Most Valuable Weapons at the Squad/Squad+ Level

What's your pick?


  • Total voters
    29
On a purely fucking shit up level, I'm a fan of the Gustav.

For pouring hate, it's the MAG all day long. Throw it on a tripod in the SF role and you can reach out to 1800m. Sure it's a bit of a cunt to carry but with the right man behind a MAG, it can do serious damage.
 
I vote for the 240. My favorite. A little background on that: the 240 is the same as the British GPMG, as per Irish's video, above. The 240 is a bit more high speed then the GPMG because, as with all things, the US bought it and stuck a rail on it and some awesome high speed gear etc. The GPMG ("Gimpy" - pronounced with a J) has been around "forever". It was used in the Falklands in 1982. Back then, the deal was that in a Para Battalion, there was a machine-gun platoon which specialized in SF (Sustained Fire) use of the GPMG, using the tripod). At section (squad) level the GPMG (or "Gun") was carried in the dismounted role by a gun group of a N0. 1 and his No 2. Back then, the rest of the section was armed with the British SLR, which is the FN FAL. The gun was deployed to a flank while the riflemen carried out the assault.
With the advent of the SAW (Minimi) at British section level, there is less need for a 240. Each fireteam has a SAW. However, what I used to find useful is to either attach a two man gun group to an eight man section to beef up available firepower, or alternatively to have a gun group, possibly two, at platoon level. These gun groups can then be deployed to influence the battle. Nothing better than the beat of the "gimpy" going in as fire support.
Brit Paras were always sticklers for how the gun was carried. No sling over the neck, the sling could only be over one shoulder so the wepaon could be brought into action rapidly. The Gimpy was carried extensively dismounted on patrol.

All MAG's come with rails fitted now.

As for the Minimi and less of a need for the MAG, there was enough of a need for it that it's been put back into sections in the BA.
 
Between myself, yourself and Pardus we've managed to come up with three different ranges for a MAG in the SF role. :ROFLMAO:

Really? Had not picked that up. I have 800 meters light role, 1800 meters SF role direct fire, 2500 meter SF role map predicated....
 
Really? Had not picked that up. I have 800 meters light role, 1800 meters SF role direct fire, 2500 meter SF role map predicated....

show me your fire plan with dead spots, cover FPF's and FPL's.... gun placement and fall back positions.... show me that you can get clean 2500m LoF from a MG in any more than 10% of the situations where it is set up for SF in the current militaty situations.... were this battles in the Golan, the steppes or huge open fields.... maybe.... but in the current situation, not a textbook clean 1000m lines are difficult to find.... but I'm an end user, not a textbook expert....
 
show me your fire plan with dead spots, cover FPF's and FPL's.... gun placement and fall back positions.... show me that you can get clean 2500m LoF from a MG in any more than 10% of the situations where it is set up for SF in the current militaty situations.... were this battles in the Golan, the steppes or huge open fields.... maybe.... but in the current situation, not a textbook clean 1000m lines are difficult to find.... but I'm an end user, not a textbook expert....

That's just the book ranges. I think the map predicted range is interesting. I'm not a qualified machine gunner, apart form firing them light role. I am commenting from an "asset user" perspective. I was anti-armor at one point in Brit Mil. We used "MSGs" or mobile support groups of mixed anti-armor/MG groups. If I needed to know about technical capabilities, I asked the experts.

Helmand is an example of where this sort of long range capability can be/is/was employed. Thinking places like Kajaki Dam etc. Lots of open spaces covered by OPs on high round, that sort of thing. Can get some good "beaten zone" fire patterns down onto DFs, 'specially when the enemy tended to come from pretty much the same areas, which sould be considered the FLET.

Where MGs are mounted on vehicles, they are not SF mounted so you can't do the MPF stuff etc, but there were/prob still are a lot of long range engagements in Helmand. Green zone is a mixed close combat/"paddy/poppy field"/irrigation ditch/compound environment, but outside of that it can be long open ranges to enemy in and around compounds etc.
 
About the anti-armor thing and ranges: back when we had the MILAN, that had a max range of 1850 meters but was wire guided. When planning the battalion anti-armor defense plan and looking for defilade positions covering TAIs, it was a matter of planning around "goose eggs" drawn on a map board. Being wire guided, the MILAN could fire out to 1850, but had to have clear line of sight, which also included the 12 seconds it would take tracking the vehicle at maximum range. The goose eggs represented the kill areas to be covered by each firing post at a det location, and had to be amended for obstacles out in the killing areas. Having the Javelin makes the lives of current anti-armor planners so much easier....
 
2,500m with a 240??? That's ridiculous. How the hell would you observe that? You are looking for a beaten zone through a 4x optic at over 1.5 miles. I guess if your AG had a spotting scope this might be possible, but not with binos or the gun's optic. Tracer burn out occurs at 800m, which coincidentally is the Army's book answer for the point target range, range for an area target is 1,100m- both ranges are for the tripod mounted configuration.

Note- You foreigners have some strange terminology.
 
the 60mm fired without a pole set and baseplate is devastating out to about 300m with a good gunner... we had one guy on one of my teams that was a savant with it... and he sighted using the muzzle angle, not the sight... you should have seen his accuracy with a 203....

We had a guy in our company with a Charlie 60mm, base plate and a handle, king of like the one use on a old wood stove. He was pretty lethal with it.
 
I'm surprised to see the 40mm getting more votes than the Carl G, I guess it's because a lot more people have experience with the 40mm.
 
2,500m with a 240??? That's ridiculous. How the hell would you observe that? You are looking for a beaten zone through a 4x optic at over 1.5 miles. I guess if your AG had a spotting scope this might be possible, but not with binos or the gun's optic. Tracer burn out occurs at 800m, which coincidentally is the Army's book answer for the point target range, range for an area target is 1,100m- both ranges are for the tripod mounted configuration.

Note- You foreigners have some strange terminology.

Ridiculous? You've never heard of map predicted fire? You don't need to directly observe mortar fire either and the GPMG uses the same C2 sight and aiming posts.

There's more than one way to skin a cat!
 
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