically support in nature.

As far as how, what, why, and when the current Special Tactics and Pararescue Squadrons consider and to a lesser degree treat support one needs to be familiar on how each began to have support AFSCs assigned to the teams before these squadrons came into being ca. 1985s.

Anyhow the Air Force in its classification structure has recently established several reporting identifiers to ensure the support folks realize they be valued contributors to the unit's mission.

9Z000, Special Warfare Mission Support (SWMS) Career Field Manager (CFM) on Headquarters Air Force Staff, Air Force Special Warfare Division. (31 Oct 21). A nominative position.

9Z100, Special Warfare Mission Support (SWMS) Senior Enlisted Leader, Air Force Special Warfare (AFSPECWAR). (31 Oct 21). A nominative position.

9Z200, Special Warfare Mission Support (SWMS) Superintendent, Air Force Special Warfare (AFSPECWAR). (31 Oct 21). Must hold one of the following AFSC’s: 1C0X2, 1C5X1, 1D7XX, 1N0X1, 1N1X1, 1N490, 1P0X1, 2G0X1, 2T2X1, 2T3X0,3E0X1, 3E1X1, 3E9X1, 3F0X1, 3F5X1, 3P0X1, and 4A1X1. Serving in the rank of SMSgt and MSgt. Prior experience in: Special Tactics, Guardian Angel, Tactical Air Control Party, or any Air Force Special units are required.
 
Totentanz said:
Generally starts with the Havok Journal article at post #435.
Click to expand...
Thanks for directing me to the post. Read the article and checking service history on somebody requires a bit more professionalism than being drunk belligerent in a bar, airport, or whatever. The extract from the Havok Journal article somewhat sums the reality up of it though: "Stolen Valor is a real problem but not a new one – folks have lied about their service for personal and political gain after the Civil War and after both World Wars."

What is not mentioned is some have done it on active duty and in a way that becomes very embarrassing to the service uniform they wear. Also many who do are in supervisory and higher leadership positions and present themselves as subject matter experts on matters they have no experience with.

Back in 2009 an Air Force Security Forces colonel (O-6) came under scrutiny for claim in official Bio of made a combat static line jump during Just Cause (1989) and a subsequent combat MFF during Desert Storm. The inquiry snowballed from there as it appears under guise he was temporarily attached to non Air Force classified unit that didn't know how to publish the aeronautical orders for permanent award of the Parachutist Badges he had his superiors get such orders published. Funny thing no record of going through the initial qual courses or getting the pay existed and further no record of any aircraft that he jumped from exists, as he wasn't a jumpmaster no record of jumpmaster and other jumpers that accompanied him exists.

There is also the Poster hero of the Air Force's Wounded Warrior Program that fabricated history of being a PJ during the Vietnam War that was exposed after an article was published in August-September 2011 edition of Airman Magazine titled “After the Fall The Air Force Wounded Warrior Program.

His claim is as an Air Force PJ he flew on the UH-1s of the Army's 1st Squadron, 6th Cavalry. Further no KIA, MIA, or helicopter loss event matches his story, except one. A HH-43 (Pedro 42) combat loss on 28 October 1966 matches strangely almost exact to his story. The PJ doing this mission was awarded the Silver Star.

On 28 October Pedro 42 (HH-43F SN 62-4511) on an Army Med Evac mission near Pleiku was shot down and burned. Three evacuees and the Flight Mechanic in the rear of the helicopter were killed. Army troops and the Pararescueman (PJ) on the ground helped get the Pilot and Copilot out of the burning wreckage under enemy fire. The PJ, Pilot and Copilot were flown out the next morning by another Pedro helicopter. The Copilot subsequently died from injuries received in the shooting down and crash of the helicopter. Pedro 42 established his hover and lowered the hoist with the pararescue specialist and two semi-rigid letters. The trees were 100 to 150 feet and it was difficult to thread the cable down, as it was catching on the tree limbs. Pedro 42 picked up the three most critically wounded and lowered the hoist for the fourth pickup. It was hit by a mortar round fired by the attacking North Vietnamese forces.

His other heroic is being the hero of the 1983 Beirut Marine barracks bombing as a medic assigned to aero medic squadron (no record of the unit exists).

