The ACA/ Obamacare Website Fiasco Thread

[JHD]

I don't know if it has been posted already (I don't remember seeing it), but a statistic I read today from the NRSC said that under Obamacare, the number of people that lost their healthcare coverage under Obamacare is greater than the population of Chicago. Holy cow, if true. I knew it was a lot, but that puts it in perspective.

 

[Chopstick]

I found out my brother was one of them. He just got a notice 2 days ago. Interestingly, his was an employer furnished policy. In order to keep his policy as it stands, it would only be 2k a month.

 

[TLDR20]

I found out my brother was one of them. He just got a notice 2 days ago. Interestingly, his was an employer furnished policy. In order to keep his policy as it stands, it would only be 2k a month.

2K a month in premiums? How much was he paying before?

 

[Chopstick]

$478.00 a month for a family of 5.

 

[TLDR20]

$478.00 a month for a family of 5.

Must have had a pretty terrible plan. I pay 400 a month for myself.

 

[JHD]

Must have had a pretty terrible plan. I pay 400 a month for myself.

My issue with that is that if he was happy with his plan and didn't want to change he shouldn't have to, and he shouldn't be dropped from his existing plan. With a family of five, maybe that plan was cost effective for him. With a family of five, $20,000 more a year is a pretty large expense to absorb.

 

[TLDR20]

My issue with that is that if he was happy with his plan and didn't want to change he shouldn't have to, and he shouldn't be dropped from his existing plan. With a family of five, maybe that plan was cost effective for him. With a family of five, $20,000 more a year is a pretty large expense to absorb.

Yeah well when one of those kids gets sick and they have a deductible of 50 grand, or if they go over what is covered who ends up footing that bill again? This isn't directed at chops brother, but anyone who has terrible insurance. If you think you aren't paying for those people who have 3 kids and a low premium now you are kidding yourself.

Please don't talk to me about how you know someone who pays their bills or how "I payed off over years" whatever, most people don't. They have an accident then get disability and Medicare, and if that still doesn't cover it they declare bankruptcy and in the end everyone pays the price anyways.

 

[Chopstick]

Actually, they had quite a nice plan.

 

[Chopstick]

Regarding the "fix"
http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2013/11/1...derwriters-on-the-fix-this-is-a-new-insanity/

I just spoke with David Oscar, the communications chair for the New Jersey Association of Health Underwriters and a partner at Altigro Financial Group. He had this to say regarding President Obama’s attempt to offer a one-year restoration of canceled plans:

This a new insanity.


I do not know how the insurance carriers and federal government are going to be dealing with this. First, many states require a 60-day notice of a change in plan or a cancellation. It’s November 15! How can they comply with this new element of federal law, and with their state laws?

Second, do they really think carriers are going to be willing to recreate the old plans, while also being mandated to offer the new ones that comply with the exchanges? I have a large number of clients, small to medium-sized businesses, who would much rather renew their old policies on 12/1 than sign up with the newly mandated exchange policies. Everyone is going to want the old ones! You really expect the insurance carriers to willingly deal with the financial loss and legal headaches of switching back?

It is going to be very difficult for carriers to honor this.

And is it even legal? This is the same question I had about Obama delaying the employer mandate.

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2013/11/14/howard-dean-is-obamas-fix-even-legal/

DEAN: “I’ll keep it short because i can talk forever for health care. A, I wonder if he had the legal authority to do this since it’s a congressional bill that set it up.”

 

[TLDR20]

Actually, they had quite a nice plan.

I find that very very difficult to believe. Here is what is listed on blue cross blue shield for a family of 5 and a household income of 100K, that is two middle income jobs. The highest premium listed, with ZERO deductible is 1138 dollars a month. However that is the Bentley of packages(25 dollar co pay, 0 prescription drug costs, and 0 deductible). There are packages with a 1-3K deductible that run about 500 dollars a month.

So once again, 2K a month just doesn't add up.

 

[JHD]

Yeah well when one of those kids gets sick and they have a deductible of 50 grand, or if they go over what is covered who ends up footing that bill again? This isn't directed at chops brother, but anyone who has terrible insurance. If you think you aren't paying for those people who have 3 kids and a low deductible now you are kidding yourself.

Please don't talk to me about how you know someone who pays their bills or how "I payed off over years" whatever, most people don't. They have an accident then get disability and Medicare, and if that still doesn't cover it they declare bankruptcy and in the end everyone pays the price anyways.

I hear what you are saying, but the insurance business is all about playing the odds. And if those people with affordable insurance want that insurance because that $2,000 extra per month is their rent or mortgage payment, they shouldn't be forced into something that isn't right for their family. A lot of people choose to play the odds that they won't need a Mazerati insurance plan, but will be happy with a much less expensive plan, as luckily, most people don't have catastrophic illnesses strike. Yes, some will, but most won't. And for those people where insurance can't exceed a certain amount per month, they shouldn't be forced into a plan to cover things they most likely won't need.

