Women in Combat Arms/ SOF Discussion

[policemedic]

Why? 1st female Army infantry officer assigned to Ranger training battalion

Out of curiosity, do you have a Ranger tab?

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

When was a conventional unit doing 25 mile rucks?

I don't see that being doable for even 20% of the conventional folks I've worked with. Out of the people I work with who have completed rucks that length or longer as part of selection, most of us would not be able to do it regularly without specifically training for it.

25 miler is a standard light infantry deal. I doubt many units have done it over the last 15 years due to deployment tempo operational environment. But yeah, OSUT used to have the bayonet march (25 miles and 5 missions). 10th Mtn had an annual 100 mile march in 4 days, and just about every light unit did monthly 12's and quarterly 25's.

 

[Etype]

25 miler is a standard light infantry deal. I doubt many units have done it over the last 15 years due to deployment...

I don't know why deployments would stop them from happening, if anything, deployments should make you train harder.

Never did I hear of, or witness anything close to a 25 mile ruck in the 82nd. Sicily DZ back to the division area is only 10ish miles.

Not saying they never happened, they just haven't happened any time recently that I know of.

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

I don't know why deployments would stop them from happening, if anything, deployments should make you train harder.

Well I think commanders were trying to get a handle on the whole COIN thing and train their troops to meet that mission vs being dropped into an areas and moving long distances to contact.

And besides, unless you were doing some snoop-n-poop type mission, there hasn't been much need for rucking long distances during the GWOT.

Ever hear of Patton's ghost army?

 

[Ranger Psych]

Can't remember, but I'm guessing by your statement about not rucking, that you didn't do afghanistan at all?

We walked. Alot. Even with dedicated platoon vehicles.

 

[Etype]

Well I think commanders were trying to get a handle on the whole COIN thing and train their troops to meet that mission vs being dropped into an areas and moving long distances to contact.

And besides, unless you were doing some snoop-n-poop type mission, there hasn't been much need for rucking long distances during the GWOT.

Ever hear of Patton's ghost army?

Can't remember, but I'm guessing by your statement about not rucking, that you didn't do afghanistan at all?

We walked. Alot. Even with dedicated platoon vehicles.

I don't know much about Patton, but I do remember walking all over Afghanistan.

 

[TLDR20]

25 miler is a standard light infantry deal. I doubt many units have done it over the last 15 years due to deployment tempo operational environment. But yeah, OSUT used to have the bayonet march (25 miles and 5 missions). 10th Mtn had an annual 100 mile march in 4 days, and just about every light unit did monthly 12's and quarterly 25's.

The Bayonet March is 12 miles.

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

The Bayonet March is 12 miles.

It was 25 when I did it in 2002, 12miler was the stairway to heaven as I recall. I think we did a 15 miler in-between the 12 and 25, but its been awhile.

I don't know much about Patton, but I do remember walking all over Afghanistan.

I didn't do Afghanistan, most of my infantry buddies that did said their movements were fairly short (couple kilometers) and not under heavy ruck. Alot of nasty terrain patrolling from what I was told. I'm sure your experience was very different.

Can't remember, but I'm guessing by your statement about not rucking, that you didn't do afghanistan at all?

We walked. Alot. Even with dedicated platoon vehicles.

No I didn't do Afghanistan, but have heard horror stories of the stuff the Rangers did in the beginning of that war (as far as living conditions, movement's, charging enemy infested mountains, etc). I was not meaning to talk about what SF or the Rangers did (as I obviously wouldn't know) especially in the beginning of OEF. I was talking more of the light infantry units that have been deployed to OIF/OEF and why rucking hasn't been at the forefront of those units, or at least wasn't a training priority for awhile.

 

[Ranger Psych]

Well, part of actually having a valid presence in an area is patrolling the area... and going to the places, even if it's a 12 mile march with a few thousand foot elevation gain. If you can get there, they can get there... so you gotta get there if for no other reason than to prove there's nowhere safe in the area for them, and the locals now know you can and will come out there if they do happen to share information.

