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This is going to be fail. Both on the enlisted side and I have a feeling more so on the officer side with women in positions of command.
Women in Combat Arms/ SOF Discussion
- Thread starter AWP
- Start date
I think the Army's standard (maybe DoD's?) is a 6 month profile after childbirth. I know my hernia repair put me on a 6 month profile and it was over a year before I could run without it bothering me. I can't imagine coming back after a C-section. The Army would have to bury them on a staff somewhere and I question how that would play early in a career if she left a platoon leader slot early.
We can all "what if" this thing, and maybe it is the pessimist in me, but it seems like there are more chances for failure than success. It has to play out and confirm/ deny our fears, but I don't have any faith in Big Army's or Congress' ability to remain objective.
Yep, so we have a pregnant 2 (or 1) Lt who is out of the game for a year.
The SJW's will bitch if she doesn't get the same marks as her male colleagues.
There are jobs (JAG) where being pregnant does not take you out of the game, others not so much.
The Army is moving towards MOS-specific physical fitness standards. I imagine pregnancy will be one of the things addressed. It should also help address some of the issues we've run into for years with a one-size-fits-all profile and assignment system.
As an example, several years ago 4BCT 10th MTN DIV (LI) was in a fight with HRC about 11-series E7s and E8s being assigned to the BDE. About 40% of them had no-running profiles. They were still deployable so HRC considered it not a problem. For the BDE CDR and CSM it was a huge problem. They, justifiably, said they weren't going to put PSGs and 1SGs in line companies who couldn't run with their troopers. It meant the BDE was reporting a major shortage of personnel - but their HR numbers didn't agree.
The shifts in physical standards and profile management should line up with GEN Milley's initiatives on deployability and readiness that go to IOC on 1 JUN.
I think the truth is there will be a number of structural changes to the force - most especially in combat arms - that are rolled out in the next 18 months. There have to be. Treating gender integration as an exercise in tokenism guarantees failure on multiple levels and will result in nothing but embarrassment for combat arms units. I'll be interested to see the leaders that try to express a vision of what they want the force to look like. I don't think it was an accident - at least on the part of Army leaders - to move forward with gender integration. They're going to need to start showing the real plan, and fast, in my view.
As an example, several years ago 4BCT 10th MTN DIV (LI) was in a fight with HRC about 11-series E7s and E8s being assigned to the BDE. About 40% of them had no-running profiles. They were still deployable so HRC considered it not a problem. For the BDE CDR and CSM it was a huge problem. They, justifiably, said they weren't going to put PSGs and 1SGs in line companies who couldn't run with their troopers. It meant the BDE was reporting a major shortage of personnel - but their HR numbers didn't agree.
The shifts in physical standards and profile management should line up with GEN Milley's initiatives on deployability and readiness that go to IOC on 1 JUN.
I think the truth is there will be a number of structural changes to the force - most especially in combat arms - that are rolled out in the next 18 months. There have to be. Treating gender integration as an exercise in tokenism guarantees failure on multiple levels and will result in nothing but embarrassment for combat arms units. I'll be interested to see the leaders that try to express a vision of what they want the force to look like. I don't think it was an accident - at least on the part of Army leaders - to move forward with gender integration. They're going to need to start showing the real plan, and fast, in my view.
Which will occur.
DocIllinois
Verified Military
Mandate birth control for female infantry/ SOF.
Wait, that's too much telling women what to do with their reproductive cycles.
Mandate that males and females in their late teens to mid twenties all simultaneously stop having inter-gender sex.
Wait, that will never ever happen. Ever.
Mandate the creation of an Individual Rotation Policy to fill suddenly vacant unit spots for about a year.
Wait...
Such a pickle!
Wait, that's too much telling women what to do with their reproductive cycles.
Mandate that males and females in their late teens to mid twenties all simultaneously stop having inter-gender sex.
Wait, that will never ever happen. Ever.
Mandate the creation of an Individual Rotation Policy to fill suddenly vacant unit spots for about a year.
Wait...
