Retention and Recruitment Crisis
- Thread starter RackMaster
- Start date
Devildoc
Verified Military
That's one of the big frustrations with 'Fly Navy'. After usually two, maybe three, cruises most of your flying career is over, flying becomes secondary to everything else. Sure, you will have billets in which you may still fly some, but it ain't going to be the junior officer freedom like it was. A lot of aviators get to 12, 14 years and see the department head writing on the wall and bolt.
O-4's not getting a XO slot will probably retire as an O-4.
Miserable staff assignments, or a couple of sea tours before mandatory retirement.
20 years and change, or 21 years with 6-8 months at sea.
Is a 2% bump in pay worth it? Airlines are hiring, private Tac Air companies are hiring.
Add the buffoonery with this administration, and retirement looks good.
Devildoc
Verified Military
There are other routes they can go and get promoted external to command track, but they won't fly much: CAG, joint billet, grad school, Pentagon, some billet at NAVAIR (all are which are as you so eloquently describe "miserable staff assignments"), blah blah blah. But yeah, around O4 the bulk of your flying days are behind you.
I have a friend who was an A-6 B/N, did one float before they started decommissioning A-6s, went to Strike as an instructor, floated around a couple staff assignments, hated it, so cross decked into intelligence and retired as an O5 doing that.
Nothing like being told "the navy needs you!" like being told "the Navy doesn't need you!"
Weird that this is only affecting one base. Looks like everyone else figured it out. Contract it out if you don’t have active duty personnel available. That’s what the Marine Corps does. The chow hall at the infantry regiments is literally staffed by ex cons in a halfway house program because it’s cheap.
TLDR20
Verified SOF
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I almost never saw army cooks while I was in. The Camp Mackall and USASOC chow halls were civilian run. Then when SWCS opened one of their own it was also civilian. If I recall even the 82nd ones were run by civilians.
Good idea, unless it's Ft Knox. DFAC Contractor defaulted, ROTC summer camp got "expired" MRE's.
@Teufel who does food when you're in the field?
Devildoc
Verified Military
I recall many moons ago the chow halls at Geiger and Stone Bay. The contracted staff were sketchy as hell. But they did what they were supposed to do.
The only time I saw uniformed mess cranks were aboard ship. I just can't recall any at any chow halls. Maybe they were and I just don't remember. It has been a minute.
Topkick
Verified Military
In the 80's and 90s, the mess halls were ran by Army cooks (92G) and they were part of the HQ's. I don't recall exactly when that began to change, but during my time as HQ 1SG in the mid 2000's, I didn't have any cooks in my company.
Over the weekend, a young friend of mine was in NYC and hopped on the train to come to my house for a visit. He's an undergrad at one of the most elite civilian colleges in the world, and even at his young age has a profile on the world stage. I did two overseas academic study trips with him, including one to a developing nation where we had a good deal of engagement with US SOF and Embassy personnel operating in the country. He performed extremely well in both instances. He did his homework and was able to talk intelligently about a host of relevant political, military, social, and even SOF concepts and issues as they arose during the trip. He is very smart, physically fit, incredibly humble, and has great charisma. Everyone, including the SOF operators we engaged with, liked him.
He ended up staying Saturday night with us, and we talked a lot about the military and the security services. During the drive to the train station the next day, he asked what branch I thought he would be good in (Intel, of course!) and then he told me he wanted to join the Army.
...and that's where I'm in a bit of a dilemma. This guy is clearly the type of person we want as an Army officer. He's the type of officer the Army needs. But I'm torn.
One the one hand, how can I tell a young man who has enormous future potential that he should join an Army that I know is completely FUBAR at the moment... one that I myself more or less rage-quit after how Afghanistan ended and the way wokeness crept into everything? Especially when it seems more and more likely that we will soon have to fight someone who has more capabilities than EFPs, RPGs, and AKs.
