Retention and Recruitment Crisis

AWP said:
I posed that same question awhile ago. I think it was @TLDR20 who answered and IIRC SF doesn't revoke tabs for conduct after you leave the Army.
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Yeah, I don't see how you take his tab away. It's an achievement, even if he douched out after leaving the military. I don't have a dog in the hunt but once someone achieves something you can't really take it back, can you?
 
Devildoc said:
Or Trident or any of the Gucci badges. I know the communities can, I don't know that they do.
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I can see community disassociation, but you can't deny the achievement. If I'm out of the service, have orders and a certificate of completion, I'm using it on a resume. Being a dick doesn't erase accomplishment.

ie....

o Completed Special Forces training.
o Awarded the Special Forces tab.
 
Topkick said:
Yeah, I don't see how you take his tab away. It's an achievement, even if he douched out after leaving the military. I don't have a dog in the hunt but once someone achieves something you can't really take it back, can you?
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Box said:
Think of all the folks that have douched out after leaving service - I have never heard of anyone actually losing their tab post-service.
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I mean how could they take it? For instance, I am not a retiree, I am not subject to recall. I have a DD-214 that says what it says. How could they take my tab?
 
Topkick said:
I can see community disassociation, but you can't deny the achievement. If I'm out of the service, have orders and a certificate of completion, I'm using it on a resume. Being a dick doesn't erase accomplishment.

ie....

o Completed Special Forces training.
o Awarded the Special Forces tab.
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TLDR20 said:
I mean how could they take it? For instance, I am not a retiree, I am not subject to recall. I have a DD-214 that says what it says. How could they take my tab?
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Yes, I agree. I see being PNG'd, that happens. And it should. I see being kicked out of the community. But finishing a school and being awarded the merit badge for doing so, the deed is done, the scribe has written, I don't think it right to 'un-do' that.
 
TLDR20 said:
I mean how could they take it? For instance, I am not a retiree, I am not subject to recall. I have a DD-214 that says what it says. How could they take my tab?
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AR 600-8-2, paragraph 1-32, says that the SF tab may be revoked, for among other reasons, if a Soldier...

1709650518795.png

I did not do a close reading of the reg and there may be a provision stipulating what can and cannot be done to people who have retired or separated. However, a plain reading of the reg makes it clear that it could happen, regardless of whether or not someone is currently service. I don't know of any cases where this has been done, but this is also not something I follow closely.

Regarding Murphy, I think a case can clearly be made that he falls into the above category, especially the way he trashed SGM RItter and flat out refused to rectify it. But as much as I would like to see him stripped of his tab, I worry about the precedence it would set and how it would be politicized if the Army started doing it to people who are no longer in the service.
 
Marauder06 said:
AR 600-8-2, paragraph 1-32, says that the SF tab may be revoked, for among other reasons, if a Soldier...

View attachment 44187

I did not do a close reading of the reg and there may be a provision stipulating what can and cannot be done to people who have retired or separated. However, a plain reading of the reg makes it clear that it could happen, regardless of whether or not someone is currently service. I don't know of any cases where this has been done, but this is also not something I follow closely.

Regarding Murphy, I think a case can clearly be made that he falls into the above category, especially the way he trashed SGM RItter and flat out refused to rectify it. But as much as I would like to see him stripped of his tab, I worry about the precedence it would set and how it would be politicized if the Army started doing it to people who are no longer in the service.
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Yeah. I don’t think AR’s apply to former SM’s.
 
TLDR20 said:
Yeah. I don’t think AR’s apply to former SM’s.
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I think they would have to have commited a serious enough crime to be recalled to duty for prosecution, and then revoking awards could be part of the punishment. Even then, you can't ever change the fact that he earned the award, but maybe just say he can't ever wear it.
 
The tab is just an award - the school is an evaluated training event. The military can revoke awards as they please - just like they can upgrade awards decades (or even lifetimes) after an event transpires.
-Awarded the CoolSchool Tab means nothing on a resume

-Graduated from Cool School means just that - GRADUATED- from cool school. Getting mad and going to the SWC Cdr behind closed doors and revoking a tab is just for show once you leave service. If the USN takes away a Trident because a SEAL ran around yelling "I fucking shot bin Laden"
"...bin Laden; bin Laden - get your fucking ass out here"

Oh, you wanna revoke his Bird ??
Pfft - doesnt matter - because "everybody up in here knows that hes the guy that shot bin Laden"
 
TLDR20 said:
Yeah. I don’t think AR’s apply to former SM’s.
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Topkick said:
I think they would have to have commited a serious enough crime to be recalled to duty for prosecution, and then revoking awards could be part of the punishment. Even then, you can't ever change the fact that he earned the award, but maybe just say he can't ever wear it.
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Can you recall someone to service who is not retired, and not in any kind of inactive reserve?
 
Marauder06 said:
Do you know that for sure or are you speculating?



Yes.
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I don’t. I am speculating and legitimately asking.

However, I do not think the military has any ability( for misconduct not committed in the service) to pull you back into service once your obligation is over. That being your entire obligation. From what I read, only retirees are subject to involuntary recall.
 
Topkick said:
If a soldier commits a crime/ misconduct while still active but then ETS's before getting caught, he can be involuntarily recalled to active duty to be court- martialed. It's happened.
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Right. This is not what we are talking about.
 

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