The Trump Presidency 2.0

[Dame]

Heh... I'm too busy getting my hedge fund set up to worry about the market. BTW, you do know you can make money on a market decline too, right?

Honestly, I'm just holding position until the volatility settles down. Retail traders are getting crushed trying to trade this market.

Oh yeah. Already looking to buy back some shares I sold which are now about 15% lower. Options could work but tough to predict the very short term stuff.

 

[BlackSmokeRisinG]

And there's the rub of this whole thing. Spinning up manufacturing takes a decent chunk of time.
Does it make sense to uproot your overseas production if it will wind up costing more in the long term?



I think it's a bit ironic talking about oligarchs when the world's richest man is working with our first billionaire President. Elon's the literal definition of an oligarch.
They aren't making decisions that hurt their pocketbooks. This shit doesn't hurt the oligarchs, it hurts the "rich" on the lower end of the spectrum and the middle/lower classes (at best in the short term) through higher consumption prices.

Dave said it perfectly years ago:

Bringing back some manufacturing so there's more job opportunities for the average American helps "the poors" a lot more than increased welfare and decades more deficit spending.

I don't care how it happens as long as it happens. And I know the Democrat playbook is class warfare, and welfare promises.

 

[ThunderHorse]

Whole post

 

[Cookie_]

Bringing back some manufacturing so there's more job opportunities for the average American helps "the poors" a lot more than increased welfare and decades more deficit spending.

I don't care how it happens as long as it happens. And I know the Democrat playbook is class warfare, and welfare promises.

I think you may have conflated my two responses.

I'm less optimistic that manufacturing will return, not that I'm opposed to it. I think COVID demonstrated pretty well that we need to have a medical manufacturing base in this country, and we can also manufacturing bases for things like semiconductors and similar highly sought after tech products as a national defense/security issue.

I just don't think tarrifs will every be high enough that we'll see large segments of material/consumer goods manufacturers return. Even if they did, how many of those roles would be automated/conducted by AI?

My comment about what impacts people lower on the economic ladder was in regards to increases in costs due to tarrifs. Poorer people on average spend a higher percentage of their paychecks on necessities, which means they feel the hit of increased prices harder.

Same as with the stuff DOGE is doing, i don't disagree with the end goal; I just have differences with the methodology.

 

[Ooh-Rah]

Whole post

Dude,

Based on what you’ve shared about yourself on this forum over the years, it’d take roughly 1.3 seconds on Google to figure out who you work for and where to forward screenshots. I’m not in the business of ruining weekends—but someone else might be.

People have lost jobs for posts and tweets with less detail than what you packed into that post. Throw in your commentary, and you basically handed HR a case file with a bow on it. One of your fellow members reported it—not for any reason other than to protect you from yourself.

If you want the post undeleted, just say the word. I’ll pretend we never had this conversation.

 

[Florida173]

I've seen people have issues with the POTUS posting the strike video in Yemen. I'm not sure I see the issue

 

[GOTWA]

I'm a little over half way through the Tucker interview with Bessent. I like him. He's very measured and seems very sincere. If people slow down and listen to him pitch this, it should put a lot of people at ease.

 

[Devildoc]

"Market crash." Please. The "market" is actually at the same place it was in 2023. It is a knee-jerk reaction, not a canary in the coal mine. It may in fact crash but we need some time and data to see what happens.

@Ooh-Rah re: 'loyalty tests', I don't dig them either. But I see where Trump feels backed against the wall when you have the top two people at NSA saying they will purposely withhold info from the PDB and engage in back-door tactics to stymie his agenda.

 

[BlackSmokeRisinG]

I think you may have conflated my two responses.

I'm less optimistic that manufacturing will return, not that I'm opposed to it. I think COVID demonstrated pretty well that we need to have a medical manufacturing base in this country, and we can also manufacturing bases for things like semiconductors and similar highly sought after tech products as a national defense/security issue.

I just don't think tarrifs will every be high enough that we'll see large segments of material/consumer goods manufacturers return. Even if they did, how many of those roles would be automated/conducted by AI?

My comment about what impacts people lower on the economic ladder was in regards to increases in costs due to tarrifs. Poorer people on average spend a higher percentage of their paychecks on necessities, which means they feel the hit of increased prices harder.

