The Trump Presidency 2.0

@amlove21 this board has been consistent that it's either classified info or not, and that actions should be taken for all parties involved based on that.

This isn't true across some other places I also lurk/comment which want to smash one side or the other based on the political base of the commenters. That's the mindset i disagree with.

I'm over here with you:
amlove21 said:
You can’t hold both positions at once. It was either a breach of national security of the highest order or it wasn’t.
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Devildoc said:
This thing is really starting to piss me the fuck off.

Not that it happened. Mistakes happen, we're all human. But it's not that hard. It's actually not hard at all, a very easy algorithm: did someone fuck up? Yes/No. No? Done. Yes? Find out who and select appropriate punitive measures, whatever that looks like.

But each party just wants to obfuscate, double-down, and deflect.

Christ on a cracker.

I'm going to get my port flushed and pick up my pre-chemo meds now....
Click to expand...

If we're throwing Waltz and Hegseth in prison, Hillary and Biden go first. But the Democrats have been consistent with Hillary and Biden as doing nothing wrong.

None of these fruitcakes have a leg to stand on, so let's move along. Lol
 
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amlove21 said:
Who is saying they did nothing wrong?
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SECDEF, The President said SECDEF did nothing wrong, Karoline Leavitt called it a hoax, John Ratliffe is saying no classified info was shared, Tulsi said no classified info was shared.
---
Waltz said he made a mistake, I wouldn't be surprised if he falls on his sword and this all goes away. It goes away regardless, because SQUIRREL!, and nothing really happens.
 
So, with all the kerfuffle around spillage and the reported buildup at Diego Garcia, can anyone tell me when the bombing begins?

I mean, all the info was published, right? Have buildings and people in the Middle East started exploding yet?
 
Blizzard said:
Will be interesting to see where this all ends up...is Carney the future for Canada?
https://twitter.com/x/status/1905354361192304998
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Look at this post. Trump team called this morning to reset things.

Post in thread 'The Trump Presidency 2.0'
RackMaster

Post in thread 'The Trump Presidency 2.0'

Read elsewhere that Trump's team called Carney. Carney was pulling ahead of the polls, off of the manufactured rage/fear of Trump and the 51st State. Trump calling and then making a statement like this could defuse the Liberal campaign.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1905639104366194919

https://twitter.com/x/status/1905326151041450480

Edited to add updated info.
  • Like
 
@amlove21 Security breach of the highest order =/= collateral secret.

There isn't a rulebook for this. There isn't any type of flow chart. Each security incident is different. And there is absolutely a difference between a leak and a spill. What led to the spill? What led to the leak? Was anything leaked? Who did their on boarding? Their security training? Are there even records of that training? What did the training cover? Did it cover this scenario? What was the classification of the info? What was the fall out? Was anything compromised? There's a million other questions and it's all weighed to determine the final outcome.

Someone in the group chat saw something they shouldn't have. That someone was put there by Alex Wong. He's to blame for the information being seen. The cabinet shouldn't be conducting business on Signal, but that's their perogative, and their risk to accept. At our level, we cannot accept that risk; we're not authorized to.

SECDEF isn't getting fired. Waltz isn't getting fired. The journalist isn't going to jail. Worst case Alex Wong gets fired and we move on.
 
GOTWA said:
@amlove21 Security breach of the highest order =/= collateral secret.

There isn't a rulebook for this. There isn't any type of flow chart. Each security incident is different. And there is absolutely a difference between a leak and a spill. What led to the spill? What led to the leak? Was anything leaked? Who did their on boarding? Their security training? Are there even records of that training? What did the training cover? Did it cover this scenario? What was the classification of the info? What was the fall out? Was anything compromised? There's a million other questions and it's all weighed to determine the final outcome.

Someone in the group chat saw something they shouldn't have. That someone was put there by Alex Wong. He's to blame for the information being seen. The cabinet shouldn't be conducting business on Signal, but that's their perogative, and their risk to accept. At our level, we cannot accept that risk; we're not authorized to.

SECDEF isn't getting fired. Waltz isn't getting fired. The journalist isn't going to jail. Worst case Alex Wong gets fired and we move on.
Click to expand...

Since DoD issues iPhones these days...and we don't have crackberry chat, how do these people IM even through a SIPR phone? Maybe that's "classified" or something. But the devices we used that had IM Capabality that are used in the force don't work via cell tower.

So I'm just asking a question here, how does the man say go?

_______

ETA: So, how does a state get Build Back Better funds?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1905591976876990670
 
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So...
I respectfully suggest that prior to reading past this sentence, everyone add a second (ir even third) layer of tin foil to the inside of your hat.


Because there IS a difference between a leak and a spill, I would like to invite those of you with reinforced tin foil head gear to come on a journey with me.

