Retention and Recruitment Crisis

[Topkick]

they are often not seen in the same light.

We were the good guys in WWII. Vietnam was in your living room and the media was doing what it does best now, shitting on America. I aways make it a point to tell the guy in the hat that I appreciate what he did in Vietnam.

 

[Devildoc]

We were the good guys in WWII. Vietnam was in your living room and the media was doing what it does best now, shitting on America. I aways make it a point to tell the guy in the hat that I appreciate what he did in Vietnam.

My wife and I do the same thing, now we see our kids doing it, too.

My son is interning for a small league, small town, small market summer league baseball team this summer. We went to see him this past weekend, on Sunday night the game was billed as "military appreciation night", so there were a LOT of people there in military stuff. When the announcer asked for vets to stand, looking around and seeing the volume of Korea and Vietnam vets and even a handful of WW2 vets (!), I became very small. These are the giants on whose shoulders we stand.

 

[ThunderHorse]

First in my family to serve. Parents eventually came around.

My very limited perspective is that it's constantly a debate between whether or not you explicitly appeal to those who come from those traditions you feel strongly about how the military should be wrong, or do you try to skim off more one-offs from backgrounds like myself who wouldn't otherwise consider joining. Even though I was very drawn by the tradition, camaraderie, and the desire to serve, I recognize that those aren't going to be selling points for a lot of people who didn't come from that sort of tradition.

Essentially, do you cast a wide net or drill deep?

We continue to cast a pretty wide net in recruiting, but generally the martial class has remained since the all volunteer force went into place. You have a few sub groups of that.

• Old Money where they want the son to serve a stint so they can butter up the resume for something and the family has a sense of service.
• Service Families
  • Officer Only Families
  • Enlisted Only Families
  • Officer and Enlister Families
• Poor and Lower Middle Class.

This has led to .45% of the population serving. But also force cuts has been a part of that. Not saying we need any make work projects but we cut so deep in our force reductions it takes us YEARS to add back two divisions worth of strength. So much IP is lost. Which is crazy because somehow we have more FOGOs than we did than WWII, we could talk about how we have way too many four stars and how our force structure is dumb. Which I think is a part of our problem today.

But we drill deep and cast a wide net, you just end up with the 99% of the same folks. Except for the people who we discuss in the self-identity thread, which I think actually wards people off from joining because that stuff does not help with increasing lethality and warfighting.

 

[RackMaster]

Go to Latvia to talk to the troops... lecture them on climate change. I bet young people will line up to enlist now.

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[amlove21]

"Why can't we keep people in?"

Uhhhh, maybe you can't balance a budget, you can't PCS folks, and you took away a shit ton of SRB?

Air Force cuts pay for toughest jobs, refuses to disclose details to spouses, public

 

[ThunderHorse]

"Why can't we keep people in?"

Uhhhh, maybe you can't balance a budget, you can't PCS folks, and you took away a shit ton of SRB?

Air Force cuts pay for toughest jobs, refuses to disclose details to spouses, public

Shitbird Brown said we'll lose talent because we won't confirm appointments. How about since we're going back to a peace time Army we get back to putting people in jobs that don't require appointment. There is no reason to retain ilk of the political class.

Also, how the hell do they cut pay? Or is this like the Hazardous duty pay portion?

 

[AWP]

"Why can't we keep people in?"

Uhhhh, maybe you can't balance a budget, you can't PCS folks, and you took away a shit ton of SRB?

Air Force cuts pay for toughest jobs, refuses to disclose details to spouses, public

I'm surprised the full list hasn't leaked.

 

[Box]

It's the moral equivalency approach to modern warfare - you start a war and then send a bunch of mother fuckers to their death - depopulation lightens the load on the environment - changes in global climate warning slow down - the rich folk get cleaner air and the poors all go to one place to die...
...its win win win

 

[Gunz]

Go to Latvia to talk to the troops... lecture them on climate change. I bet young people will line up to enlist now.

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He’s going to lecture both of them.

 

[RackMaster]

He’s going to lecture both of them.

All of them. They're pulling troops from Iraq to fill current spots in Latvia and now Trudeau wants to double the numbers. We'll have more troops there, than we had at the peak of Afghanistan.

