This man does NOT like Jocko...

[TLDR20]

When did USASOC use Tim Kennedy for recruiting? I’ve never seen any ads or pictures of him for recruitment.

 

[Cookie_]

I read it, at this point I don't care. If he is being held accountable today for misstatements that he made. Where he the accountability for the Army and USASOC that used him for the dog and pony show for recruiting? They were a part of this. So all of a sudden USASOC be mad, but guess what, there are plenty of other SF influencers that go around doing nonsense.

I think you're 100% correct on this. Hell, he was just taking photos with the SMA a few weeks ago.

However, it gets back to @Box talking about standards. Big Boy Rules is what SOF gets to play by (which as @amlove21 says, is just poor leadership), they get to walk around out of regs, for no reason at all. But hey, we skewer regular SPC4s for random nonsense that is just a normal hour in SF.

I've been done with the separate standards for SOF units for a long time. You shouldn't get more leeway, you should get less. They talk about being a higher standard yada yada...but seeing what happens when you have a tab or were in regiment vs what happens when Soldiers aren't is pretty annoying.

My experience, so not indicative of SOF as a whole:

Most every SOF guy I've ever met has been a stud about maintaining professional awareness. The was an explicit understanding and awareness of what "big boy rules" and "leeway" meant in various contexts.
There might be those occasional turds who try to walk around Carson wearing hiking boots or don't have a shave/haircut when needed, but those dude would get corrected very quickly by SENIOR NCOs and made an example of.

ETA: The reality of today is, people going after him, Marcus, Jocko, etc. They're not doing this for the accountability, they're not altruistic in any sense. They're peanut butter and jealous.

Some of these guys are recently-ish retired and only now able to address it. Jealousy might always be a factor, but I'd rather see crabs in a bucket than some dude faking a bunch of shit and everyone else keeping their mouths shut.

When did USASOC use Tim Kennedy for recruiting? I’ve never seen any ads or pictures of him for recruitment.

I think it'd be fair to say Tim has been an "unofficial" USASOC recruiting tool since he started fighting in the UFC.

 

[TLDR20]

I think you're 100% correct on this. Hell, he was just taking photos with the SMA a few weeks ago.



My experience, so not indicative of SOF as a whole:

Most every SOF guy I've ever met has been a stud about maintaining professional awareness. The was an explicit understanding and awareness of what "big boy rules" and "leeway" meant in various contexts.
There might be those occasional turds who try to walk around Carson wearing hiking boots or don't have a shave/haircut when needed, but those dude would get corrected very quickly by SENIOR NCOs and made an example of.



Some of these guys are recently-ish retired and only now able to address it. Jealousy might always be a factor, but I'd rather see crabs in a bucket than some dude faking a bunch of shit and everyone else keeping their mouths shut.



I think it'd be fair to say Tim has been an "unofficial" USASOC recruiting tool since he started fighting in the UFC.

Sure. But USASOC also didn’t want him to fight. That is supposedly why he left AD I thought.

 

[Devildoc]

ETA: The reality of today is, people going after him, Marcus, Jocko, etc. They're not doing this for the accountability, they're not altruistic in any sense. They're peanut butter and jealous.

Asking for the character trait of honesty is born out of jealousy? Or am I reading it wrong?

 

[Cookie_]

Sure. But USASOC also didn’t want him to fight. That is supposedly why he left AD I thought.

I think he started in the UFC around 2011, so he didn't really become known until after he'd already switched over.
That said, things like sending him to the D-Day jump, Dakota Meyer's re-enlistment, or the Army's B-Day parade are all marketing and recruiting efforts. His social media presence is the replacement for commercials.

ETA: I think if Tim had joined in the 2010s he'd have stayed active duty as a recruiting tool, like how Strotnium was for the e-sports team.

 

[TLDR20]

I think he started in the UFC around 2011, so he didn't really become known until after he'd already switched over.
That said, things like sending him to the D-Day jump, Dakota Meyer's re-enlistment, or the Army's B-Day parade are all marketing and recruiting efforts. His social media presence is the replacement for commercials.

ETA: I think if Tim had joined in the 2010s he'd have stayed active duty as a recruiting tool, like how Strotnium was for the e-sports team.

That’s fair. I didn’t know he did all that on behalf of the Army. I thought a lot of that was his own doing.

ETA: I thought that was the whole “uniform for clout” thing with him. He shows up to these events, then uses his uniform to lend legitimacy to his actions. Maybe I am misunderstanding the situation.

 

[AWP]

This Teams call about the Risk Acceptance process is boring...

Anyway, if we can trust Wikipedia, he enlisted as an 18X in Jan. 2004 and transitioned to the TXARNG in August 2009. He had 6 fights during this time, 4 of them in 2007 when he also graduated Ranger School. I'm not gonna' lie, that's pretty pimp.

Aug. 2009 to Jan. 2017 (MMA retirement) 12 fights, co-founded a multi-million dollar company (Ranger Up), and 3 or 4 TV and movie productions, plus whatever I'm missing.