You're traveling through another dimension of politics - a dimension not only of social media and mainstream media, but one of trolling and chicanery. A journey into a wondrous land whose boundaries are that of imagination. You unlock this door with the key of imagination. Beyond it is another dimension of politics: a dimension of sound bytes, a dimension of false narratives, a dimension of straw man arguments and non sequiturs. You're moving into a land of both shadow and substance, of things and ideas. It is the middle ground between light and shadow, between science and superstition, and it lies between the pit of man's fears and the summit of his knowledge.

You've just crossed over into... the MAGA Zone.

- A dimension where a president makes wildly unhinged claims - and his supporters not only accept and defend them - but strain to explain the nuance.
- A dimension where the head of the FBI once admitted in the national media that he did in fact intentionally leak information to a reporter because he KNEW it would go viral and lead to an excuse to open an investigation...
...based on information that he KNEW had been fabricated
- A dimension where people accept that Epstein unequivocally killed himself regardless of the surrounding circumstances.
- A dimension where people are furious to the point of committing random violent acts of aggression against innocent strangers...
...because they drive cars built by a man that has just uncovered BILLIONS of dollars in systemic governmental fraud, waste, and abuse
...and not actually be mad at their elected officials that have been zealously engaged in this systemic governmental fraud, waste, and abuse
- A dimension where a congressional representative makes a joke about the release of classified information being the result of the SecDef "drunk texting" and its funny as shit - not because its clever, but because it is...
...possible

In this wildly unhinged dimension - is it even a teeny bit possible that some of this insane shit posting in a group chat in the presence of a journalist that has a record of posting partisan hit pieces - was intentional ?
Instead of a series of "don't cross this red line" threats - is it possible that another option was just "leak" information that we are about to butt fuck someone's home into a pile of rubble out of boredom and disrespect...
...instead of spending a bunch of political effort pretending that "negotiations" would suffice?

Negotiation through the indirect threat of military reprisal?
Nonsense.
Once upon a time I learned about gunboat diplomacy - but this leak was about Fighter/Bombers not ships - so it CANT be gunboat diplomacy.
Besides, nobody really does that kind of shit anymore - how brutish that would be.

Or - maybe - just maybe - everyone in politics really is just a slightly different version of "trash human" that enjoys the privilege of living on the in-party side of a multi tiered just-us system?

Just spitballing - it's clearly not possible in this timeline. Not with all of the virtuous overseers we have in our gubmint.
 
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GOTWA said:
@amlove21 Security breach of the highest order =/= collateral secret.




SECDEF isn't getting fired. Waltz isn't getting fired. The journalist isn't going to jail. Worst case Alex Wong gets fired and we move on.
Click to expand...
Wong being fired is a good thing because what he did was just wong on so many levels...
 
The more I think about it, this gets really ugly if you peel back the layers. Using logic, this dead thing in America, drops a lot of bodies.
 
DA SWO said:
Wong being fired is a good thing because what he did was just wong on so many levels...
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Lol. And he wouldn't be getting fired for the information that was in the group chat, he'd be getting fired for inviting everyone to the clown show that took place afterwards.
 
GOTWA said:
@amlove21 Security breach of the highest order =/= collateral secret.

There isn't a rulebook for this. There isn't any type of flow chart. Each security incident is different. And there is absolutely a difference between a leak and a spill. What led to the spill? What led to the leak? Was anything leaked? Who did their on boarding? Their security training? Are there even records of that training? What did the training cover? Did it cover this scenario? What was the classification of the info? What was the fall out? Was anything compromised? There's a million other questions and it's all weighed to determine the final outcome.

Someone in the group chat saw something they shouldn't have. That someone was put there by Alex Wong. He's to blame for the information being seen. The cabinet shouldn't be conducting business on Signal, but that's their perogative, and their risk to accept. At our level, we cannot accept that risk; we're not authorized to.

SECDEF isn't getting fired. Waltz isn't getting fired. The journalist isn't going to jail. Worst case Alex Wong gets fired and we move on.
Click to expand...
Ok... so then why all the outrage? Was this a nothingburger? Or was it a national security issues?

In this nebulous set of rules that now apparently doesn't exist we spent 4 days (without reading the actual full text of the chat for about 3 of those days) saying in very black and white terms that this was a violation. Hegseth was stupid and everyone on the chat shared secrets and it was spillage. Now, when it comes to the meat and potatoes of accountability (which we all *say* we want)- NOW there is all this nuance and context and things we have to consider?

Now we are at the end of this one- no one is getting fired, or charged, or held accountable in any way it seems. Which means- we just wasted 8 pages of rage for nothing.

Your bolded could have been the only post on this issue when this story broke a week ago.

ETA- You're correct about a leak vs spill- you said yourself we have both and neither party will be held accountable.
 

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