Election Day and Results

[Gunz]

Yea they spoke up with 2.8 million less votes :-" Can we please stop pretending Trump is some non-flawed anti-establishment world savior. The White House is about to be the new Trump tower, its humiliating.

The Left has characterized all who voted for Trump as white racists. The Vanity Fair article posted by @SpongeBob*24 pretty much adheres to that same line. I think, in large part, it's a blanket mischaracterization based on the flawed logic that got Trump elected in the first place. Far from thinking Donald Trump is any kind of savior, a lot of people voted for him because they hate the Clintons, didn't want another Clinton in the White House, didn't want Bill leering around the corners at everything with boobs...didn't need the whole Clinton package. I'm one of them. My wife who has her masters and my three sons who are either college graduates or college students also voted for Trump.

There were other reasons. I tend to resist government intrusion in my life. I don't like gas cans with government-mandated safety spouts. I don't like the fact that bugs just laugh at pesticides now because all the good ingredients have been banned by the government. I don't like to see Presidents apologizing for America when our country has contributed so much good to the world...too much good to the world, in my opinion. There are many, many reasons that have nothing to do with racism that caused people to vote for Trump and to not vote for Clinton.

 

[TLDR20]

I agree with @CDG, @benroliver i may agree in general with your views, but you need to tighten up your arguments shot group.

 

[Il Duce]

The Left has characterized all who voted for Trump as white racists. The Vanity Fair article posted by @SpongeBob*24 pretty much adheres to that same line. I think, in large part, it's a blanket mischaracterization based on the flawed logic that got Trump elected in the first place. Far from thinking Donald Trump is any kind of savior, a lot of people voted for him because they hate the Clintons, didn't want another Clinton in the White House, didn't want Bill leering around the corners at everything with boobs...didn't need the whole Clinton package. I'm one of them. My wife who has her masters and my three sons who are either college graduates or college students also voted for Trump.

There were other reasons. I tend to resist government intrusion in my life. I don't like gas cans with government-mandated safety spouts. I don't like the fact that bugs just laugh at pesticides now because all the good ingredients have been banned by the government. I don't like to see Presidents apologizing for America when our country has contributed so much good to the world...too much good to the world, in my opinion. There are many, many reasons that have nothing to do with racism that caused people to vote for Trump and to not vote for Clinton.

I thought this opinion piece posted in Bloomberg (I saw it referenced in the Brookings Institution daily mailer - which is great on Saturdays) does a good job of laying down the problems with categorizing voting groups in that manner: Stereotypes Are Poisoning American Politics

When I read it I thought of the point @k4dge made in response to one of my demographic posts. I think it gets after the same point he was making well and really made the political scientist in me re-think some assumptions.

 

[Devildoc]

I thought this opinion piece posted in Bloomberg (I saw it referenced in the Brookings Institution daily mailer - which is great on Saturdays) does a good job of laying down the problems with categorizing voting groups in that manner: Stereotypes Are Poisoning American Politics

When I read it I thought of the point @k4dge made in response to one of my demographic posts. I think it gets after the same point he was making well and really made the political scientist in me re-think some assumptions.

I have always despised stereotypes, political ones are no exception. Back in the day the democrats in NC were of the Blue Dog variety, akin to Jim Webb. I acknowledge no all democrats are baby-killing, wealth-grabbing, communism-bent whacknuts the right wants people to believe.

 

[Gunz]

Well, I guess we're all guilty of it at one time or another; maybe it's just human nature to oversimplify and stereotype. And in most cases the extremists of each group set the template for everybody remotely in their race or social class or economic tier or religion etc.

 

[Centermass]

Official - PE Donald Trump secures the Electoral Vote

Donald Trump Secures Electoral College Win, With Few Surprises

Still not official until January 6th and the president of the senate makes the announcement.

 

[Centermass]

I had to google who Faith Spotted Eagle was......

 

[RackMaster]

I had to google who Faith Spotted Eagle was......

So did I and was disappointed. I was hoping it was random made up name.

 

[benroliver]

I agree with @CDG, @benroliver i may agree in general with your views, but you need to tighten up your arguments shot group.

It really doesn't matter what I say, we have both made similar points and I will still get down voted. I am okay with that, I don't spend time in echo chambers so I can obtain confirmation bias at will. The fact is I get accused of being snarky and emotional while others get away with the "crybaby liberal social justice warrior" assertions constantly. I can think of of a few posters who mention Hillary in nearly every thread whether she is relevant to the discussion or not.

I am not a "Liberal" anyway. I don't view the world through an ideological lens even if others categorize me as a Liberal. I am just as critical of Obama, Liberals, and the Democrats as anyone. The fact is it isn't Conservatives and Republicans being attacked here constantly. There is a clear conservative bias going on here with talking point generalizations flung around without consequence.

 

[benroliver]

Anyway, I will make this my last post in an effort not derail this any further.

 

[Ooh-Rah]

It really doesn't matter what I say, we have both made similar points and I will still get down voted. I am okay with that, I don't spend time in echo chambers so I can obtain confirmation bias at will. The fact is I get accused of being snarky and emotional while others get away with the "crybaby liberal social justice warrior" assertions constantly. I can think of of a few posters who mention Hillary in nearly every thread whether she is relevant to the discussion or not.

Dude...you should consider editing this whole paragraph and start over. While likely not your intent, my perception of this post is that you are not getting people to see things your way, and are pissed off about it.

I can think of of a few posters who mention Hillary in nearly every thread whether she is relevant to the discussion or not.

Such as whom? We're all big boys and girls here.

