Covid-19

[Cookie_]

Well, you'll have to extend me some grace on this one. I am unsure as to how your bolded furthers the conversation or informs the question at hand. I hope you'll allow me to re-phrase/re-cage.

The whole point of the OP; "I am willing to hear who *you* think is articulate and smart, I just don't know many; please help me learn."

The interesting thing your post seems to convey is, "Given enough press and the awareness of the Average American, politicians all do increasingly stupid things commensurate with and proportional to their presence in the zeitgeist." Which is a pretty wild thought to entertain. It's like Schrödinger's superposition in politics.

"In this box, you have a politician. As long as they're completely invisible to the press and the Average American isn't aware of them, they're smart and articulate. However, the more you observe the politician, the stupider things they say/do." To follow that to it's logical conclusion- the most popular politicians say and do the dumbest things.

I tend to agree with that last sentence, although I am not sure that was your intended point.

Super fun reminder that's not meant to say anything in particular; the current head of the Democratic Party is the most popular president in the history of the United States. 81 million Average Americans are aware of him.

I don't disagree with anything you posted.

The bolded statements are slightly flipped from what I was trying to get at though. I don't think people do stupider things as they get more coverage, I think they get more coverage precisely because they do/say stupid things.

Nobody in media wants to present someone who can calmly explain their positioning on a topic; we want people who talk about Jewish-space lasers and can't define what a woman is. The American people as a whole would rather watch a trainwreck than an actual policy talk.

My point is that I really don't believe that the majority of our representatives are particularly dumb or inarticulate, but that we only see the crazies from both sides.

To use the list I gave you; I think only one of them doesn't qualify as smart or articulate (Bobert) and that's the one who is always being covered by the media. Granted, she got elected, so does it matter what I think?

I've seen every other person on that list speak, and even the one I've actively canvased against (Lamborn) is still a generally articulate/smart person.


ETA: For non-Colorado Dems that I think are decently articulate/smart off the top of my head;
Ro Khanna, Sherrod Brown, Tammy Duckworth, Patrick Leahy, Bernie Sanders, Raphael Warnock, Tim Kaine, Jon Ossoff.

 

[Devildoc]

I don't think any of our representatives are dumb. Sure, the right name or pretty face can be propped up by money and put in the system and be elected to be a mouthpiece for whoever is pulling their strings, but I think that's pretty rare.

But I sure see a bunch that are inarticulate. I'm not surprised, though. A lot of people who are elected are policy wants or businessmen or in fields where they just don't have to watch what they say and how they say it, and we all know the pressure of what a microphone and a camera can do.

What is so disheartening and disdainful are the people who get elected who forget why they're being elected and sharpen their tongues and appeal to the masses and become very articulate, but are an inch deep because now they are professional politicians.

 

[Devildoc]

Speaking of COVID, a handful of people might have recently had it. All of them have had the vaccination, and most of them have worn masks at work (in spite of our building being non-clinical building and not requiring masks). So my leadership in all of its wisdom has decided everyone has to be masked again, maintain social distancing, it's crazy.

 

[Brill]

Speaking of COVID, a handful of people might have recently had it. All of them have had the vaccination, and most of them have worn masks at work (in spite of our building being non-clinical building and not requiring masks). So my leadership in all of its wisdom has decided everyone has to be masked again, maintain social distancing, it's crazy.

What‘s the point of vax & mask then?

 

[Devildoc]

What‘s the point of vax & mask then?

Fuck, Don't ask me. I just work here.

 

[amlove21]

@Cookie_ thank you for clarifying. It doesn't specifically address the topic at hand, but I understand what you're saying. Thanks for engaging.

Speaking of COVID, a handful of people might have recently had it. All of them have had the vaccination, and most of them have worn masks at work (in spite of our building being non-clinical building and not requiring masks). So my leadership in all of its wisdom has decided everyone has to be masked again, maintain social distancing, it's crazy.

Is anyone thinking of saying, "Fuck you, no." (respectfully, of course)?

 

[Brill]

Is anyone thinking of saying, "Fuck you, no." (respectfully, of course)?

