Back to the Shadows NSW??

[Gunz]

Imagine how different lives would be today.

Remember the "cease fire" the Afghans pulled off with AQ/Taliban? That was another bad idea our people got sucked into. The ruse that covered the retreat into the North West Frontier. That's when Tommy and Donny should've called bullshit and sent the Rangers in.

I wonder.....if we had iced UBL and his top dogs then, would we have put so much expense in time, money and lives, into nation-building?

 

[256]

Remember the "cease fire" the Afghans pulled off with AQ/Taliban? That was another bad idea our people got sucked into. The ruse that covered the retreat into the North West Frontier. That's when Tommy and Donny should've called bullshit and sent the Rangers in.

I wonder.....if we had iced UBL and his top dogs then, would we have put so much expense in time, money and lives, into nation-building?

I offen wonder the same thing. The United States needs to cease trying to talk with the Taliban. They’ve proved over and over they aren’t interested in helping to make a stabilized Afghanistan (like that’s possible anyways). The Taliban and its affiliates are the enemy of the US, less time talking, more time destroying them. I’ll give President Obama credit for his never ending Predator missile program and the nuts to go into Pakistan to get UBL with that backing of American military might to protect them (at least from what I’ve read).

 

[AWP]

I wonder.....if we had iced UBL and his top dogs then, would we have put so much expense in time, money and lives, into nation-building?

Yes, there's not a doubt in my mind.

 

[DA SWO]

One of the greatest blunders in recent warfare: the Franks/Rumsfeld failure to send a Ranger blocking force east of Tora Bora.

I blame Rummy more then I blame Franks.

 

[DozerB]

Marcinko started it all with his book “rogue warrior” and promoted a culture of the elite cowboy who battled the rules and the close minded system to get the job done.

Much like the autobiography where the E-5 takes on 3-Star generals and “sets them straight” and “tells it how it is” and, amazingly, is always right, in 100% of the scenarios, it is just a totally stale and played out narrative.
But I’d have to imagine that after decades of telling yourself and your teammates that orders and directives and ROEs are really just “head-shed political correctness BS,” and that the man on the ground is always right, regardless of his actions, there are inevitably going to be some ethical failures.

Side note, and lesson for the young guys: being a Rogue Warrior is only cool if you don’t actually end up in prison.

 

[Marauder06]

Much like the autobiography where the E-5 takes on 3-Star generals and “sets them straight” and “tells it how it is” and, amazingly, is always right, in 100% of the scenarios, it is just a totally stale and played out narrative.
But I’d have to imagine that after decades of telling yourself and your teammates that orders and directives and ROEs are really just “head-shed political correctness BS,” and that the man on the ground is always right, regardless of his actions, there are inevitably going to be some ethical failures.

Side note, and lesson for the young guys: being a Rogue Warrior is only cool if you don’t actually end up in prison.

PREACH

 

[Teufel]

Much like the autobiography where the E-5 takes on 3-Star generals and “sets them straight” and “tells it how it is” and, amazingly, is always right, in 100% of the scenarios, it is just a totally stale and played out narrative.
But I’d have to imagine that after decades of telling yourself and your teammates that orders and directives and ROEs are really just “head-shed political correctness BS,” and that the man on the ground is always right, regardless of his actions, there are inevitably going to be some ethical failures.

Side note, and lesson for the young guys: being a Rogue Warrior is only cool if you don’t actually end up in prison.

You are very correct in your analysis. I will add that the man on the ground is not always right. Often, he or she is actually wrong. Commanders have to trust and empower the man on the ground, however, because you can’t lead a battle through the lens of a predator feed. That’s the not the same thing as saying that the man on the ground is always right and infallible. You aren’t right, for example, if you can’t comprehend why the mission, commander’s intent, and ROE are necessary to achieve the commanders desired endstate. Otherwise you’re just left with a bunch of tactical victories, and a slew of operational and strategic failures. I suppose that kind of sums up the reality TV show drama that NSW is living right now.

 

[Teufel]

Much like the autobiography where the E-5 takes on 3-Star generals and “sets them straight” and “tells it how it is” and, amazingly, is always right, in 100% of the scenarios, it is just a totally stale and played out narrative.
But I’d have to imagine that after decades of telling yourself and your teammates that orders and directives and ROEs are really just “head-shed political correctness BS,” and that the man on the ground is always right, regardless of his actions, there are inevitably going to be some ethical failures.