I am not a "Liberal" anyway. I don't view the world through an ideological lens even if others categorize me as a Liberal. I am just as critical of Obama, Liberals, and the Democrats as anyone. The fact is it isn't Conservatives and Republicans being attacked here constantly. There is a clear conservative bias going on here with talking point generalizations flung around without consequence.

I think I know what you are trying to say...scratch that. No I don't.

Anyway, I will make this my last post in an effort not derail this any further.

:wall:

Come on man, own what you mean. There are 37 pages of some really good back-of-forth...along with a few pages of shit. Either way, don't pull yourself out of the dialog like this.

 

[Ooh-Rah]

FREEKING Trump, he's already changed the locks!

 

[TLDR20]

It really doesn't matter what I say, we have both made similar points and I will still get down voted. I am okay with that, I don't spend time in echo chambers so I can obtain confirmation bias at will. The fact is I get accused of being snarky and emotional while others get away with the "crybaby liberal social justice warrior" assertions constantly. I can think of of a few posters who mention Hillary in nearly every thread whether she is relevant to the discussion or not.

I am not a "Liberal" anyway. I don't view the world through an ideological lens even if others categorize me as a Liberal. I am just as critical of Obama, Liberals, and the Democrats as anyone. The fact is it isn't Conservatives and Republicans being attacked here constantly. There is a clear conservative bias going on here with talking point generalizations flung around without consequence.

Not going to let this go unchallenged. You will see if you look around, I am probably either the most liberal, or second most liberal member of the board. If I don't think your argument is strong, bro, your argument is weak tits.

This isn't a challenge, other than to think about the argument from the other side, and form a better more coherent argument.

 

[Marauder06]

It really doesn't matter what I say, we have both made similar points and I will still get down voted. I am okay with that, I don't spend time in echo chambers so I can obtain confirmation bias at will. The fact is I get accused of being snarky and emotional while others get away with the "crybaby liberal social justice warrior" assertions constantly. I can think of of a few posters who mention Hillary in nearly every thread whether she is relevant to the discussion or not.

I am not a "Liberal" anyway. I don't view the world through an ideological lens even if others categorize me as a Liberal. I am just as critical of Obama, Liberals, and the Democrats as anyone. The fact is it isn't Conservatives and Republicans being attacked here constantly. There is a clear conservative bias going on here with talking point generalizations flung around without consequence.

If you don't like how we run things here, you're welcome to show yourself out.

There are PLENTY of left-leaning members of this site, who manage to express their points of view professionally and logically, without getting overly emotional or acting like crybabies when they get called out... especially when it's by OTHER LIBERAL-LEANING SITE MEMBERS.

Contrary to your accusation, conservative members of the site get called to account often. In fact, one of them just got banned. Your assertion that we are some kind of conservative, anti-liberal echo chamber rings hollow in light of the actual facts. I guess you didn't learn that yet, with your extensive posting history and whopping four months on the site.

Again, if you don't like the way ShadowSpear operates, no one is making you stay.

 

[TLDR20]

@benroliver I don't think you should leave, I think you should take this as a challenge to think critically about your viewpoint and make a cogent argument.

 

[Il Duce]

@benroliver I often feel the same way. I get frustrated when I see the 'liberal crybaby' posts and I often feel there is a consistent double-standard based on philosophy.

The thing is - I have a double-standard based on philosophy too - I think most of us do. This site leans white, male, and conservative - so do most of the places I've worked in the Army. Human beings have biases, so do groups of human beings in whatever way they congregate. I think it's a good thing to listen to people who don't see things the same as you. If not you're liable to fall victim to the same echo-chamber thinking you criticize.

I find having to hear and examine things that frustrate me is a good way to codify what I believe and why. I like this site because it's easy for me to check myself and be empathetic in a way most places aren't - because no matter how frustrated I get with something someone says I know they're affiliated with service to the nation that I'm committed to also.

If you decide you want to leave that's cool. There are definitely groups of people and conversations I've had to bounce from. But, if you stay understand you've got to talk to people where they are and live with conversations settling in a way you might think is unfair. I think that's pretty good practice for being in the service as well.

 

[Gunz]

We like our liberals here. They are badass liberals. And they help the rest of us neanderthals keep things in perspective.

 

[Etype]

Yea they spoke up with 2.8 million less votes :-" Can we please stop pretending Trump is some non-flawed anti-establishment world savior. The White House is about to be the new Trump tower, its humiliating.

Yes, because they are so different than Tea Party folks crying and screaming in town halls about their Muslim Kenyan Communist Hawaiian president. The charge of entitlement is rich coming from a voting base chanting "we want our country back", as though they owned it and it was stolen from them. Voting a populist demagogue in IS humiliating.

@benroliver ...I get frustrated when I see the 'liberal crybaby' posts...

So what constitutes a 'liberal crybaby' post? Maybe throw in the last page and a half of special attention as an enhancer...

 

[TLDR20]

So what constitutes a 'liberal crybaby' post? Maybe throw in the last page and a half of special attention as an enhancer...

Maybe stuff like this:

Humiliating for you, and the droves of entitled children crying on YouTube. Thank God for the electoral college, a system that has saved us from absolute democratic mob rule.

Do you need a safe space to discuss your grievances? How many people started fires or were arrested after President Obama's elections?

Luckily, the "rigged" system keeps any single person from having too much power. Don't kick and scream too much, just try again in 2020.

That is just from you in the last page.

 

[Etype]

Maybe stuff like this:





That is just from you in the last page.

I see what you tried to do; but that's gloating, not crying.