The Trump Presidency 2.0

[AWP]

A third party would be a good disruptive force though. We (myself included) look at Perot's example, but it kind of lacked a plan and I question if the time was right for anything you could sustain...if you can sustain anything like that at all.

Today though party polarization makes a third party increasingly likely. It could only have staying power if the other two remained ideologically removed from centrist voters. I'd hazard a guess that a third party would be 60/40 or 70/30 Democrats over Republicans given how far and how fast the Blue side has moved.

Regardless, a third party would push one or both of the others to abandon some policies which would cause voters to return to one of the original two.
I'd love to see a third party if only to jolt to other two into something other than the status quo.

 

[Box]

somethings just suck
politics is one of those things that sucks
...and aMEricans simply don't understand the concept of NOT letting perfect get in the way of good enough

The radical Left sucks
The radical right sucks
The uniparty sucks.

unfortunately most things come down to a "what side of the fence are you on" type of situation and like that old asian guy once said, "man who straddle fence gets splinters in crotch"

third party political organizations have always been a group of people that want to ride the fence on all of the importanat issues
-i want "my" guns but we need "common sense gun laws"
-abortion is tricky
-i want to cut YOUR government spending but not MY government spending
-taxes are bad but the state needs to come fix this pothole
-welfare is stoopid, they should get jobs
-veterans should learn how to code
-military retirees and DoD civilians should get GIANT pay raises
-i'm a right wing conservative AND a pot head
-i'm a left wing liberal with an MSNBC talk show but I like shooting my AR15


rinse and repeat

 

[Devildoc]

To the victor goes the spoils. There won't be serious 3rd parties until the uniparty gives up some control of the primary process.

 

[Box]

I'm not buying into the fantasy. Politics is a full contact sport played while wearing a suit.

A "viable" third party would be like having a third dugout on the diamond - or adding a third net to any sport that uses nets.

The only sport where three teams would work is rugby.
...because what the fuck is even the purpose of rugby?

Trump in 2028
JD Vance in 2032-2036-2040

 

[Cookie_]

Or, I think it's rare but has happened, one new party wipes out an existing older party and most of the old party's new adherents go to the new one. IMO that's more of a re-brand than a whole new party.

100%.

Federalists were the first conservative (here meaning traditionalist) party, who basically disappeared after the war of 1812. The Democratic-Republicans (Jeffersonian Republicans) split during the 1824 election; party loyalists made the Democratic Party, and those who weren't went to make the National Republican Party. The NRP only existed for ~8 years before it combined with former Federalists and unhappy democrats to make the Whig party, which then became the GOP.

Given the policies, I think an arguement could be made that the Whigs might be the only true "new" party in our history to ever gain any power. The Republican party basically started as "Whigs who openly opposed the expansion of slavery", so that seems to be more rebrand than new concept.

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To the broader topic of Elon and third parties; I think Elon could make a viable third party, if it focuses energy on Congressional seats as opposed to the Presidency. We've seen how "libertarian"/independent Senators/Reps can have outsized impact in legislation, simply because margins are so thin. If Elon managed to get 2 or 3 Senators elected they could have a huge impact.

 

[amlove21]

snip

To the broader topic of Elon and third parties; I think Elon could make a viable third party, if it focuses energy on Congressional seats as opposed to the Presidency. We've seen how "libertarian"/independent Senators/Reps can have outsized impact in legislation, simply because margins are so thin. If Elon managed to get 2 or 3 Senators elected they could have a huge impact.

This is the move. You don't need a huge party- you need disruption. And that gains steam.

I think people are assuming this has to be an immediate mega-party completely established as a 3rd party- that's not true at all. You need 2 Thomas Massie's and 2 Rand Paul's and 3-4 others and you have influence.

 

[Devildoc]

This is the move. You don't need a huge party- you need disruption. And that gains steam.

I think people are assuming this has to be an immediate mega-party completely established as a 3rd party- that's not true at all. You need 2 Thomas Massie's and 2 Rand Paul's and 3-4 others and you have influence.

But that's also not new, that goes back to the days of John Adams.

 

[amlove21]

Annnnnnd here we are. One caveat here, we are assuming the leak from the FBI/DOJ is an actual leak and not fake.

Pam Bondi- We have the files. They're disgusting. We are releasing them, or parts of them.
Lara Loomer- We have flight logs, client lists, the whole deal.
Influencers- WE HAVE THE BINDERS
Pam Bondi- We don't have the files
Influencers- The binders are empty but it's phase 1
Pam Bondi- They deleted some of the files!
Kash Patel/Dan Bongino- Epstein didn't kill himself
Pam Bondi- The files didn't exist, Ghislaine Maxwell and Jeff Epstein were both found guilty of trafficking to clients, but the clients don't exist, and neither do the crimes, and all of that wasn't true.

I hate this timeline.

 

[amlove21]

But that's also not new, that goes back to the days of John Adams.

I don't think anyone is saying it's new; I know I am saying "it's needed" and "it's possible".

 

[Marauder06]

IMO the Republican party doesn't need "disruption" when it has Trump. It needs unity. And a Musk-led third party is going to draw far more from Rs than from Ds, which reduces the power of the Rs and gives the Ds more opportunity to seize political power again, and we saw how good that was for all of us the last time that it happened.

 

[amlove21]

Self proclaimed centrists don't vote Democrat.

I truly wish I lived in a world which is as black and white as the one you live in.

Ok, what percentage of your last ballot was Republican?

I disagree with @ThunderHorse on this one, the same as you do, but the question of "how does a democrat centrist vote" is prescient. Democrats (historically, anecdotally, by the numbers, whatever) don't stray from party lines often, even those that consider themselves "centrist".