Pararescue has been a small AFSC never exceeding combined Active duty and reserve component numbers of 500 personnel per fiscal year which means the cumulative number of PJ since 1946 is only a thousand or so to keep track of, not to mention each mission generates an after action report which is archived. So, the PJ community can expose a poser very quickly and the PJ poser exposed stories are as good as or better than any Don Shipley tells of.
 
Last edited:
Totentanz said:
Generally starts with the Havok Journal article at post #435.
Click to expand...
I'll tie it all together: "Support guys in SF units are posers."
Johca said:
Back in 2009 an Air Force Security Forces colonel (O-6) came under scrutiny for claim in official Bio of made a combat static line jump during Just Cause (1989) and a subsequent combat MFF during Desert Storm. The inquiry snowballed from there as it appears under guise he was temporarily attached to non Air Force classified unit that didn't know how to publish the aeronautical orders for permanent award of the Parachutist Badges he had his superiors get such orders published. Funny thing no record of going through the initial qual courses or getting the pay existed and further no record of any aircraft that he jumped from exists, as he wasn't a jumpmaster no record of jumpmaster and other jumpers that accompanied him exists.
Click to expand...
Tangentially related: in JSOC there was a guy in my unit who got removed from command for allowing sketchy recruiting practices, which included some toxic command climate / sexual harassment issues and trying to allow an under-qualified female reservist into our highly-selective unit who, it turns out, was banging his married NCOIC. But instead of getting punted, he got shunted. Off to staff he went. It later came out that he was going on all of these "TDYs" all of the place but never filed any travel vouchers. SUPER shady. As in, "should be a counter-intel investigation" shady. But his excuse was "I'm independently wealthy, so I don't file TDY vouchers so I can save the unit money." More likely he didn't want the paper trail marking whatever it was he was really up to. I thought it was total bullshit, but they let him stick around.

What finally got him booted was that the S1 shop did a routine jump pay scrub and found out he had been collecting jump pay for a long time, might have been years, and wasn't doing any jumps. So then they eased him out of the unit.

But they didn't put any paperwork on him, and years later I found out he had an important job at USASFC. Because if you just look a the guy's ORB, he looks pretty good. And he was a good talker. But he was a total piece of shit, as everyone who served with him knew.

An A&S process for USASFC would have picked up on that.
 
Johca said:
Wow, I have known of the badges and Tab revocation policies for decades, but this is the first I've ever heard of such revocations actually happening. I've known of Air Force servicemembers being court martialed and sent as convicts for a many years stint as a prisoner in Ft Leavenworth and their permanently awarded parachutist and aviation badges were never revoked.
Click to expand...
Three in total over 18 months in that first command. I took no pleasure in it. However flawed I am, I do not equivocate when it comes to UCMJ, promotions, re-enlistments, and awards. I’ve shown myself to be open with praise and recognition, and firm in performance improvement and punishment.

My 1SG was a key piece of forming my views on the subject. He said, “Sir, you can “SF fire this guy, or you can ask yourself if you’d served with him on an ODA, and trust him as a GB in retirement.” God bless our NCOs for their plain speaking.
 
Cookie_ said:
Weirdly enough I've had this situation happen twice in the past few weeks, all because of my unit sweatshirt. Most of our merch isn't explicitly saying "Special Forces"
Click to expand...
Similarly, my favorite grocery- getter is my old 101st Airborne Div. hoodie. Proudly wear it but have had to explain more than once that the unit is no longer Airborne.
 
Last edited:
Topkick said:
Wes Moore and the Bronze Star He Claimed but Never Received

Obama wannabe apparently claiming he had a bronze star and now says it was an "honest mistake." I may be wrong, but this guy looked to be the Dems "rising star" He seemed fake from the beginning to me.
Click to expand...

82nd Captain with a 2005 deployment to AFG, why didn’t he get a BS for service? Pretty standard at that time for O3’s.

But, he knew what he got…and didn’t get, there’s no guessing
 
I knew an E-5 at the time who got a BS as the company's motor daddy, for basically lying on 026 prints, begging, stealing, and somehow got my ORIL report to disappear from thin air when it came to redeploying from Iraq back to Germany with no obstructions like the missing things that were buried such as batteries, radiators, and starters in the burn pits.