Same as with the stuff DOGE is doing, i don't disagree with the end goal; I just have differences with the methodology.

My main thing is the future, and getting off the path the country is on. We are half sunk as it is. We still have an overall quality of life thats better than most everywhere, but how will that last without a solid pathway to being middle class?

Nobody has any ideas. I haven't heard one legit pathway back to middle class stability out of anybody. Harris wanted to just give out "business loans"...like suddenly those small businesses scraping by will be Shark Tank contenders on the gov't dime...

As for DOGE, holly shit...how much fraud and waste is being uncovered? Its insane. I don't think shrinking the overall gov't by half is the answer...but not giving $40B to "consultants" to hook up 0 people to the internet is a real good start.

It has to start somewhere.

 

[amlove21]

And there's the rub of this whole thing. Spinning up manufacturing takes a decent chunk of time.
Does it make sense to uproot your overseas production if it will wind up costing more in the long term?



I think it's a bit ironic talking about oligarchs when the world's richest man is working with our first billionaire President. Elon's the literal definition of an oligarch.
They aren't making decisions that hurt their pocketbooks. This shit doesn't hurt the oligarchs, it hurts the "rich" on the lower end of the spectrum and the middle/lower classes (at best in the short term) through higher consumption prices.

Dave said it perfectly years ago:

This is a great point if you completely ignore the facts of the matter.

Democrats have many more billionaires that actively support their power and hold outsize influence on elections and appointments.

Which judges did Elon find and place in positions of power again? Which riots (happening now nationwide) did Elon fund? Cause I have about a bazillion examples of Soros funded DAs and a long history of busing in “protestors”.

Calling the richest guy in the world, working for free, after leaving the democratic party and being threatened with his life and the life of his family an oligarch is rich.

 

[Cookie_]

This is a great point if you completely ignore the facts of the matter.

Democrats have many more billionaires that actively support their power and hold outsize influence on elections and appointments.

Which judges did Elon find and place in positions of power again? Which riots (happening now nationwide) did Elon fund? Cause I have about a bazillion examples of Soros funded DAs and a long history of busing in “protestors”.

Calling the richest guy in the world, working for free, after leaving the democratic party and being threatened with his life and the life of his family an oligarch is rich.

Elon is an oligarch; him working for free means nothing when the Definition of the word is:

1. someone who is extremely rich and powerful, especially a person from Russia who became rich after the end of the former Soviet Union:

2. one of the people in an oligarchy (= a government or society controlled by a small group of very powerful people).

3. one of a small group of powerful people who control a country or an industry:

He fits those pretty well.

I'd take your Soros and raise you a Harlan Crow, Tim Dunn, or Koch Brothers, but maybe we can agree that having the ultra-wealthy putting their thumbs on the political scales is ultimately not a good thing regardless of political leaning?

I might agree with some of the positions of Soros/Cuban, but i don't agree with how they throw money around just like I disagree with Elon giving away money to sign pledges/vote in a certain way, or the koch brothers doing what Soros is often accused/guilty of, et cetera et certa.

 

[GOTWA]

@Cookie_ to your earlier point of costs to build and run up production stateside; it's a gamble either way. Pay now or pay later, only the sums of those payments will change. If war breaks out with China, trade will absolutely stop. What happens then? If everything comes from China, we're fucked. You think China is going to let goods leave their borders? You think businesses will be able to collect their things and move out? Businesses will find their entire operation seized. The tariffs should also be used to identify what companies/goods don't leave China so we can prepare accordingly.

 

[Cookie_]

@Cookie_ to your earlier point of costs to build and run up production stateside; it's a gamble either way. Pay now or pay later, only the sums of those payments will change. If war breaks out with China, trade will absolutely stop. What happens then? If everything comes from China, we're fucked. You think China is going to let goods leave their borders? You think businesses will be able to collect their things and move out? Businesses will find their entire operation seized. The tariffs should also be used to identify what companies/goods don't leave China so we can prepare accordingly.

All excellent points. I agree with your assessments of how a change in the relationship with China could affect business, but I'm also not the head of any of these organizations.

We're in a situation in which businesses may be aware of that risk but decide it's a low enough threat that the economic gains of doing business in China outweight the scenario you describe.

Until China seems more volatile, that cost/risk analysis might not change. It'll be too late by then.