 

[AWP]

All of them. They're pulling troops from Iraq to fill current spots in Latvia and now Trudeau wants to double the numbers. We'll have more troops there, than we had at the peak of Afghanistan.

You’re “aboot” to see a bunch of pregnant Latvians, eh?

 

[Teufel]

"Why can't we keep people in?"

Uhhhh, maybe you can't balance a budget, you can't PCS folks, and you took away a shit ton of SRB?

Air Force cuts pay for toughest jobs, refuses to disclose details to spouses, public

 

[RackMaster]

You’re “aboot” to see a bunch of pregnant Latvians, eh?

We've had a presence for year's now. I've heard there's a "handful" of kid's already.

I dont think it's going to be long before we announce a permanent presence and build a base.

 

[R.Caerbannog]

All of them. They're pulling troops from Iraq to fill current spots in Latvia and now Trudeau wants to double the numbers. We'll have more troops there, than we had at the peak of Afghanistan.

At least Latvian gals are feminine. Hell, they probably even know how to cook!

 

[Gunz]

Recruitment incentives had better be pretty good in peacetime. It'd take another 9/11 outrage for a big patriotic surge. And even if there's no outrage, it may take a chance to fight somewhere, anywhere, to bring numbers substantially up.

Young dudes want action. They want Call of Duty. Me and my bros volunteered for the most unpopular war ever because we wanted action. I'm 71, I'm still jonesing for action. I'd love a chance to shoot at Commies again.

So somebody start a war with Canada.

Sorry.

 

[Devildoc]

Recruitment incentives had better be pretty good in peacetime. It'd take another 9/11 outrage for a big patriotic surge. And even if there's no outrage, it may take a chance to fight somewhere, anywhere, to bring numbers substantially up.

Young dudes want action. They want Call of Duty. Me and my bros volunteered for the most unpopular war ever because we wanted action. I'm 71, I'm still jonesing for action. I'd love a chance to shoot at Commies again.

So somebody start a war with Canada.

Sorry.

Story told to me by a friend of my father, about my father:

Them: You had a tour in Vietnam you will likely have another.

Dad: Great! Send me back!

After second tour: You've had 2 tours, you're good.

Dad: No, send me back for three!

He would have gone for four if the war wasn't drawing down.

 

[RackMaster]

Recruitment incentives had better be pretty good in peacetime. It'd take another 9/11 outrage for a big patriotic surge. And even if there's no outrage, it may take a chance to fight somewhere, anywhere, to bring numbers substantially up.

Young dudes want action. They want Call of Duty. Me and my bros volunteered for the most unpopular war ever because we wanted action. I'm 71, I'm still jonesing for action. I'd love a chance to shoot at Commies again.

So somebody start a war with Canada.

Sorry.

I'll put the celebration beer on ice and start the fire for dinner.

 

[Marauder06]

What are you all making of this?

Biden authorizes military to use up to 3,000 reserve troops to augment US forces in Europe

President Biden on Thursday authorized the Pentagon to tap up to 3,000 reservists for deployment to Europe to augment U.S. troops there in support of Operation Atlantic Resolve.

A couple of things to consider:
-1.3M active-duty US troops
-50,000+ US troops already in "Europe," not counting the thousands that go back and forth on exercises and deployments to places like Latvia and Poland.
-750M Europeans
...and still the US needs to call up thousands of Reservists?

In no way am I disparaging the IRR or Reserves, but... are we really that strained on active-duty manpower that we have to resort to this? The last time I remember mass mobilization of Reserves we got into two wars that lasted 20+ years, and we lost one of them decisively, and the other more-or-less.

Thoughts?

 

[Devildoc]

I am not high on this. In the Navy there are a lot of people in IRR that have niche jobs; ones that aren't usually needed for peacetime service, but desirable in wartime. Some of the staff corps jobs are like this, ask me how I know.

I remember when this happened during Iraq, I knew a few people get recalled who were very much out of standards. Not casting shadow, either. You get out, you don't think you'll wear a uni again, you stop PTing, you gain weight. No judgment here. So these guys got recalled, ordered back into uniform (in which they looked awful), given a shitload of shots, put on a plane.

 

[Box]

Are we just building up to do a war?
It looks like we are trying to do a war.
I think we should just do a war.