I really don't give it much thought unless I see a V in them. They get my respect. The others without that V, lol, but no. Take the ARCOM like the rest of us ya clowns.
 
VoodooActual said:
So I gotta poser quesh in light of the Gov Walz SF hat debacle.

I live in an undisclosed location somewhere in the heart of the People’s Republic of Pineland. Along with that, there’s a lot of SF guys who wear Pineland memorabilia. But there also a few civilians and some veterans/AD/NG (non-SF), who assist with the exercise, and also wear Pineland memorabilia at times when not actively participating with the exercise. Hats, t-shirts, and the like. I realize this is not distinctive unit insignia, so it’s not quite the same, but how does the SF community view that?

It has kind of come across to me like wanting others to assume you’re SF, even if you’re not outright lying about that, but maybe I’m being unfair in this. What do you guys think?
Click to expand...
Are they being ambiguous or unambiguous about it?

I think those guys just wearing the shirts and hats or displaying the flags is harmless and is a sincere form of flattery mixed in of pride of what they help with doing and in some cases, still serving the nation on the outside now.

I think it's far different than say, my own example issue on why I won't buy or own an OKC-3S despite it being the superior bayonet or any milsurp USGI clothing or gear with NSN's and with the eagle, globe, and anchor. I didn't earn it and the right to display this right of passage that I was never a part of.

However if my kid were to enlist in another branch or because of whom I work for now and offered me a shirt despite having never served with them or even attached to or belonged to with orders, I'd gladly rock it to show my support for them. Does this make me a poser too?
 
VoodooActual said:
So I gotta poser quesh in light of the Gov Walz SF hat debacle.

I live in an undisclosed location somewhere in the heart of the People’s Republic of Pineland. Along with that, there’s a lot of SF guys who wear Pineland memorabilia. But there also a few civilians and some veterans/AD/NG (non-SF), who assist with the exercise, and also wear Pineland memorabilia at times when not actively participating with the exercise. Hats, t-shirts, and the like. I realize this is not distinctive unit insignia, so it’s not quite the same, but how does the SF community view that?

It has kind of come across to me like wanting others to assume you’re SF, even if you’re not outright lying about that, but maybe I’m being unfair in this. What do you guys think?
Click to expand...

Man some of those guys that run as G’s know more about being an SF guy than some SF guys.

They can critique your order like an RI. They get given that stuff and they can wear it.

If we gave a guy a team shirt, the expectation is that they will wear it.
 
Kraut783 said:
82nd Captain with a 2005 deployment to AFG, why didn’t he get a BS for service? Pretty standard at that time for O3’s.

But, he knew what he got…and didn’t get, there’s no guessing
Click to expand...
It seems like his CO intended for him to get one based on some articles I read. It also appears he left the service without any personal awards, which is pretty sad. That’s likely due to a bad command more than a reflection on his performance.

I understand award discrepancies to a point. For example I’m not 100% certain how many Meritorious Unit Commendation ribbons I rate and it turns out I’ve been wearing the wrong number of stars on my meritorious service medal. That’s embarrassing. In both cases, however, I was wearing less awards than I earned not more.

It’s much harder to comprehend wearing a personal award that is normally presented to you in a formal ceremony with pomp and circumstance. He was a reservist and I assumed he drilled in his home state… I imagine they would still hold a ceremony for him if it were approved post ETS. He would receive a certificate and a medal in the mail at a minimum. He knew he didn’t rate this award. Even if perhaps he did deserve it. This is not a good look for a former military officer and current elected official.
 
Last edited:
VoodooActual said:
So I gotta poser quesh in light of the Gov Walz SF hat debacle.

I live in an undisclosed location somewhere in the heart of the People’s Republic of Pineland. Along with that, there’s a lot of SF guys who wear Pineland memorabilia. But there also a few civilians and some veterans/AD/NG (non-SF), who assist with the exercise, and also wear Pineland memorabilia at times when not actively participating with the exercise. Hats, t-shirts, and the like. I realize this is not distinctive unit insignia, so it’s not quite the same, but how does the SF community view that?