 

[GOTWA]

Until China seems more volatile, that cost/risk analysis might not change. It'll be too late by then.

The writing is on the wall. If they choose short term profits over long term sustainability/survivability, then they don't deserve our support.

Taiwan reveals timeline for potential full-scale China invasion

 

[ThunderHorse]

Elon is an oligarch; him working for free means nothing when the Definition of the word is:





He fits those pretty well.

I'd take your Soros and raise you a Harlan Crow, Tim Dunn, or Koch Brothers, but maybe we can agree that having the ultra-wealthy putting their thumbs on the political scales is ultimately not a good thing regardless of political leaning?

I might agree with some of the positions of Soros/Cuban, but i don't agree with how they throw money around just like I disagree with Elon giving away money to sign pledges/vote in a certain way, or the koch brothers doing what Soros is often accused/guilty of, et cetera et certa.

Bezos until Trump thumped Kamala had a whole apparatus called the WaPo going after Trump. Bill Gates? Zuck?

 

[Cookie_]

Bezos until Trump thumped Kamala had a whole apparatus called the WaPo going after Trump. Bill Gates? Zuck?

I was being a bit cheeky about how we can play the back and forth all day. The bolded section should have made that clear.

I'd take your Soros and raise you a Harlan Crow, Tim Dunn, or Koch Brothers, but maybe we can agree that having the ultra-wealthy putting their thumbs on the political scales is ultimately not a good thing regardless of political leaning?

I may or may not agree with a billionaire on a certain issue; that doesn't mean that I think they should get a pass on having an outsized influence on political machinations.

I don't like ANY billionaires doing the shit we see our tech oligarchs+others doing.

 

[Topkick]

don't like ANY billionaires doing the shit we see our tech oligarchs+others doing.

I'm not going to say Elon doesn't have good intentions, but I don't believe for a minute that he or any other billionaire is doing anything for "free."

 

[AWP]

I'm not sold on the economic gains, nor am I dismissing their potential, but the tariffs are a brilliant political move both home and abroad.

I'm not going to say Elon doesn't have good intentions, but I don't believe for a minute that he or any other billionaire is doing anything for "free."

I think they are as good as a teenager asking a girl to the prom. I don't see where they are going. Contracts, tax breaks, something, but someone's expected to put out.

 

[Marauder06]

I'm not going to say Elon doesn't have good intentions, but I don't believe for a minute that he or any other billionaire is doing anything for "free."

As I tell my cadets, "self-interest is a legitimate motivator."

It seems that Musk felt that the left made it personal. I think he blames the left for trans-ing his son. He runs companies that were affected by ESG and DEI nonsense. He noticed--as we all did, even the people who said it wasn't happening--the actions of the Deep State, the suppression of Republicans and conservatives and anyone not toeing the leftist line on social media. Once he started asking questions the left found uncomfortable, they attacked him. He was violently shoved to the right. And then he realized "hey, I'm rich as shit, I don't have to take this anymore."

 

[amlove21]

Elon is an oligarch; him working for free means nothing when the Definition of the word is:





He fits those pretty well.

I'd take your Soros and raise you a Harlan Crow, Tim Dunn, or Koch Brothers, but maybe we can agree that having the ultra-wealthy putting their thumbs on the political scales is ultimately not a good thing regardless of political leaning?

I might agree with some of the positions of Soros/Cuban, but i don't agree with how they throw money around just like I disagree with Elon giving away money to sign pledges/vote in a certain way, or the koch brothers doing what Soros is often accused/guilty of, et cetera et certa.

Meh. Ideological capture is a real thing. The volume and outputs are where this entire argument falls flat- definitions mean zero at this point- it's low hanging fruit in conversations that people weild ham-handedly as a whattaboutism. Until we can collectively agree on things like "what a woman is" and "what constitutes domestic terrorism", you'll have to forgive my adherence to the left's precedence of ignoring actual meanings in favor of semantic overload. 83 billionaires supported Kamala's run, 56 supported Trump and the dollar amount isn't close.

Elon wants to mobilize a vote, George Soros (and now Alex Soros) intends to install DA's in Cali that allow rampant shoplifting as long as it's below $900 and the forwarding of Marxist ideologies nationwide. I'll accept the defintional meeting for argument's sake, but the output is the issue, not the definition of a generalization of all rich people that engage in politics.