The Trump Presidency

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Etype said:
It wouldn't be the first time those organizations have lied based on a political agenda- or even the third or fourth time.

He's not obligated to trust the IC, especially while it is still run by Pres Obama's appointees.

Hell, even in the world of intelligence, you aren't supposed to trust or distrust anyone initially- veracity always needs to be validated.

Lucky for you, it doesn't matter whether or not you have confidence in the president. Your job is to do what you're told.
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President Obama's fault, no obligation to trust anyone appointed by anyone other than PE Trump, the FBI/CIA/NSA are liars. Check.

As far as "my job is to do what I am told", lol. I'm sure what you meant to say was, "as a military member you are beholden to lawful orders of the officers appointed over you and the POTUS regardless of your personal feelings." I figured out how to do that over the last 16+ years pretty well, so I appreciate the mentorship and everything, but serving professionally and hating the administration you serve aren't mutually exclusive. See: the last 8 years with vocal members of this board, yourself included.

ThunderHorse said:
That's exactly what this whole thing has been about.
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Disagree.

The "whole thing" has been about PE Trump's administration first outright denying, then acknowledging to the smallest degree that sure, Russia hacked the DNC and gave that info to Wikileaks in order to influence the election in PE Trump's favor. Further down the road, what does show us about how PE Trump handles complex issues like this and what should we expect after the first 100 days.

IMO, it's not as much about politics (while politics permeate the entire issue), it's more about PE Trump and his new guard (Conway, Preibus, et al) are handling their first real international issue and what that means for the first 100 days and beyond.

So far I see a whole lot of passing the buck, zero accountability, and disjointed/poor leadership. PE Trump loves the spotlight and has made a point to continue to own the news cycle with his tweeting and his overall behavior, so the world is indeed watching.

It just sucks that the world is watching him perform poorly in these first 100 days.

Etype said:
So let's take it as a given that all facets of the USG are under constant cyber attack- which they are.

The best the DNC had to offer was either-
1. Unaware of this fact.
2. So arrogant that they thought the rules didn't apply to them.

Failure to perform E-4 level IA/OPEC tasks, and she wanted to be president???

Hahahahahaha
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You 100% ignored @alibi 's actual post, which was pretty good and actually relevant to the discussion.

He commented with sourced material refuting your contention that there was no evidence Russia was the state actor that hacked the DNC, and you ignored it, in favor of once again bringing up your personal feelings about Hillary Clinton.
 
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Thought this was an excellent summary of the demographic and economic shifts at work in the last election cycle: 2016: A Year Defined by America’s Diverging Economies

Any election has a diverse array of opinions that coalesce into the voting booth but I thought this article did a good job of showing how the underpinnings of demographic, social, and economic shifts in the country have an impact.
 
The Navy would have the numbers it wants if it learned how to design, source, and field ships. The last three programs are seagoing dumpster fires.
 
Just like those plane programs the air force has?

Well, life just got interesting: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/10/us/politics/donald-trump-russia-intelligence.html

Il Duce said:
Looks like bad news any way you cut it to me. The PE is already disinclined to trust the IC based on the hacking back-and-forth going on now. The fact that he can't seem to get any information from the IC without it leaking immediately has got to only exacerbate those concerns. Whoever is leaking this stuff straight from his briefings is virtually guaranteeing the new ODNI and CIA directors are going to go apeshit on a top-level loyalty purge just so they can have some trust that every conversation the President has isn't leaked immediately.

That's of course assuming the leaks are coming from the briefing side of things - certainly could be folks on the PE's staff.
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Or from Obama's side, or from someone on the Gang of 8's staff?

We just can't keep freaking secrets anymore, clown shoes.
 
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A similar take from The Guardian

A direct link to the report is here
(Note that the classification markings are proprietary, as the document was prepared by a private company. Don't worry about getting in trouble for reading classified material)

While the report is apparently from a reputable British CI dude, it's still unsubstantiated. The accusations are incredibly damning, and as much as I don't approve of the President Elect, I also don't want these allegations to be true.
 
Roger, after reading through the reporting - thought NYT did the best job with it - it was an appendix to the official report briefed to the PE, the President, and Congress. Definitely was going to leak, probably not reasonable to expect that to stay under wraps with that many consumers in the capital.

Still, the IC is digging themselves further and further in with this stuff. I can see the ODNI's delimma though. If the IC doesn't include that stuff in the report - and the information has been all over the place as opposition research during the campaign, they're very vulnerable to accusations of cover up and bias. But, salacious reports with zero corroboration are just the sort of thing that make the IC look like political hacks who deserve zero trust. A no-win situation for the IC for sure.

Wiener Licker said:
A similar take from The Guardian

A direct link to the report is here
(Note that the classification markings are proprietary, as the document was prepared by a private company. Don't worry about getting in trouble for reading classified material)

While the report is apparently from a reputable British CI dude, it's still unsubstantiated. The accusations are incredibly damning, and as much as I don't approve of the President Elect, I also don't want these allegations to be true.
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Right, but of course the argument can be made they were addressed - though they never got significant media play - during the election. The supposition that PE Trump was favored by Russia and had extensive business ties to Russia that could be compromising was trotted out on the campaign trail by his opponents throughout the race. It was won of the strongest cases for how important it was to see PE Trump's tax returns. But, he won anyway so even if it comes out as true - which I think eventually when Trump's tax returns come out there will be at least some basis for the accusations - take-backs are almost impossible to do in the election business.