And on the other hand, how can I discourage someone from doing something noble and good, and steer them away from military service, something that I consider the most important and fulfilling thing I've done in my entire life short of being a parent?
The intel services are an option, but they seem to have been completely captured by the far-left. But at least the survivability will probably be better.
I'll have to give this some thought.
He ended up staying Saturday night with us, and we talked a lot about the military and the security services. During the drive to the train station the next day, he asked what branch I thought he would be good in (Intel, of course!) and then he told me he wanted to join the Army.
...and that's where I'm in a bit of a dilemma. This guy is clearly the type of person we want as an Army officer. He's the type of officer the Army needs. But I'm torn.
One the one hand, how can I tell a young man who has enormous future potential that he should join an Army that I know is completely FUBAR at the moment... one that I myself more or less rage-quit after how Afghanistan ended and the way wokeness crept into everything? Especially when it seems more and more likely that we will soon have to fight someone who has more capabilities than EFPs, RPGs, and AKs.
And on the other hand, how can I discourage someone from doing something noble and good, and steer them away from military service, something that I consider the most important and fulfilling thing I've done in my entire life short of being a parent?
The intel services are an option, but they seem to have been completely captured by the far-left. But at least the survivability will probably be better.
I'll have to give this some thought.
MR. E mostly. Sometimes Dominos if you’re at Camp Pendleton, they will literally deliver to every range. You didn’t hear that from me though. We do have a food specialist MOS that can set up a field mess though.
USAF is a great option. Their service members are almost universally impressive and they seem to offer their people a lot of opportunities with minimal bull shit. I personally think the Marine Corps has stayed true to itself more than most, but I acknowledge we aren’t a good fit for everyone.
After what he saw on the two trips we did together, I think it would have to be the Army or the Marines for him.
Box
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Beyond the possibility of being key-holed into the Armed Forces, it sounds like this fellow has the potential to excel at whatever task he shoulders. There is a broad range of private sector things a guy like him could do where he would have a freedom of movement that the military will never offer. Maybe tedning the system OUT of uniform would put this guy in a position 20 years down the road where he could impact change.
Just look at how many of the professional staffers in DC are running around in their 30's impacting what flag officers are doing simply because they are able to put a bug in the ear of a senator that desperately needs to be told "Just say aye"
For God sakes - we are living in a time when a guy in an Easter Bunny suit is helping the POTUS find his mark at public events!
Maybe his best play is on the outside looking in - who knows.
I've come to realize over the years that young people really need a mission; a "good crusade." Being in the military is probably the best one. One of the reasons our country is in the condition it is right now is because so many people have so little to worry about, that they start casting about looking for something to be outraged about, to fight against. All the old enemies are gone, or at least out of mind. So they create new ones. Easy ones. Ones close to home.
Military creds are also still in high demand for people who want to go into law or seek political office. I don't expect that my friend would do a career. Couple of years and on to the next stage of life. And I'm totally fine with that.
Well, you know what my vote would be. Nothing against the Army but it’s a big organization and experiences really vary depending on where you are and what you do. It would be amazing to work in the JSOC JIB but then again you could also be doing the IPB on why Fort Hood can’t feed its own people.After what he saw on the two trips we did together, I think it would have to be the Army or the Marines for him.
I echo Mara on this. The military, regardless of branch, offers a young person the opportunity to immerse themselves into a service culture that will provide them with a lifelong sense of belonging, leadership development, and personal development. It sounds trite, but I really believe it to be life changing. You can get some of that in the IC but its not quite the same. Going from the military to the IC is the best of both worlds. It could also increase your hiring potential, especially if you land there in uniform first.
Topkick
Verified Military
I'm a proud lifer and I still love my Army. I will forever be grateful for what a career in the Army did for me. Even today, especially today, I wouldn't attempt to steer a quality individual away from the military. We need them. (My son is about to be an Army officer)
OTH, I would certainly do what I could to help them make an informed decision.
OTH, I would certainly do what I could to help them make an informed decision.