In that period, Afghanistan was soaking up 2 battalions of SF (and I think it was more like 2 battalions with an additional attached company, so 5 battalions per year at least). If Tim wanted to get his gun on, there's no way he would have been turned down. He did his time and I respect that, I genuinely respect that and his story through that point. If he has guilt over not doing enough or whatever, he should have pressed pause on building his brand.

He did his time, did more than me, and I respect that. I don't respect someone who is willing to repeatedly lie about easily checked facts, especially when he repeated the lies over and over and over.

 

[TLDR20]

I think he started in the UFC around 2011, so he didn't really become known until after he'd already switched over.
That said, things like sending him to the D-Day jump, Dakota Meyer's re-enlistment, or the Army's B-Day parade are all marketing and recruiting efforts. His social media presence is the replacement for commercials.

ETA: I think if Tim had joined in the 2010s he'd have stayed active duty as a recruiting tool, like how Strotnium was for the e-sports team.

He was a professional fighter when he joined as an 18X. He didn’t get to go to UFC till later, but he was fighting professionally.

 

[Devildoc]

He was a professional fighter when he joined as an 18X. He didn’t get to go to UFC till later, but he was fighting professionally.

A slight off-track, we had an 18D student here, was pro fighter before he joined, record was like 26-1. Not too shabby. He cross-decked over to the Unit.

Back to the originally scheduled programming....

 

[Jaknight]

I have been following this ever since Vahalla VFT mentioned it. I find it crazy TK didn’t think someone would call it out.

 

[ThunderHorse]

Asking for the character trait of honesty is born out of jealousy? Or am I reading it wrong?

In this situation? 95% of the people engaged in this are clout chasing trying to raise their profile.

I am inherently honest, my honesty has hurt me in the workplace. My desire for other people to be honest has hurt me in the workplace. I'm also a nobody.

This is a cynical view, but honesty is not really desired.

 

[Topkick]

In this situation? 95% of the people engaged in this are clout chasing trying to raise their profile

I dont think you're wrong and I think there is truth in this, but it doesn't mean its all for the wrong reasons. Two things can be true at once.

 

[DA SWO]

Is revoking his tab warranted?

 

[Box]

SF tabs have been pulled for a lot less - the same way that guys have gotten away with no punishment (and in some cases awards, decorations, and promotions) for much worse

At least he hasn't been tied to Jeffery Epstein
yet

 

[Topkick]

Is revoking his tab warranted?

What does that mean? He achieved it. You can say it's been revoked or make it official, but you can never undo the fact that he earned it.

ETA: My point is that realizing SF is a qualification and that it can be revoked, you can't really say he didn't earn that qualification.

 

[Marauder06]

What does that mean? He achieved it. You can say it's been revoked or make it official, but you can never undo the fact that he earned it.

ETA: My point is that realizing SF is a qualification and that it can be revoked, you can't really say he didn't earn that qualification.

I understand where you’re coming from. It doesn’t mean he never earned it. It’s not an annulment, it’s a revocation. It doesn’t mean he didn’t do the thing, it means he’s not entitled to wear it anymore.

Someone who has actually earned the SF tab might be better able to explain it than I just did.

 

[Topkick]

It doesn’t mean he didn’t do the thing, it means he’s not entitled to wear it anymore.

Makes sense. He was a Green Beret and you can't take that away. Regardless, his fame will surely haunt him.

 

[Cookie_]

What does that mean? He achieved it. You can say it's been revoked or make it official, but you can never undo the fact that he earned it.

ETA: My point is that realizing SF is a qualification and that it can be revoked, you can't really say he didn't earn that qualification.

The example I remember getting at Campbell:

The Guard Tomb of the Unknown Soldier badge is an award for successful service as an Honor Guard, but it can be revoked if you do something dishonorable or disgraceful.

You're records will still show assignment as a Sentinel, but you will no longer have the award.

 

[ThunderHorse]

I don't know how often they take tabs from dudes, but the last one I publicly knew about was part of the attack on Chuck Ritter made famous by Jack Murphy. I would also say that Jack did enough in that whole situation where there should be a review of his tab as well.

The guy who was a part of that remained with the teams, got rid of his crazy wife/gf and went forward on his path through mentorship towards redemption to earn his tab back. No idea if he has. All of this I gleaned from Chuck's twitter account.

 

[AWP]

I guess I'm dumb. I would be mortified if someone were to revoke my driver's license due to performance, much less an SF tab, SEAL Trident, etc. that I'd earned.

The entitlement, arrogance, out-of-touch life one would have to live where pulling an SF tab causes you to shrug it off and double down on that behavior. I can't fathom being that arrogant, prideful, and stupid. I know that behavior, like quantum mechanics, exists but I still can't wrap my head around the concept.

Step away from Timmmmmaayyyyyy for a minute and consider Rob O'Neill:
SEAL - Not enough
DEVGRU - Not enough
A decade+ in DEVGRU at the height of the GWOT - Not enough
On the bin laden mission - Not enough
"I shot UBL." - Ding! Ding! Ding!