The Evolution of The 75th Ranger Regiment

[RustyShackleford]

I joined this site in 2008. I posted an intro way back then. I have to do it again?

Your intro post from 2008 has probably been deleted, so as Free said, don't worry about it. Good post by the way.

 

[JackMurphyRGR]

In my experience I found that some SOP's are critical, as mentioned above. The location of your med pouch is something that should be standardized. That said, I always found standardized kit, particularly packing rucksacks exactly the same to be excessive and unnecessary. Maybe you need to know where your buddy's claymore mine is located. 2x OD socks, rolled and in the bottom left corner of the ruck...not so much.

SOP's (or TTP's as is the current buzzword) are often neutral. Good NCO's know dozens of techniques and know when to apply which one to any given situation that is encountered. That's one reason why there is no substitute for real experienced leadership.

 

[Brill]

In my experience I found that some SOP's are critical, as mentioned above. The location of your med pouch is something that should be standardized. That said, I always found standardized kit, particularly packing rucksacks exactly the same to be excessive and unnecessary. Maybe you need to know where your buddy's claymore mine is located. 2x OD socks, rolled and in the bottom left corner of the ruck...not so much.

Were those socks were properly stenciled with the Rangers name & last four? ;)

Possibly Ranger vs. SF mentality, being that a new Joe could go to the 75th whereas SF was looking for more "seasoned or weathered" soldier?

 

[abn_rngr]

abn_rngr I thoroughly enjoyed your post on how it was "back then". I always got the feeling that Rangers were at there most "special" back then, when combat experience was still available.

I don't think anyone has anything against SOP's, its the SOP's that don't make sense, or are enforced for the sake of "it's an SOP". Things like everyone having their med pouch on their left side makes sense and saves lives, as one example.

There were distinct advantages to being separate Bns, with no centralized headquarters. There were distinct advantages to having to work things out once we went 'special operations.' To more succinctly make my point, we could be special because we had the fundamentals so firmly nailed down.

In my previous post I made mention of the 'story of the Christmas ham.' Great, great grandma is invited over for Christmas dinner and sits in the kitchen as mom prepares it. She follows the recipe religiously- a 15lb ham, carefully selected for shape and marbling, spices, the candied glaze, the oven temperature, the type of pan, all of it. Just prior to putting it in to the oven she takes a knife and cuts off 2" from either side of the ham. Grandma looks at her oddly and asks why she did that. Mom replies, surprised, "well, that's how we've always done it and, it always turns out great, every year." Grandma nods and says "sure, but we only used to do that because it wouldn't fit int hat old oven unless we did." When you don't know the why, you don't know when or how to change for fear of screwing up what you don't really understand.

 

[goon175]

Great, great grandma is invited over for Christmas dinner and sits in the kitchen as mom prepares it. She follows the recipe religiously- a 15lb ham, carefully selected for shape and marbling, spices, the candied glaze, the oven temperature, the type of pan, all of it. Just prior to putting it in to the oven she takes a knife and cuts off 2" from either side of the ham. Grandma looks at her oddly and asks why she did that. Mom replies, surprised, "well, that's how we've always done it and, it always turns out great, every year." Grandma nods and says "sure, but we only used to do that because it wouldn't fit int hat old oven unless we did." When you don't know the why, you don't know when or how to change for fear of screwing up what you don't really understand.

That is the best parable ever! I am going to use that somewhere, just not sure where yet!

 

[abn_rngr]

In my experience I found that some SOP's are critical, as mentioned above. The location of your med pouch is something that should be standardized. That said, I always found standardized kit, particularly packing rucksacks exactly the same to be excessive and unnecessary. Maybe you need to know where your buddy's claymore mine is located. 2x OD socks, rolled and in the bottom left corner of the ruck...not so much.

SOP's (or TTP's as is the current buzzword) are often neutral. Good NCO's know dozens of techniques and know when to apply which one to any given situation that is encountered. That's one reason why there is no substitute for real experienced leadership.

None of the 'old school' Rangers I know would disagree with what's going on these days. There is no doubt in anybody's eyes that Rangers today are everything we hoped we were years ago. Better killers to be sure. As was stated nobody loved starch and spits, everybody hated high and tights, but we trained hard and that mattered and kept people around. New things like RASP (and most of my ilk think it needs to be longer still), the marksmanship program, the way PT is conducted, the diminishing of the harassment suffered by the new guys, increased specialty training, broader reaching mission profiles, modified grooming standards when appropriate, language training, more exposure to SMUs, all those things and more are very, very positive.

I think what I'm reading in the thread is reaction to statements you've made that may be construed as throwing away the baby with the bathwater. As stated in my first post, what makes the Rangers of today capable of adapting so well in this current fight is the solidity of the base developed over the many years before. Without the selection, training standards, self-disciplined and hard-driving culture of yesteryear, the 75th of then couldn't be transformed into the 75th of today.

As to the old guard, recall the senior NCO leadership in place exhibits a self-selection bias. Those that enjoyed and believe in the efficacy of the 'high and tight mentality' stayed around when others moved on and are promoted up by those with a similar mindset.