We’ve had some say that for testing & masks and Employee Relations quickly jump into to 5-day suspension followed by termination after 15 days.

Separation (retirement/resignation) section is really backlogged and our hiring cannot keep up.

 

[amlove21]

We’ve had some say that for testing & masks and Employee Relations quickly jump into to 5-day suspension followed by termination after 15 days.

Separation (retirement/resignation) section is really backlogged and our hiring cannot keep up.

Wild. The temporary stay basically saved a close friend of mine's retirement... the "fatigue" from our service members over this issue is extreme. I am not speaking for all service members, rather, those in my unit and ones I have talked to.

I think there is someone reading the writing on the wall, which is exactly why boosters haven't been mandated. The straw poll of "would you get another shot if we told you to" didn't work out great.

 

[Brill]

Wild. The temporary stay basically saved a close friend of mine's retirement... the "fatigue" from our service members over this issue is extreme. I am not speaking for all service members, rather, those in my unit and ones I have talked to.

I think there is someone reading the writing on the wall, which is exactly why boosters haven't been mandated. The straw poll of "would you get another shot if we told you to" didn't work out great.

I see the vax stats across the SOF formation and it closely tracks USG rates (97-98%) but on the civilian side, the only verification is the card so the actual vax rate is prob much lower (faking) and it’s worth noting many left before deadline for punishment.

 

[757]

Random small study I found on monkey pox for those that enjoy data. If it's been posted elsewhere, my apologies.

Also a meme, because I can't help myself

 

[Devildoc]

Is anyone thinking of saying, "Fuck you, no." (respectfully, of course)?

And keeping their job? Bwahahaha....ah, no.

Seriously, I'm not sure what the recourse would be since it is not a clinical building and that the big boss is basically making up policy on her own. Would we be in the right? Yes. Would we also be dead men walking? Also yes.

I note with delicious irony that the people who are getting COVID are the people who are vaccinated in regularly wear masks while the few of us who did not get the vaccination and have askewed mask particles as much as possible I've been pretty much okay.

I did have COVID twice, once last summer where it was literally "a bad cold" and once in December before Christmas and that was pretty awful. But since then I have been living life with no special precautions, as has my family, and we have been fine.

 

[AWP]

Let's say... other than Tulsi Gabbard, who are these smart and articulate Dems? If you were building a team of people with policies you would support or a team that you think could help, who would that be?

My sort of moderate opinion:
1. You'd have to start with a Blue Dog Democrat (if they even exist anymore) or a moderate because far too many of that party today IMO are a bunch of screech owls.
2. Tulsi Gabbard got the shaft from her party for standing up to the Clinton machine.
3. This COVID shit is fear, bullshit, and residual control. If you can’t think for yourself, double down on draconian policies and hide behind The Man.

 

[ThunderHorse]

Let's say... other than Tulsi Gabbard, who are these smart and articulate Dems? If you were building a team of people with policies you would support or a team that you think could help, who would that be?

I am not asking in an adversarial manner; I am truly interested to see who makes that grade with you. I try and give this question serious thought if only for one reason- I am contrarian by nature, and my default position is agnosticism and cynicism.

Meaning, there are some places where I see people say, "All republicans are fascists and homophobes!", and I enjoy talking about Ron DeSantis, Thomas Sowell, some others as a way to highlight their shitty position.

And, because I like arguing discourse, I'm happy to do the same to the "Libtards are all the same they wanna kill babies and have sex with kids!" crowd. I often find myself just finding shitty republicans to highlight issues with the right, or bad policy- instead of having a list of "good dems".

But I will say... I have many fewer options in that latter discussion. One, for the amount of "sane, logical" Dems I see (I know your bar was 'smart and articulate', and I respect that) is like, zero. Two, the baseline ideological platform of the left seems to not only breed but require it's members to be wayyyyyyyy left of center.

Maybe I can't see the forest for the trees on this one- bGrier.

can be as smart and articulate as you'd like while not being able to define a woman, saying men can give birth, and telling me that it's perfectly fine for an adult to have secret conversations with 6 year olds about sex, gender, and trans rights.