Such a pickle!
metalmom
Verified Military
If you know me-you would know how much high regard I have for JTF2. Would love to see a female one day within that elite group. Any Canucks feel the same? Know theres not a lot of us here but am wondering how you feel about that?
ThunderHorse
Verified Military
There are plenty of companies that need good 1SGs because certain MOSs can't lead...there were three 35Zs inbound to Bliss at one point, the MICo in 2BCT has not had an E8 First Sergeant in years...and none of those dudes wanted it. Sorry, but what a joke. I don't see any of this happening, the politicians in the Army and DoD will win out.
Well you definitely have to be committed at that point in your career, to take Ft Bliss. Not surprized.
I have no doubts that JTF2 already have women in the unit somewhere filling roles. Some of them are probably operational type roles. Places like 14 Int, SRR, SASRs 4 Squadron, all have operational roles for women, they do job specific selections, which are quite arduous, and they're doing good work.
But seriously, no females are getting into an operational Squadron or Company in 22SAS, JTF2, what ever we're calling CAG and ST6 these days, SASR, etc. The selection, continuation training and job role is just far beyond what even elite female athletes are capable of doing. You'll see females being employed on NFL rosters as offensive linesmen about the same time you'll see them in sabre squadrons.
No, but she will be very popular...
Pressure grows on Marines to consider lowering combat standards for women
Marine Corps weighs lower standards for women after none pass Infantry Officer Course
In order to achieve success they will have to lower standards, the current objectives of the military command and leadership in the White House demand it.
Marine Corps weighs lower standards for women after none pass Infantry Officer Course
In order to achieve success they will have to lower standards, the current objectives of the military command and leadership in the White House demand it.
Florida173
SOF Support
Are there women out there that want this?
Irrelevant. Everyone will pay lip service to "equality" until massive failures occur. Outsiders and pundits will say the military is sexist and denying women a fair chance. Women in uniform and those who completed the training will say "don't weaken the standards" but patronizing politicians, advocates, and Net "experts" will argue that the women don't know what they need.
The next two years will be BS kabuki theater until feminists get their way, trumpeting "equality" when just about everyone in uniform, including women, knows it is wrong but powerless to stop the changes.
The opinions of women in uniform don't matter, not where politicians and advocates are concerned.
I think the women who passed Ranger School proved that women who are properly selected and prepared can meet the current standard's. I will honestly say those two women did change my mind regarding certain individual women being able to meet the same standards. The pregnancy issue means little to me, put a general order against pregnancy during preparation and deployment cycles.
What is more interesting to me is how the two Ranger lady's are doing now, how RS has changed them, what medical conditions have come up. What is even more important is how a women will hold up in a line company and for how long. The constant training and physical grind, how they will handle common injuries and for how long. The final issue will be seeing exactly what they bring to the table, the goods and bads, and what affects that has on combat readiness and unit integrity.
If all the commands involved (recruiting, training, forces) sat down and hammered this out developed a criteria for recruiting preparation and training for both male and female's, it would be a good thing....and I'm not talking about the new gay physical fitness test for recruits. That literally a waste of time.
What is more interesting to me is how the two Ranger lady's are doing now, how RS has changed them, what medical conditions have come up. What is even more important is how a women will hold up in a line company and for how long. The constant training and physical grind, how they will handle common injuries and for how long. The final issue will be seeing exactly what they bring to the table, the goods and bads, and what affects that has on combat readiness and unit integrity.
If all the commands involved (recruiting, training, forces) sat down and hammered this out developed a criteria for recruiting preparation and training for both male and female's, it would be a good thing....and I'm not talking about the new gay physical fitness test for recruits. That literally a waste of time.
Does that no-sex order go for single male soldiers too?
Didn't say no sex, said no pregnancy. And god I hope they don't do it for males, that would totally do away with the war babies...
The same feminists will be silent when we have the next TF Smith too.
What is a 100% method of a woman not getting pregnant?Didn't say no sex, said no pregnancy. And god I hope they don't do it for males, that would totally do away with the war babies...
I would imagine if she was raped on the battlefield no command would punish her for getting pregnant, anything outside that lays squarely on the females shoulders of personal responsibility. How she goes about that would obviously be her decision.
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