Linda Norgrove rescue botched, SF/SEALs blamed

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phridum

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http://kitup.military.com/2010/10/it-wasnt-sf-that-botched-the-norgrove-rescue.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ecial-forces-helmet-camera.html#ixzz129VlR3VK

Curious why we haven't had any discussion about this operation, aside from the obvious OpSec issues. At first it was a blanket "special forces" label that made it seem like the Army screwed it up, but as information is revealed, it seems that SEALs performed the operation.

Of course, we can never expect the media to be as accurate as they should be. They simply aren't educated enough about the topic of tactics and equipment. Consider the photo in the British article of the soldier wearing a "helmet mounted camera" in which I only see a strobe and NVG mount.

I never carried frags and bangers at the same time, so I can't speak on the possibility of accidentally grabbing the wrong one, but they aren't exactly so similar this would be easy. Do we dare speculate what possible things could have happened?
 

TheSiatonist

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RIP, Linda Norgrove.

Yet members of the SAS, who were on standby for the operation, were understood to have had deep reservations about the rescue plan, fearing that the use of helicopters would simply have alerted the insurgents.

Based on the narrative on the graphic, I had similar thoughts also regarding the helo. But then, I am not military nor SOF.

My hat's off to the guys who went in and tried to rescue her.
 

dknob

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article-1319683-0B92FFE1000005DC-132_634x413.jpg

It sucks this happened, I'm sure the bad guys were hunkered down and firing from inside the building they naded. The unit choice has me confused, this is a British citizen, the SAS is in the area, but they went with Six over them and our other guys? Idk. Shit this sucks...
 

Laxmom723

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I'm just a Navy Mom, but whoever did the rescue attempt, I'm sure did their best.

If anyone screwed up and threw the wrong item, wouldn't we say in general, Murphy was along for the ride? Or the best plans don't survive the fog of war?

We never hear of all the successes, nor do we need to... but I'm sure this will be dissected in minute detail by those who need to do so, for future successes.

Prayers out for the men involved, that they know we appreciate, that they have our backs, 24/7/365.

And rest in peace Ms Norgrove.
 

Chopstick

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One day you're sniping off Somali pirates, the next day you're in the dog house. Im sure they put forth their best efforts.
 

The91Bravo

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It is very unfortunate that Ms Norgrove was killed, but I hope it can be determined that the frag was from the bad guys and not our guys. Prayers out to the families and warriors involved. With great responsibility comes great risk, and I also am sure they did their absolute best.
 

Scotth

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Nothing really to discuss in my eyes. It was a hostage rescue that had an unfortunate ending. It doesn't matter to me who threw the grenade when the mission was reported, the hostage is dead and who threw it doesn't change the final outcome.

I have all the confidence in the world those guys gave there best effort to get that women out alive. They put there asses on the line to help her. I wasn't there and the news reports are never going to fully recount what was happening in real time so how do I judge what was right or wrong. I'm sure they will have a very detailed AAR in the mission debrief and the pros can decide what the lessons learned from this rescue attempt should be and how they can be applied in future operations.
 

Mac_NZ

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What the fuck was she doing in the Korengal! The wake up call to leave should have been her friend getting waxed not long before hand. Dumb ass aid workers that think you can rock into a war zone with good intentions and a smile and no one will get it in their head to fuck your shit up.
 

AWP

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I can think of a few plausible reasons why this woman accidentally took a grenade and lost her life, to include the fact that she was, I don't know....surrounded by bad guys.

"We" (the Western population) have this Hollywood-esque view of black clad, pseudo-ninjas creeping into a room in the dead of night only to blow in the doors with enough pyro strong enough to destroy a tank yet made for a woman (her skin to withstand at least) and that view has raised our collective expectations to almost unreasonable levels. Numerous helos, 160+ guys on our side alone, a 30 minute firefight, compounds with no rhyme or reason to their shape or layout and no blueprints to consult....

You hate to brush aside the death of an innocent with a "shit happens" and a shrug, but sometimes the painful truth is that the good guys, no matter how well trained, equipped, and prepared, will sometimes simply lose a battle and fail to slay the dragon in time.

Blue Skies. My condolences to Ms. Norgrove's family and to those who tried to rescue her.
 

pardus

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What the fuck was she doing in the Korengal! The wake up call to leave should have been her friend getting waxed not long before hand. Dumb ass aid workers that think you can rock into a war zone with good intentions and a smile and no one will get it in their head to fuck your shit up.

Indeed! She had no right being there. Big boys rules.

This I am very interested in...

Yet members of the SAS, who were on standby for the operation, were understood to have had deep reservations about the rescue plan, fearing that the use of helicopters would simply have alerted the insurgents.

Jobs get fucked up just because they do sometimes but people also fuck up, I will be very interested to see what comes out of this.
 

HOLLiS

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Jobs get fucked up just because they do sometimes but people also fuck up, I will be very interested to see what comes out of this.



Also the other side is doing their damnedest to fuck up your plans. A general once said the first casualty of any operation is the battle plans. I think some folks think that real life is choreographed just like it is in the movies and all we need better script writers.
 

Diamondback 2/2

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Anyone know what SEAL team did the HR attempt? Were they set up for HR as a primary mission or have HR in their mission statement?

As for the raid, shit happens and nothing in HR is a 100%. I fully agree with FF statement of sometimes we win and sometimes they win, thats just part of the bad-guy/good-guy game.
 

dknob

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JAB, It's safe to assume the big boy SEALs rolled out. The thought that the SEALs were tasked with HR is almost as scary as the thought of giving A Ranger platoon the same task.
 

SpitfireV

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The chief of the UK Security Service had this to say a month or so ago...should provide a good discussion point if nothing else. Seems relevant to this.

10. It is interesting to note in this context that in the last ten years what might be called a "zero tolerance" attitude to terrorist risk in Great Britain has become more widespread. While it has always been the case that the authorities have made every effort to prevent terrorist attacks, it used to be accepted as part of everyday life that sometimes the terrorists would get lucky and there would be an attack. In recent years we appear increasingly to have imported from the American media the assumption that terrorism is 100% preventable and any incident that is not prevented is seen as a culpable government failure. This is a nonsensical way to consider terrorist risk and only plays into the hands of the terrorists themselves. Risk can be managed and reduced but it cannot realistically be abolished and if we delude ourselves that it can we are setting ourselves up for a nasty disappointment.
 
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8'Duece

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Recovery Operations/Hostage Rescue. These are operations conducted to search for, locate, identify, rescue, and return personnel, sensitive equipment, or items critical to national security. SO recovery missions are characterized by detailed planning, rehearsal, and thorough intelligence analysis. These operations employ unconventional tactics and techniques, clandestine search, possible indigenous assistance, and the frequent use of ground combat elements.

Think about it.
 

JimMCpog

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Anyone now what SEAL team did the HR attempt? Were they set up for HR as a primary mission or have HR in their mission statement?

As for the raid, shit happens and nothing in HR is a 100%. I fully agree with FF statement of sometimes we win and sometimes they win, thats just part of the bad-guy/good-guy game.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/12/world/europe/12hostage.html

If this NYT article is correct in identifying who was involved, it could have been the Navy's folks who normally deal in hostage rescue.

Alia Afshar-Ghandi, the American woman responsible for DAI's mission in eastern Afghanistan gave a short interview to NPR this afternoon and she said that DAI's mission in eastern Afghanistan will continue.
 
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