ThunderHorse
Verified Military
Russia leveled cities. 1.5 Million total seems kinda low.
Ukraine - Russia Conflict
- Thread starter pardus
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Devildoc
Verified Military
I get real nervous with manufactured intelligence: 50% of the city with 50% damage, let's assume 33% cas rate, buff up 10%, a family of four can't live on top of a pizza restaurant, can they?.... "Sir, we have those casually numbers for you."
I agree about numbers sounding low, but without better data not sure how you tighten the numbers.
ThunderHorse
Verified Military
Well, I'm gonna bring assumptions down because. Ukrainian newspaper cites 170kish.
What is the death toll of Russia’s war in Ukraine?
I haven't seen any overall estimates from those organizations, but the UN suspects civilian casualties to be higher than 46,000 ( over 13,000 killed ) since they have trouble verifying in contested and occupied areas. For example at Mariupol 1,348 deaths were confirmed, but according to the UN, there could be thousands more. So to be fair, its basically unknown.
Despite the fact that around 4.5 million people returned, there are still over 8,6 million who are refugees or internally displaced.
Currently 3,7 million are IDPs and among them nearly 2 million from the occupied territories. A year ago, it was estimated that 6 million people lived under Russian occupation. Conditions were catastrophic, with food shortages and severe human rights violations happening. From theft to arbitrary kidnappings, torture and murder. On top of all the shelling. Nearly a quarter million residential buildings are claimed to have been destroyed or damaged.
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BLUF: trust those numbers at your own peril because they predate Trump.
People beating up Trump for his numerical claims…just America being America.
The US was claiming 500k back in 2023 and Lloyd Austin once quoted 750k, while the Red Cross and UN are citing much lower numbers. Trump is quoting baseline stats we created when Biden was in office. Take those numbers, tack on growth along a curve since Trump took over…lazy math.
That said, relying on numbers produced by Sleepy Joe’s crew is an L, but Trump didn’t start high casualty counts which ran counter to most of the world’s estimates.
People beating up Trump for his numerical claims…just America being America.
The US was claiming 500k back in 2023 and Lloyd Austin once quoted 750k, while the Red Cross and UN are citing much lower numbers. Trump is quoting baseline stats we created when Biden was in office. Take those numbers, tack on growth along a curve since Trump took over…lazy math.
That said, relying on numbers produced by Sleepy Joe’s crew is an L, but Trump didn’t start high casualty counts which ran counter to most of the world’s estimates.
Really I think its just a misuse of terms / honest mistake. I had it in the past when people thought casualties simply meant deaths. That's probably what the fuss was about. Otherwise he is right. Even conservative estimates put the casualties at over a million at this point.
When you look at the number of confirmed deaths alone, they stand at over 200,000. Usually there would be many times more wounded right. Its an absolute tragedy.
When you look at the number of confirmed deaths alone, they stand at over 200,000. Usually there would be many times more wounded right. Its an absolute tragedy.
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Devildoc
Verified Military
Civilian deaths and casualties are generally around 45, 47% of combined numbers, but surge higher in urban areas.
IDK man, the dude very rarely uses hyperbole when he speaks. (This is a joke).
I honestly don't understand this line of reasoning- there are millions of casualties, we know the numbers aren't accurate (cause it's war), but the beef here is literally a semantic one to prove... what? Like- what's the actual point of fact checking the word he used?
Are you saying "the Russia/Ukraine conflict isn't as bad as he made it out to be?" Are you saying "Orange Man Wrong!" and you can't believe anything he says? Or are you just saying "He said a wrong thing and I refuse to let a politician say a wrong thing in public without me providing context?" If this last one is true, I can send you a couple quotes about Trump LiTeRaLlY being Hitler or that men can become women if they think about it really hard.
CNN did this for like 6 straight years and have their lowest ratings to date because the last example above just doesn't play anymore.
ETA- clarification, I am using the royal "you", @Gordus not the specific "you". I think your read of all of this is pretty dead on.
hahah I do not. At all. You pay for your ticket and you ride the ride, he gets everything he deserves.
Now does he get more than he deserves? I think yes. But do I feel bad for him? No. Is the "ask and answer to yourself" rhetorical device annoying? Yes. Will I stop using it? No.