I think though, it does make sense of the PE's violent reaction to the Russian hacking allegations. As I thought about this I've thought the PE is not only reacting very poorly to this information from a leadership perspective but it's a very stupid reaction politically. I mean, the PE's inauguration is not in question - he's going to become the President very shortly. So, the accusation doesn't put him in danger - it hurts his pride a bit but there's no real political consequence other than opposition voices - which are still going to be complaining. So, if the PE had stepped up and said something like 'This is terrible news and I am with President Obama in denouncing this Russian aggression against our sovereign election process. I have campaigned on extending an opportunity at forward progress with Russia but make no mistake - I put America's interest first and I won't be pushed around. All Americans should understand I'm resolutely behind our great democracy and the integrity of our electoral process.'

All at once he would have defanged the Russian collusion accusations - while not taking any real action against Russia and maintaining his bromance with Putin. He would appear especially presidential, conciliatory towards the shit-ton of people who voted against him, and give a concrete sound-bite for his surrogates to use against the argument that PE Trump is an authoritarian-in-waiting.

But of course, when you add in the allegations at the end of the report it virtually guarantees PE Trump is going to have a really hard time seeing it as anything but an attack on him personally and on his legitimacy. Still think his political team could have helped him make a better choice but it doesn't look like anybody is in the kill-chain on his twitter account but him.
 
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I don't know. At the very least, the material on pages 34 and 35 of the report, which concern payment for the cyberespionage against the DNC, could be considered actual crimes. If it's true, that is.

ETA: 4chan is claiming that the bit about Trump ordering prostitutes to urinate in front of him was fabricated by a poster and passed on to Rick Wilson.
 
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RackMaster said:
And with that, I'd consider this whole thing bogus.
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The whole thing is really murky. On one hand, there IS a post from November 1st that claims to have fabricated something (they weren't specific) sent to Rick Wilson which got picked up by CIA. /pol/ - Politically Incorrect » Thread #95568919

On the other, it's a non-specific comment, which was posted one day after Mother Jones posted an article about Russia potentially cultivating Trump for 5+ years, echoing some of the things that we saw in this report: A veteran spy has given the FBI information alleging a Russian operation to cultivate Donald Trump

It could very well have been some some channer saying that they fabricated something non-specific after seeing the MJ article, or the litany of other articles about the Trump/Russia connection. Like I said, it's all very murky.
 
Wiener Licker said:
The whole thing is really murky. On one hand, there IS a post from November 1st that claims to have fabricated something (they weren't specific) sent to Rick Wilson which got picked up by CIA. /pol/ - Politically Incorrect » Thread #95568919

On the other, it's a non-specific comment, which was posted one day after Mother Jones posted an article about Russia potentially cultivating Trump for 5+ years, echoing some of the things that we saw in this report: A veteran spy has given the FBI information alleging a Russian operation to cultivate Donald Trump

It could very well have been some some channer saying that they fabricated something non-specific after seeing the MJ article, or the litany of other articles about the Trump/Russia connection. Like I said, it's all very murky.
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Rick Wilson has hinted about having this stuff way before November 1st.
 
Wiener Licker said:
A similar take from The Guardian

A direct link to the report is here
(Note that the classification markings are proprietary, as the document was prepared by a private company. Don't worry about getting in trouble for reading classified material)

While the report is apparently from a reputable British CI dude, it's still unsubstantiated. The accusations are incredibly damning, and as much as I don't approve of the President Elect, I also don't want these allegations to be true.
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On the subject of foreign governments meddling with our elections, now we are giving credence to foreign intelligence reports regarding our elected officials???

Surely on the heels of BREXIT, the UK would have no reason to subvert Trump.

James Comey's name comes up, yet again.

James Comey, part of Obama's weaponozation of gov't- right alongside the IRS.

Damning testimony from Engrlbrect-
 
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Etype said:
On the subject of foreign governments meddling with our elections, now we are giving credence to foreign intelligence reports regarding our elected officials???

Surely on the heels of BREXIT, the UK would have no reason to subvert Trump.
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I don't think it's fair to categorize someone working in private security in the US who retired from the British intelligence services as representing British government or British intelligence services' positions on anything.

It's sort of hilarious to see this sort of thing get so much play - and so much reaction from the Trump team. There has been tons of reporting on substantiated malfeasance on the part of the PE - his 'charitable' foundation, his long-running business interests, his shady business practices, the stream of lies/untruths/misinformation/tantrums coming out of his twitter feed. None of that stuff stuck - or at least stuck enough to keep him getting elected President. At the same time any allegation, no matter how far fetched or unsubstantiated, about HRC - and more than a few about President Obama - was taken as gospel on the right - she runs a child pornography ring, was hacked by the Russians, has aides killed - he outlawed the pledge of allegiance, etc. Now, when the election is over the thing getting the most play - and the most reaction from Trump - is the least sourced, least credible accusation against him.
 
Il Duce said:
I don't think it's fair to categorize someone working in private security in the US who retired from the British intelligence services as representing British government or British intelligence services' positions on anything...
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So is the way of agents of influence.

Since when is an intelligence firm who is not contracted by the gov't taken seriously?


ETA-

The Trump haters are at the end of their rope. The NSA and CIA with their severely damaged credibility, couldn't make shit stick to the wall. So now we have industrial espionage firms being brought into the fray. Brilliant.
 
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Etype said:
So is the way of agents of influence.

Since when is an intelligence firm who is not contracted by the gov't taken seriously?


ETA-

The Trump haters are at the end of their rope. The NSA and CIA with their severely damaged credibility, couldn't make shit stick to the wall. So now we have industrial espionage firms being brought into the fray. Brilliant.
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Had some type of credibility with his Republican opponents and HRC...more than likely just out to make a good buck.

What in the Freakin Freakin is John McCain doing? John McCain passes dossier alleging secret Trump-Russia contacts to FBI
 
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