Just occupying a MSS/FOB/whatever doesn't honestly establish a presence to ward off the enemy. It establishes a stationary target FOR the enemy.

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

Well, part of actually having a valid presence in an area is patrolling the area... and going to the places, even if it's a 12 mile march with a few thousand foot elevation gain. If you can get there, they can get there... so you gotta get there if for no other reason than to prove there's nowhere safe in the area for them, and the locals now know you can and will come out there if they do happen to share information.

Just occupying a MSS/FOB/whatever doesn't honestly establish a presence to ward off the enemy. It establishes a stationary target FOR the enemy.

I agree 100%.

 

[Teufel]

25 miler is a standard light infantry deal. I doubt many units have done it over the last 15 years due to deployment tempo operational environment. But yeah, OSUT used to have the bayonet march (25 miles and 5 missions). 10th Mtn had an annual 100 mile march in 4 days, and just about every light unit did monthly 12's and quarterly 25's.

The Marine Corps used to require infantry battalions to conduct a 25 mile ruck march (with full combat load to include crew serve weapons) before being certified deployment ready. The 25 miler was the culminating event in the Marine Corps Combat Readiness Evaluation (MCCRE). I don't know if they still do it or not. It was not uncommon for battalions to ruck march from Camp Pendleton to 29 Palms which is around 175 miles. Don't ask me why, that sounds like a terrible idea.

 

[Marine0311]

The Marine Corps used to require infantry battalions to conduct a 25 mile ruck march (with full combat load to include crew serve weapons) before being certified deployment ready. The 25 miler was the culminating event in the Marine Corps Combat Readiness Evaluation (MCCRE). I don't know if they still do it or not. It was not uncommon for battalions to ruck march from Camp Pendleton to 29 Palms which is around 175 miles. Don't ask me why, that sounds like a terrible idea.

SIR YES SIR. RUCKING IS FUN SIR.


edit for spelling. Well played free.

 

[AWP]

SIR YES SIR. TUCKING IS FUN SIR

This man certainly agrees.

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

It puts the lotion on its skin!

 

[Devildoc]

The Marine Corps used to require infantry battalions to conduct a 25 mile ruck march (with full combat load to include crew serve weapons) before being certified deployment ready. The 25 miler was the culminating event in the Marine Corps Combat Readiness Evaluation (MCCRE). I don't know if they still do it or not. It was not uncommon for battalions to ruck march from Camp Pendleton to 29 Palms which is around 175 miles. Don't ask me why, that sounds like a terrible idea.

I don't know if they still do it but units in Oki would hump down Oki. My longest was 35ish miles, was told to hump the entire 115 miles from Bridgeport to Reno, but miraculously (CYA? Risk management? Don't know) motor T showed up and we rode the rest of the way. We were supposed to do it for "training" (read: punishment) for transgressions in Bridgeport. I recall the 25 mile pre-deployment humps.

 

[Etype]

We need to start discussing time standards along with these distances.

 

[DA SWO]

We need to start discussing time standards along with these distances.

Not SFAS timing, pretty much assured.
More like a 20 min mile.

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

Not SFAS timing, pretty much assured.
More like a 20 min mile.

20 min mile is really damn slow, I don't know if I have ever rucked that slow. Generally what eats up the time on long hauls, is taking breaks, but I would agree you are not kicking it out. But 20 minute mile, is it even possible to walk that slow?

 

[DocIllinois]

20 min mile is really damn slow, I don't know if I have ever gone rucked that slow. Generally what eats up the time on long hauls, is taking breaks, but I would agree you are not kicking it out. But 20 minute mile, is it even possible to walk that slow?

Have you ever seen a Guard support unit ruck marching?

 

[Diamondback 2/2]

Have you ever seen a Guard support unit ruck marching?

The only time I've ever seen anyone other than infantry/SOF with a ruck, they were carrying it to a truck. So no I haven't, but really 20 minute mile pace?