In my personal experience, people who say they're "centrist" on either side of the aisle still vote down-ballot for their party.

 

[amlove21]

IMO the Republican party doesn't need "disruption" when it has Trump. It needs unity. And a Musk-led third party is going to draw far more from Rs than from Ds, which reduces the power of the Rs and gives the Ds more opportunity to seize political power again, and we saw how good that was for all of us the last time that it happened.

Definitely an issue- but Trump IS MAGA. It's his brand. When 2028 comes to a close, Trump moves on and even if he wanted to stay in the political game from behind the scenes a la Obama- he's old.

 

[amlove21]

Pro-2A, pro-Crypto, pro-free speech, anti-spending, pro-innovation, pro-military, pro-centrism.

Elon Musk indicates his new political party will be pro-gun, pro-bitcoin: 'The Second Amendment is sacred'

 

[TLDR20]

Ok, what percentage of your last ballot was Republican?

I disagree with @ThunderHorse on this one, the same as you do, but the question of "how does a democrat centrist vote" is prescient. Democrats (historically, anecdotally, by the numbers, whatever) don't stray from party lines often, even those that consider themselves "centrist".

In my personal experience, people who say they're "centrist" on either side of the aisle still vote down-ballot for their party.

I voted Republican for the commissioner of Agriculture Steve Troxler. The choices in NC were not great, I do love our extremely centrist AG, Jeff Jackson, who is a Democrat, he is the only politician I’ve ever given money to. Mark Robinson was not a real choice for governor. I also vote republican in local elections because my city is a wannabe Portland, and I’ve seen where that leads.

 

[amlove21]

I voted Republican for the commissioner of Agriculture Steve Troxler. The choices in NC were not great, I do love our extremely centrist AG, Jeff Jackson, who is a Democrat, he is the only politician I’ve ever given money to. Mark Robinson was not a real choice for governor. I also vote republican in local elections because my city is a wannabe Portland, and I’ve seen where that leads.

Hold on... are you saying you DO care what they do in other states because it could impact you locally?!

 

[TLDR20]

Ok, what percentage of your last ballot was Republican?

I disagree with @ThunderHorse on this one, the same as you do, but the question of "how does a democrat centrist vote" is prescient. Democrats (historically, anecdotally, by the numbers, whatever) don't stray from party lines often, even those that consider themselves "centrist".

In my personal experience, people who say they're "centrist" on either side of the aisle still vote down-ballot for their party.

I will also say, I would happily vote for a Republican candidate that is not President Trump.

 

[amlove21]

I will also say, I would happily vote for a Republican candidate that is not President Trump.

Well, you'll have your shot in '28. Although it's going to be tough- well-known Democratic Centrists Newsom, AOC, and Pete Buttigeg will make that a super tough choice.

 

[AWP]

Annnnnnd here we are. One caveat here, we are assuming the leak from the FBI/DOJ is an actual leak and not fake.

Pam Bondi- We have the files. They're disgusting. We are releasing them, or parts of them.
Lara Loomer- We have flight logs, client lists, the whole deal.
Influencers- WE HAVE THE BINDERS
Pam Bondi- We don't have the files
Influencers- The binders are empty but it's phase 1
Pam Bondi- They deleted some of the files!
Kash Patel/Dan Bongino- Epstein didn't kill himself
Pam Bondi- The files didn't exist, Ghislaine Maxwell and Jeff Epstein were both found guilty of trafficking to clients, but the clients don't exist, and neither do the crimes, and all of that wasn't true.

I hate this timeline.

Quoting my own post because of the links and...I kinda' called this one.

What's great is Patel and Bondi just lost a ton of credibility with this complete reversal. They are lying their asses off about the recent Epstein reversal and I'd like to think people will hold their feet to the fire, but I know better.

If they are willing to lie about something so painfully obvious to the world, what else are they lying to us about?

Post in thread 'The Trump Presidency 2.0'

Feb 25, 2025

While everyone is focused on the FBI/DOJ release of the Epstein list/Diddy lists, I have some very real expectations for Kash and Danny B at the FBI. In order of my personal preference:

<snip>

The Epstein/Diddy lists may be mind-blowing to a small swath of the American public writ large, and I agree that they should be released immediately in full; the impacts on trust in our institutions from the above-mentioned cases are, in my opinion, far more prescient/important, even given the gravity of the Epstein scandal and it's second/third order effects.

I largely agree with...

• AWP

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[TLDR20]

Hold on... are you saying you DO care what they do in other states because it could impact you locally?!

I don’t care what they do, I do care what they do in my neighborhood.

 

[Cookie_]

In my personal experience, people who say they're "centrist" on either side of the aisle still vote down-ballot for their party.

I think this is a big symptom of the 2 party system. Most often people mean centrist as "I support xy issue from party A and z issue from party B".

If the math always works out where the score (weighted or total) works more towards one party, it makes sense that votes would be down party lines if the voter isn't.

Just another reason why a viable third (or more) option would be worthwhile.

Pro-2A, pro-Crypto, pro-free speech, anti-spending, pro-innovation, pro-military, pro-centrism.

Elon Musk indicates his new political party will be pro-gun, pro-bitcoin: 'The Second Amendment is sacred'

So techno-futurism Republican? He'll need to expand on what "pro-centrism" is if plans to do more than just pull some non-Evangelical GOP voters and tech bros.

ETA: Musk is making the good move.

Musk noted in another post, "Backing a candidate for president is not out of the question, but the focus for the next 12 months is on the House and the Senate."