That doesn't make you a good person- it makes you a very adept advocate for the things listed, and in no way would I allow you to have more power to continue those endeavors.


ETA- This has nothing to do with COVID. It actually belongs in another thread we don't have anymore, I am happy to take it to PM's, Mara. Don't want to derail the atrocity that is the COVID-19 thread... but I suppose it does serve as a pretty meta example of the political nature of COVID.

ETAA (Edit to Add Again)- I just made a great point. Politics and the political nature of COVID are so closely intertwined that my original post is fine. Anyway, if any mods wanna take this down or adjust, let me know.

I was gonna say Jason Crow, but he's in bed with the gun grabbing hardcore idiots that run the party. So probably none. Like I've moved to Texas and these idiots are trying to run Francis O'Rorke. The Democrats have lost their way. I know @Devildoc mentioned Webb, I have no idea how that guy maintains his registration amongst them.

General rule of thumb seems to be that the more likely it is the average American is aware of that politician, the stupider things said politician says/does.

I'll use Colorado as an example since I live and vote here.

Which of the below politicians do you think people know, and of that group, who would you think is "smart and articulate"?

Diana DeGette, Joe Neguse, Lauren Boebert, Ken Buck, Doug Lamborn, Jason Crow, Ed Perlmutter, Michael Bennet, John Hickenlooper.

ETA: Obviously if you follow politics or are politically active in the state you might have some idea of these people, but I don't think most people do.

So basically, in the state of Colorado you have one decent politician in Ed. He should probably retire while he can.

I don't disagree with anything you posted.

The bolded statements are slightly flipped from what I was trying to get at though. I don't think people do stupider things as they get more coverage, I think they get more coverage precisely because they do/say stupid things.

Nobody in media wants to present someone who can calmly explain their positioning on a topic; we want people who talk about Jewish-space lasers and can't define what a woman is. The American people as a whole would rather watch a trainwreck than an actual policy talk.

My point is that I really don't believe that the majority of our representatives are particularly dumb or inarticulate, but that we only see the crazies from both sides.

To use the list I gave you; I think only one of them doesn't qualify as smart or articulate (Bobert) and that's the one who is always being covered by the media. Granted, she got elected, so does it matter what I think?

I've seen every other person on that list speak, and even the one I've actively canvased against (Lamborn) is still a generally articulate/smart person.


ETA: For non-Colorado Dems that I think are decently articulate/smart off the top of my head;
Ro Khanna, Sherrod Brown, Tammy Duckworth, Patrick Leahy, Bernie Sanders, Raphael Warnock, Tim Kaine, Jon Ossoff.

Your whole list here is people I'd rather give to Putin in exchange for Griner.

 

[Steve1839]

Diana DeGette, Joe Neguse, Lauren Boebert, Ken Buck, Doug Lamborn, Jason Crow, Ed Perlmutter, Michael Bennet, John Hickenlooper.

Ken Buck was my congress critter for most of my most recent stay in Colorado...he's not particularly well spoken and doesn't seem to be the brightest bulb on the porch...Boebert's elevator misses a few floors, but I once ate in her restaurant and the food was decent and the scenery was pleasant...DeGette and Neguse are pretty typical progress Commun...Democrats...Perlmutter is taking a long overdue retirement...Hickenlooper seems to have more integrity than the POTUS, but he can be pretty goofy at times. I disagree with Bennet on most things but he can be effective crossing party lines...he and Cory Gardner made a decent team, IMNSHO...I can't speak for Lamborn and Crow was a Ranger so even though his politics are contrary to mine, I'll give him a pass. I kinda miss having Ben Nighthorse Campbell as my representative and senator...he was able to piss off both parties.

 

[Muppet]

Ok, Biden has the plague again? He just had it. Does anybody actually believe this?

 

[Marauder06]

Let's say... other than Tulsi Gabbard, who are these smart and articulate Dems? If you were building a team of people with policies you would support or a team that you think could help, who would that be?

I am not asking in an adversarial manner; I am truly interested to see who makes that grade with you. I try and give this question serious thought if only for one reason- I am contrarian by nature, and my default position is agnosticism and cynicism.

