The Trump Presidency 2.0
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ThunderHorse
Verified Military
Who's cheering for a Western march on Moscow? I want Pre-2014 borders that we signed up for when Bush brokered the treaty for them to give up their nukes. You said they would have sold them, yeah just like Russia would have during that period when they were also selling everything.
You think Zelensky is running out of bodies? Is Ukraine really? No, they're not. They're in a war of survival, but they've done enough to where they are not at the point where they need full mobilization. Not that Ukraine is even supplied at the level that would allow them to go full mobilization.
Russia is definitely running out of bodies, that's why North Korea has sent troops to support this because they're a trash economy reliant on Russian oil to keep the lights on, so their only currency is Army conscripts. Yet you have their faces being mutilated by their Komrades so that they don't appear as North Koreans when the UKA Soldiers come upon the bodies.
In regards to the idiot comments about Conscription from Vance, uh in every war of "survival" we have fought in we have had conscription via draft lottery.
This war ends overnight if Europe turns off Russian LNG. But hey soft men create hard times.
Is Trump America First? I have no idea. But having one of our major enemies bogged down for years spending their blood and treasure in a Ukrainian marsh sounds like an easy trade for some missiles and tanks. We did it in Afghanistan, why not here? We did it to the point in Afghanistan where they withdrew.
Is it possible that this was all theater?
So many cameras and a cast of hundreds. I dunno just a thought.
Part of me thinks so. Zelensky was once an actor and Trump a reality TV star who loves the limelight and ego stroke.
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When you consider that Pam Bondi could have just texted Kash and not formalized a letter for the world to see, it's not a leap to posit that she wanted to let the world know this fact. One step further you get to the pretty logical narrative- that SDNY and New York generally have gone rogue, to the extent they'll try and prosecute a President and defy the constitution because of their ideological capture and institutional rot in those offices.
IO campaigns require maximum eyes for effect. A "leaked" letter alleging sedition in the largest news story in recent memory fits that narrative. Now, the American people know- something is rotten in Denmark, except it's not Denmark, it's the New York FBI and the legislature.
That's quite the claim! Present your supporting evidence that leads you to believe this.
...unless, of course, you just don't like the guy and what you just put on this open board for everyone to see was wild conjecture rooted in some deeply held personal biases.
But I am SURE that can't be it.
Now this makes sense, especially since the usual suspects are breaking out the Russia collusion talking points again.
Huge piece of context people are missing.
With peace a breath away, all Zelensky had to do for his countrymen (these people I was told I should REVERE for their nationalism and willingness to fight for their homeland) the people he was elected to protect- was sign the deal and have a presser. He didn't do it, then went into the Oval Office in a track suit and behaved like a child and was summarily spanked for it.
Trump paved the way to an end to Ukranian bloodshed by bringing the other party to the table, set the conditions for Zelensky to be the hero, and then Zelensky took a shit on all of that. And now the MSM has resorted to playbook item #1- Orange Man Bad.
And you wonder why American trust in our institutions is bottomed out. Spare me the drama.
If Alex Vindman endorsed air I would cut gills into my neck and jump in the ocean.
Jaknight
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Oh, I have no hard evidence for this—it's just my opinion. I’m a man who voted for Trump because I felt the Democrats were catering too much to their extreme, anti-American wing. But now, I find myself asking, why is Trump parroting Russian talking points, blaming Ukraine for the war while never once directly saying, "Hey Russia, you’re to blame too"? Is he playing some kind of fancy 5D chess move, appealing to Putin? I mean, I thought Trump was supposed to be tough, yet he’s only shown real toughness when dealing with Zelensky. Now, I get the argument—"If you're mean to him, he won’t sign a deal, so let’s be nice." But what deal are we even talking about? Trump has shown his cards—he wants out of Ukraine. So what’s the internal deal being set up here? Zelensky asked for security guarantees, and Trump’s camp ignored him—even the reporter pressing the question was brushed off. Why? I think it’s because they have no intention of securing anything, except whatever money they can grab. Zelensky did mess up—he should have known that Trump loves to have his ego stroked. Yesterday was supposed to be the moment where Trump signs a deal, his guys get a cut, his friends and business partners get a little piece of the action. Sure, Ukraine loses a lot of territory, Russia probably rebuilds its army and finishes Ukraine off for good later, but hey, Trump gets to say he made a deal and made some money along the way. No sweat off his back. Putin, meanwhile, knows exactly how to play Trump now. Trump isn’t a wild card anymore—he’s been in politics for nearly a decade. Putin is no idiot; he likely lavished Trump with praise, trashed Biden, stroked his ego, saying he was the only one they wanted to do business with in terms of a peace deal. Maybe they even offered him a little something for his troubles. Does Europe need to step up? Absolutely. It’s their backyard that’s in trouble. They need to send more money, more support. Can Ukraine win the war? Not militarily. But they can win politically. If Ukraine is hurting for bodies, so is Russia. I know Russia doesn’t care about casualties—they're used to throwing people into the grinder in wars. But what about their army’s long-term sustainability? Trump could have told Putin, "We want peace, but this can't keep happening every five years—you can't just take another piece of Ukraine and expect no consequences." He could have made it clear, "We can fund Ukraine all day until Russia’s army is completely drained—even if they manage to take the country, they'll just be dealing with an insurgency that makes things worse." But instead, it seems like he’s playing into Putin’s hands. Of course, this is just my opinion—I could be totally wrong, or I could be right. But I feel like yesterday was a significant moment for us and the world. Maybe it leads to something good, or maybe we’ll look back and say, "Man, we really screwed up there."