Side note, and lesson for the young guys: being a Rogue Warrior is only cool if you don’t actually end up in prison.

I saw this on Facebook today. Teufel cannot confirm or deny ever saying this piece of FAKE NEWS.

 

[CQB]

How? What did they do to stem the tide?

Off the top of my head they legislated.

 

[Ooh-Rah]

...This is AWESOME....

Remember when this used to be true? Me either.

 

[CDG]

LMAO.

"If I'm in a bar with a bunch of SEALs, will I know it?" Fucking Helen Keller and Stevie Wonder's lovechild would know it.

 

[256]

You are very correct in your analysis. I will add that the man on the ground is not always right. Often, he or she is actually wrong. Commanders have to trust and empower the man on the ground, however, because you can’t lead a battle through the lens of a predator feed. That’s the not the same thing as saying that the man on the ground is always right and infallible. You aren’t right, for example, if you can’t comprehend why the mission, commander’s intent, and ROE are necessary to achieve the commanders desired endstate. Otherwise you’re just left with a bunch of tactical victories, and a slew of operational and strategic failures. I suppose that kind of sums up the reality TV show drama that NSW is living right now.

Seems to follow the direction of our youth these days, no?

 

[Teufel]

Not the young Marines I work with. Especially the ones under my command. They get it.

 

[256]

Not the young Marines I work with. Especially the ones under my command. They get it.

I truly believe it’s because the strength of the Leadership in the Corps. I saw it in US Army world, conventional Army Infantry units are a world a part from the support ranks. The Corps seems to have that throughout their ranks.

 

[Devildoc]

@Ooh-Rah , that was awesome.

It reminds me of that old joke: a crossfitter, a vegan, and a Navy SEAL walk into a bar. How do you know? Because they all tell you.

 

[CDG]

@Ooh-Rah , that was awesome.

It reminds me of that old joke: a crossfitter, a vegan, and a Navy SEAL walk into a bar. How do you know? Because they all tell you.

False. They don't have to tell you because it's emblazoned on their hats, shirts, and board shorts. Plus the SEAL and CFer have prominent tattoos lest you remain unconvinced.

 

[Gunz]

The East Coast SEALs used to be at Little Creek in Virginia and I'd guess they are still there. I know that because the quonset hut I lived in was right next to the SEAL/UDT quonset huts, and we used to try and out-PT them. We were there running fam-fire exercises and squad organic weapons demos for bussed in midshipmen from USNA. This was in the days before the Frogmen had Oakleys, hair gel and book deals.

 

[DozerB]

Not the young Marines I work with. Especially the ones under my command. They get it.

I woke up yesterday thinking, “how should I spend my Memorial Day?”

Thankfully, just as I said it, almost like a divine gift, “The Operator” appeared on Fox News to lecture America about the proper way to honor his friends (the ones he has made millions of dollars off of).

Because (kinda, maybe) shooting UBL (possibly) gives you moral authority to lecture and annoy the entire American population until the day you die.

 

[Devildoc]

I woke up yesterday thinking, “how should I spend my Memorial Day?”

Thankfully, just as I said it, almost like a divine gift, “The Operator” appeared on Fox News to lecture America about the proper way to honor his friends (the ones he has made millions of dollars off of).

Because (kinda, maybe) shooting UBL (possibly) gives you moral authority to lecture and annoy the entire American population until the day you die.

"Don't let slip an opportunity; it may never come again" (Chinese proverb). The man is gonna lecture, and he's gonna find a way to make money on it.

Speaking of Memorial Day....everyone and their brother doing the Murph. I guess all the Private Joes out there who died over the past 200+ years don't get a fancy workout named for them, because their deaths are not as important as his was....

 

[Ooh-Rah]

everyone and their brother doing the Murph. I guess all the Private Joes out there who died over the past 200+ years don't get a fancy workout named for them, because their deaths are not as important as his was....

While it is currently en vogue to mock all things SEAL, I disagree with your statement regarding Murphy.

If guys want to honor a specific fallen Warrior by emulating a workout he did, how is that a bad thing and why does that have to diminish the deaths of those who fell before and after him?