I don't disagree with you that we end up paying for those who might not be adequately covered if there is a catastrophic incident. But I would much rather help cover an occasional incident, rather than help cover everyone for insurance they are paying too much for to begin with. Instead of paying to fix a hemmorage, we will be dying a death of a thousand cuts.

 

[Chopstick]

I find that very very difficult to believe. Here is what is listed on blue cross blue shield for a family of 5 and a household income of 100K, that is two middle income jobs. The highest premium listed, with ZERO deductible is 1138 dollars a month. However that is the Bentley of packages(25 dollar co pay, 0 prescription drug costs, and 0 deductible). There are packages with a 1-3K deductible that run about 500 dollars a month.

So once again, 2K a month just doesn't add up.

The company my brother has(had) is through Health America HMOof PA. I do not know what if anything his employer paid toward the policy now vs in the future, but I saw his cancellation letter. To retain the benefits he had, starting Jan 1, 2014 his payment would increase to 2k PER month. I dont question my brother as to his household expenses ect but I can tell you in the last year there was a tonsil removal on one kid, a broken arm for another and an appendectomy on the third child. Never once did he complain of any deductibles or any related health care expenses. In fact, this is the first time in our lives we have ever discussed our health insurance coverage with one another. So basically if you are calling me or my brother a liar that is simply way off the mark. I am very upset on his behalf. I never dreamed he would be one of the nearly 4 million people that got that cancellation letter this year.

 

[TLDR20]

The company my brother has(had) is through Health America HMOof PA. I do not know what if anything his employer paid toward the policy now vs in the future, but I saw his cancellation letter. To retain the benefits he had, starting Jan 1, 2014 his payment would increase to 2k PER month. I dont question my brother as to his household expenses ect but I can tell you in the last year there was a tonsil removal on one kid, a broken arm for another and an appendectomy on the third child. Never once did he complain of any deductibles or any related health care expenses. In fact, this is the first time in our lives we have ever discussed our health insurance coverage with one another. So basically if you are calling me or my brother a liar that is simply way off the mark. I am very upset on his behalf. I never dreamed he would be one of the nearly 4 million people that got that cancellation letter this year.

I'm not calling you a liar, but maybe you and your brother need to look at all available options rather than just saying your getting fucked, and you have to pay 2K more per month. Nobody is going to make him pay 2K a month, and as I said earlier plans are available that are enormously cheaper than 2400+ dollars.

 

[Chopstick]

But again, he was happy with his plan, with the payment and the benefits. I just think it is crazy that the government is telling people what is best for us. What is going to be next? How would you feel if suddenly your Tricare thinks it is better for you to have a 2k policy instead of what you have now? Never say never.
And just because Obama so benevolently said today on TV that he is granting that we subjects may keep our plans for another year is going to make it so. I question the legality of this without Congressional approval. Although that has never stopped Obama before.
http://blogs.marketwatch.com/health...-obamacare-fix-but-one-insurer-is-ok-with-it/

The insurance commissioner for Washington state, Mike Kreidler, says he won’t allow carriers in his jurisdiction to continue offering the individual health policies next year that they offered this year. Kreidler, a Democrat, says he has “serious concerns” about how Obama’s proposal to allow insurers to keep offering the same plans would affect the stability of the insurance market, echoing statements from carriers themselves that the idea could backfire.

 

[AWP]

It doesn't matter what the plan cost or the deductible or anything...."if you like your plan you can keep your plan." Right? The whole point of the ACA was to bring people up, not tear them down.

When does it get better?

 

[DA SWO]

Must have had a pretty terrible plan. I pay 400 a month for myself.

:-/

So a crappy plan at 4x the cost suddenly becomes a good plan?

 

[Chopstick]

:-/

So a crappy plan at 4x the cost suddenly becomes a good plan?

It was actually an excellent plan. He has told me since his company has less the 50 employees the employer chose to take the penalty rather than pay their portion of the premiums. Works out much cheaper for the company in the long run. Merry Christmas.
Not sure what if anything today's House vote will do for them.

 

[Blizzard]

 

[Chopstick]

Chicago Tribune throws down ....again. Ouch.
http://my.chicagotribune.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-78189619/

On some level, then, the president plainly agrees with critics of Obamacare, this page included, that the law needs to be rewritten: He and his administration keep rewriting its major components — remember the mandate that sizable employers offer coverage in 2014? — as practicalities and politics demand.

But in this country we don't change bad laws by presidential fiat. We change them by having Congress rewrite them or by starting from scratch. Obama doesn't want to reopen this law for fear that Republicans and some Democrats will substantially rewrite it. But that's what has to happen.

We understand why the president and leaders of his party want to rescue whatever they can of Obamacare. On their watch, official Washington has blown the launch of a new entitlement program ... under the schedule they alone set in early 2010.

What we don't understand is their reluctance to give that failure more than lip service. Many of the Americans who heard their president say Thursday that "we fumbled the rollout of this health care law" would have been pleased to hear him add: So we're admitting it. This law is a bust. We're starting over.

 

[TLDR20]

Chicago Tribune throws down ....again. Ouch.
http://my.chicagotribune.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-78189619/

The author makes good points, I think they could stand to go back to the drawing board.