ThunderHorse
Verified Military
Russian Talking Points -
There's dozens more in this thread calling Zelensky a dictator and no balance from the posters. Who's a dictator? Putin is. Who has committed Genocide? Putin has. But hey, a little bit of corruption and we're automatically turning on an ally and going whole hog in support of the enemy?
Are we for real? Where's @Polar Bear when we need him to lay down the sense.
Russia began all this with the taking of Abkhazia and South Ossetia using what were effectively Hitler's talking points around occupying parts of Czechoslovakia "protection of ethnic Germans". Which is how the Donbas bullshit and take over of Crimea began. Russia had no right to Crimea, Ukraine got saddled with those bases after we forced them to give up their Nukes.
________
So I ask you, who invaded who? Who raped and murdered women and Children like Hamas did? Who removed Ukrainian children from their families and put them up for adoption in Russia?
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Got it. Orange man bad, you want the war to keep going. Could have saved 500 words or so.
Everything I needed to know was complete after word 8.
Easy- Russia did and I’ve never even intimated anything else, you’re just obviously super emotional and grasping for straws. My ideological consistency here you may disagree with but in no way have I ever been anything close to your allegation.
-2 points, you’re at -3. At -5 you get a desagulation.
I 100% stand by the maidan revolution post, and how you can classify a verified fact as a Russian talking point to weild is just a bad faith ad-hom, which I won’t do in return.
You’ve created a false binary where everything you don’t agree with- not fact patterns- on the issue makes it ‘pro Russian’. And don’t use dead kids and raped women an appeal to emotion, it’s a disgusting way to make a point. -4.
Topkick
Verified Military
Lol. Not one of those quotes you included are actually "pro- Russian." They just don't fit your agenda. You want the war to continue, I don't.
ThunderHorse
Verified Military
I will await the court case or admission by the US Government that the Maidan was orchestrated by the US, and even if it was, then now you're retreating?
Ukraine when Yanukovych was elected was on its way into the EU, he being a Russian puppet stopped their westernization and then used the police to beat the shit out of his people. I get that Europeans tend to actually riot and force their elected representatives to do their job a lot more than we do except if you're a Democrat (BLM Riots).
But there's plenty of writing and documentaries on how that happened, @Polar Bear even suggested one: Winter on Fire.
My positions are consistent I want what is in the best Grand Strategic interests of the US. In some cases that involves bleeding our enemies. In some cases that involves us not getting in the way of people killing our enemies. I also know that we can't export our kind of Freedom anywhere unless we're willing to occupy a country and remove the social structure that existed for a minimum of 50 years.
Our President all of a sudden sucking off Putin's [eggplant] ain't it hoss. And that's what's happening. If we want the war to end there are many many other ways.
Box
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BAHAHA typing it out made me laugh. How can you not love this timeline?!
...and I'm here for it
what's up with people on this site making me look up words? ;)
ThunderHorse
Verified Military
So now that I'm done with this whole thing and the odd parroting of Russian talking points and people saying they aren't Russian talking points but not able to admit that Russia is the problem and not Ukrainians fighting a war of survival (Putin says Ukraine is not a country). We get back to this interesting piece of theatre where previously Zelensky thanked us at least 33 times. But we're all focused on the 5 minutes after JD Vance acts like a complete shitbird always getting in trouble Army SPEC-4 instead of the Marine Corporal that he is. Or is it that JD wanted to press some of Trump's buttons idk. Anyways, JD is a lot smarter than this and he should go haze himself for a week.I finally watched the entire press conference. It started with a very different tone. It's interesting and weird how quickly it turned.
As the post below indicates, this really occured once JD Vance stepped into it.
The day before the release, AG Bondi was on Glenn Beck’s show claiming that the American public would be “sickened” by what was in the files. They make this big show of handing out these files, which were just part 1 of many(!) to esteemed journalists like LibsofTiktok.
Then all of a sudden she’s claiming that the don’t have everything and an FBI field office is withholding docs?
If her IO plan was to make the AG’s office look incompetent, then job well done.
So what’s the position here?
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