 

[JackMurphyRGR]

I couldn't agree more. We stood on your shoulders. Before anyone gets the wrong idea, the Vietnam-era Rangers are my heroes. I joined the military and got an option 40 contract because I read their books. Today I'm happy to be in contact with many of them (some of them the authors of the books I read in High School) and call them friends. Maybe you are hearing the SF guy in me coming out. I would never argue against the way Rangers bring up and "home grow" Privates. The 75th does it the right way. Later on, as a Sergeant in SF I began to see that the same style of leadership and supervision can actually hinder the mission when applied in different circumstances. But you guys know the deal, Rangers and SF are like night and day.

 

[goon175]

different strokes for different folks!

I think both organizations could learn something from each other as far as the issue of how to best implement leadership/supervision. Both organizations could be better in those areas, from what I have seen. Not that either is LACKING in this area, please don't take it that way!

 

[Salt USMC]

I would never argue against the way Rangers bring up and "home grow" Privates. The 75th does it the right way. Later on, as a Sergeant in SF I began to see that the same style of leadership and supervision can actually hinder the mission when applied in different circumstances.

This is interesting. Can you give an example for us outsiders?

 

[Brian1/75]

We wore plain green jungle fatigues and jungle boots.
Yes, LCE was almost always worn unbuckled. How the f@#k do you IMT with two full ammo pouches and a buckled LCE?
I don't know what a loose SOP on pouches means. What?

I meant loose as in customized by the user to a certain extent. Nobody was freaking out if someone wanted to put two mag pouches on the same side.


As for the whole infantry vs special, it's of my opinion that all direct-action capable SOF are infantry. I always hated the statement, "Oh, Rangers they're just elite infantry." It reeked of ignorance and stupidity.

 

[surgicalcric]

...I always hated the statement, "Oh, Rangers they're just elite infantry." It reeked of ignorance and stupidity.

Maybe today, however my father and several of his 2nd BN buds referred to the BNs as elite infantry in their everyday conversations. After 32 years in the Army, many of them in the BNs and Ranger Companies, I would hardly consider him ignorant or stupid. ;)

 

[dknob]

I agree with cric , the 75th was initially meant to be an infantry force that took training, discipline, and fitness on a whole new level. It was not initally meant to be a special operations force. The whole point was to get awesome infantry guys molded from the Rangers and then sent out to the big Army to bring about what they learned. Although much of what we do in todays 75th is very infantry oriented... there are still MUCH what we do that isn't.

 

[dknob]

Man abn_rngr's posts are awesome to read.

 

[lancero]

Man abn_rngr's posts are awesome to read.

Agreed!
I got a fever, and the only cure is more abn_rngr posts.

 

[Brian1/75]

I agree with cric , the 75th was initially meant to be an infantry force that took training, discipline, and fitness on a whole new level. It was not initally meant to be a special operations force. The whole point was to get awesome infantry guys molded from the Rangers and then sent out to the big Army to bring about what they learned. Although much of what we do in todays 75th is very infantry oriented... there are still MUCH what we do that isn't.

I meant to say that all direct-action SOF are elite infantry at their basis with special skill sets above that. The Bns have always had special skill sets. To try to take away from Rangers of today or the past by 'downgrading' them to elite infantry as if SOF and elite infantry can't be synonymous is stupid.

 

[Poccington]

I agree with cric , the 75th was initially meant to be an infantry force that took training, discipline, and fitness on a whole new level. It was not initally meant to be a special operations force. The whole point was to get awesome infantry guys molded from the Rangers and then sent out to the big Army to bring about what they learned. Although much of what we do in todays 75th is very infantry oriented... there are still MUCH what we do that isn't.

As a slight divert, that's exactly what happened over here back in the day when we sent a few dudes over to you guys and put them through Ranger School.

They came back and were supposed to run courses aimed at increasing the skill level of troops, who would then go back to their Units and preach the new bible. Instead, we ended up with a new SOF Unit named the Army Ranger Wing, who even adopted the Ranger tab, with an Irish twist. Our only SOF Unit can trace it's beginnings all the way back to you boys.

Cool thread by the way. It's always interesting to see how Units develop and grow over time.

 

[TCnTally]

There was the Regimental Standard Operating Procedures, or RSOP, a Blue Book that when combined with the Ranger Creed dictated pretty much every action a Ranger was to take or prohibited from taking.

How or where do you get the blue book? We have not been able to find one.....any help would be greatly appreciated.....

 

[goon175]

The blue book is not publicly released, I believe it is FOUO.

 

[TCnTally]

The blue book is not publicly released, I believe it is FOUO.

Oookay... Not sure what that means..;).
Can we get it from regiment or 1st Lt? Buy it from Px,library card (haha). What is FOUO? Sorry to be a pain. Just trying to help out. Been getting shit about not having something that was never issued...

 

[JackMurphyRGR]

I had no idea that the Blue Book was restricted in anyway but to answer the question, they get issued out to everyone in Battalion. At least that's how it used to happen maybe they shoot you an e-mail with the PDF in AKO these days!