It has kind of come across to me like wanting others to assume you’re SF, even if you’re not outright lying about that, but maybe I’m being unfair in this. What do you guys think?
Click to expand...
Article directly related to the first sentence: Sometimes A Hat Is Just A Hat • The Havok Journal

"Pineland" isn't an Army unit. it's not a certification, or a qualification. You don't wear an official "Pineland" tab on your uniform the rest of your career. There is no Pineland colored beret. I don't think anyone would reasonably assume that someone merely wearing Pineland materiel is trying to make people think they're SF.

I went on the Pineland Underground podcast a year or two ago and they gave me a Pineland Underground shirt, which I wore to the gym often and think I still have somewhere. Last year at SHOT I attended the SF Association dinner as a non-SF guest and one of the things everyone got was a Pineland t-shirt. If they didn't want us non-SF types to wear that stuff, they wouldn't be giving it to us. It's free advertising for SF, the SF Association, and Pineland Underground. Why wouldn't they want us to wear it?

I work with two active duty SF NCOs and so far neither of them have batted an eye about my Pineland paraphernalia. Next time I'm in the office I'll do an experiment and make sure they both observe me wearing one of my Pineland shirts, and if they have anything at all to say about it, I'll report back. But I sincerely doubt they will care one iota. But if they both spontaneously jump up and beat my ass over it, I'll assume I was wrong. ;)

Wait, you asked how the SF community views this. I'll leave that part to actual SF guys here on the site to opine-land (see what I did there?) about that part.
 
Teufel said:
It seems like his CO intended for him to get one base on some articles I read. It also appears he left the service without any personal awards, which is pretty sad. That’s likely due to a bad command more than a reflection on his performance.

I understand award discrepancies to a point. For example I’m not 100% certain how many Meritorious Unit Commendation ribbons I rate and it turns out I’ve been wearing the wrong number of stars on my meritorious service medal. That’s embarrassing. In both cases, however, I was wearing less awards than I earned not more.

It’s much harder to comprehend wearing a personal award that is normally presented to you in a formal ceremony with pomp and circumstance. He was a reservist and I assumed he drilled in his home state… I imagine they would still hold a ceremony for him if it were approved post ETS. He would receive a certificate and a medal in the mail at a minimum. He knew he didn’t rate this award. Even if perhaps he did deserve it. This is not a good look for a former military officer and current elected official.
Click to expand...
Additional thoughts:

He knew it was a lie when he did it. All he had to do was say "recommended" instead of "awarded" and it would have been 100% factual. But he didn't. Why? Because having something "awarded" looks far better on an application than something "recommended." He lied and took an unfair advantage in the application process. How much of a difference it made in him getting it I don't know, because he was extraordinarily qualified for it even without the BSM. But he did it. It opens the door to what other things he is, or has been, lying about.

He also failed to correct at least two incidents where someone intro'd him as having the BSM. So he let the lie continue. And how did they know he (allegedly) had a BSM in the first place? It wasn't from his Fellowship bio, because it's not listed there. So... who was telling these people that he had a BSM?
 
The misconception of the unwashed masses is that a Bronze Star means you're some kind of war hero. If they only knew the difference between "V" and no "V."

I worked with a former Soldier who kept bragging about his Bronze Star. When I pressed him on it, it was for meritorious administrative work as a PIO in II Corps. Compare that with the Bronze w/V that a friend of mine was awarded when a jeep he was driving with two officers was ambushed. Both officers killed, my friend shot in the neck but he manned an M60 and burned through a hundred-round belt before he passed out from blood loss.

Failing to acknowledge a falsehood about your service, leaving it out there for the public to surmise you're some kind of badass, is still a lie. Moore and Walz are liars. Fuck them.
 

Similar threads

AWP
HAPPY MONDAY FROM THE BOOK SUPPOSITORY BUILDING!!!!
Replies
13
Views
824
Muppet
Muppet
Marauder06
"Yesterday Was Veterans Day. Today, Call Your Battle Buddy."
Replies
0
Views
521
Marauder06
Marauder06
Devildoc
Weird ask...
Replies
5
Views
258
Cookie_
C
TLDR20
Colonel Rocky Farr.
Replies
6
Views
422
Devildoc
Devildoc
BlackSmokeRisinG
Drones(?) overhead….
2 3 4
Replies
67
Views
1K
policemedic
policemedic
Back
Top