Meaning, there are some places where I see people say, "All republicans are fascists and homophobes!", and I enjoy talking about Ron DeSantis, Thomas Sowell, some others as a way to highlight their shitty position.

And, because I like arguing discourse, I'm happy to do the same to the "Libtards are all the same they wanna kill babies and have sex with kids!" crowd. I often find myself just finding shitty republicans to highlight issues with the right, or bad policy- instead of having a list of "good dems".

But I will say... I have many fewer options in that latter discussion. One, for the amount of "sane, logical" Dems I see (I know your bar was 'smart and articulate', and I respect that) is like, zero. Two, the baseline ideological platform of the left seems to not only breed but require it's members to be wayyyyyyyy left of center.

Maybe I can't see the forest for the trees on this one- but you can be as smart and articulate as you'd like while not being able to define a woman, saying men can give birth, and telling me that it's perfectly fine for an adult to have secret conversations with 6 year olds about sex, gender, and trans rights.

That doesn't make you a good person- it makes you a very adept advocate for the things listed, and in no way would I allow you to have more power to continue those endeavors.


ETA- This has nothing to do with COVID. It actually belongs in another thread we don't have anymore, I am happy to take it to PM's, Mara. Don't want to derail the atrocity that is the COVID-19 thread... but I suppose it does serve as a pretty meta example of the political nature of COVID.

ETAA (Edit to Add Again)- I just made a great point. Politics and the political nature of COVID are so closely intertwined that my original post is fine. Anyway, if any mods wanna take this down or adjust, let me know.

In the context of my previous post about the White House spox, I'm casting a wider net than national-level Democrat politicians, none of whom I know personally. I can think of several "intelligent and articulate" Democrats from among my circle of friends, including some of the people I work with and some of the people I went to grad school with. There is even one here on the site, although in retrospect I don't know if he considers himself a Democrat or a Libertarian (or neither). At any rate, those are the people I had in mind when I made my comment.

Additionally, as previously mentioned I thought that Jen Psaki, the previous holder of that office, did a comparatively good job in that role despite her annoying penchant to "circle back." And with millions upon millions of Dems in our country, I have no doubt that there are plenty of them who fall into the category we're discussing, I just don't know them.

In terms of whom I might have on a team of Democrats--I wouldn't. I don't want Democrats to win at the national level and wouldn't do anything to support such an effort. In fact if I were compelled to put together a team of Dems I would cobble together the worst representatives of that party and try to get them through the primaries, in order to give my side a better chance at winning the general election. Exactly like what Dems are doing in some Republican races right now... although as this article mentions, that could backfire.

Shifting away from the specific case of the WH spox and speaking more broadly: with regard to the Democrat platform on things like the definition of a woman, racial equity, etc., I disagree with those positions firmly and think that they are stupid, but that doesn't mean that the people advancing them are. They were smart enough to use those positions to win the Presidency, the House and (with the VP's vote) the Senate. We all know politicians say anything, including a bunch of stuff they don't believe. I think Democrats are fully capable of defining what a woman is or any number of other things, they just say they can't (or won't) because it's politically expedient.

And if you're a politician, political expediency is... smart politics.

 

[Muppet]

Monkeypox Symbol Added To Pride Flag

 

[ThunderHorse]

Monkeypox Symbol Added To Pride Flag

California declared a state of emergency. But why are we not just being clear that 90% of the people getting it are gay men who like anal?

 

[Gunz]

California declared a state of emergency. But why are we not just being clear that 90% of the people getting it are gay men who like anal?

The CDC--which should be the source for truth about disease--is perfectly cool omitting vital information like that from the public. They don't give a fuck who they panic as long as they don't offend gays. Luckily, the information is out there, you just won't find it at the CDC.

 

[AWP]

The CDC--which should be the source for truth about disease--is perfectly cool omitting vital information like that from the public. They don't give a fuck who they panic as long as they don't offend gays. Luckily, the information is out there, you just won't find it at the CDC.

The WHO will investigate and conclude monkeypox was caused by climate change.