Trump & Mexico

[nobodythank you]

So, is anyone else surprised that a legit thread is now completely hijacked by "a recent high school graduate about to start college?"

That apparently cannot use grammar and punctuation correctly. Reading his posts takes me back to horrible witness statements that read as the person spoke. "he wuz runin thru the hause and i axed him to staph cuz he had mah moneyz"

 

[Grunt]

:troll:

 

[racing_kitty]

The hijack has gone on long enough. Bring it back around to the subject at hand. Statistics, editorials, and commentary about same are fine. First hand experience is fine. If this keeps up, I'm locking this thread up tighter than a virgin on prom night.

 

[Etype]

"he wuz runin thru the hause and i axed him to staph cuz he had mah moneyz"

Fa realz!

That made me lol.

 

[Salt USMC]

Politifact recently did a thorough fact-checking of some of the Donald's recent statements http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2015/jul/05/donald-trump-truth-o-meter/
The verdict? He's almost always full of shit.

His recent comments on immigration have been rated "Pants on Fire"

Also, before you shout "Liberal bias!" and "Soros!!", the Washington Post backs them up

 

[racing_kitty]

Politifact recently did a thorough fact-checking of some of the Donald's recent statements http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2015/jul/05/donald-trump-truth-o-meter/
The verdict? He's almost always full of shit.

His recent comments on immigration have been rated "Pants on Fire"

Also, before you shout "Liberal bias!" and "Soros!!", the Washington Post backs them up

Just because they're right about Trump doesn't absolve them of their connections and blatant political leaning. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut, and Trump is being intellectually lazy in making his argument.

 

[SpitfireV]

If he weren't he wouldn't be running...!

 

[Brill]

C'mon @Deathy McDeath , IF the WaPo would actually fact check Hillary and her blatant (and criminal) lies, they would pale in comparison. Point being, he's trying to become a politician and therefore will say whatever and promise the same in order to make less than half a mil a year...
If Jesse James were alive, he's be a politician or a lobbyist.

 

[Salt USMC]

C'mon @Deathy McDeath , IF the WaPo would actually fact check Hillary and her blatant (and criminal) lies, they would pale in comparison. .

You're totally right! But the Hillary email scandal is a few threads down

 

[JBS]

Politifact should be called Dem-O-Fact.

 

[Salt USMC]

Are they wrong?

 

[JBS]

I think any source that's biased is inherently going to over-represent certain aspects of an issue to support their views.

As an example, if it were a Right-Leaning website, posing as though neutral, we'd see a long list of everything Trump said that was true, and then sprinkle in a couple of "shame on you's" here and there to lend credibility to the site.

 

[TLDR20]

Every once in a while I like to pretend that lets say Mexico was the greatest country in the world, with a thriving economy, and more opportunity than I could ever dream of. I then pretend that I live in an overcrowded dangerous shithole of a country that offers me no promise. I then pretend I don't have the resources or necessary know how to legally immigrate. The point of this fiction is to realize how fucking quick my ass would be up and walking to Mexico. Legal or not I would be where the opportunity was. I would crawl there if that presented the best chance for the survival of myself and my family. If I got caught and deported, I would be on the next truck back.

The vast vast majority of immigrants(legal and illegal) fit much more into the situation described above than in any other type of situation. Comparing the difficulty of legally immigrating today vs the immigration of many of our previous generations is just not a fair comparison. Immigration in the 19tg and early 20th century consisted of getting on a boat, and processing when you arrived. It did not cost 15K and take years, you literally got off the boat and poof you were done. There is no one stop daily shop for immigrants today.

 

[racing_kitty]

Comparing the difficulty of legally immigrating today vs the immigration of many of our previous generations is just not a fair comparison. Immigration in the 19tg and early 20th century consisted of getting on a boat, and processing when you arrived. It did not cost 15K and take years, you literally got off the boat and poof you were done.

But we don't have the quota system in place today that there was in the period of time you refer to.

For those who may not know (not necessarily TLDR20, but those who simply haven't learned this or may have forgotten), there was a quota in place that was supposed to restrict the number of people that were allowed to immigrate to the US based on the population of the country that they were emigrating from. You weren't exactly guaranteed the welcome mat when you came through Angel Island/Ellis Island. There was the real chance that if your country of origin had exceeded its quota, you were sent back home.

It can be argued that the quota system was put in place by Americans of Northern/Western European heritage to discriminate against those of Southern/Eastern European heritage, but Luxembourg and Lichtenstein serve as a fly in the ointment for that argument, especially considering how easy it would have been to carve out exceptions for same at that moment in history. (Strangely, my leftist history professor wouldn't touch the quota for Asian countries, either).

 

[BloodStripe]

El Chapo puts a $100 million bounty on Trump. I think for that kind of money Trump would even turn himself over to them.

 

[AWP]

I shouldn't agree with a narcoterrorist.
I shouldn't agree with a narcoterrorist.
I shouldn't agree wi....

 

[Florida173]

Every once in a while I like to pretend that lets say Mexico was the greatest country in the world, with a thriving economy, and more opportunity than I could ever dream of. I then pretend that I live in an overcrowded dangerous shithole of a country that offers me no promise. I then pretend I don't have the resources or necessary know how to legally immigrate. The point of this fiction is to realize how fucking quick my ass would be up and walking to Mexico. Legal or not I would be where the opportunity was. I would crawl there if that presented the best chance for the survival of myself and my family. If I got caught and deported, I would be on the next truck back.

The vast vast majority of immigrants(legal and illegal) fit much more into the situation described above than in any other type of situation. Comparing the difficulty of legally immigrating today vs the immigration of many of our previous generations is just not a fair comparison. Immigration in the 19tg and early 20th century consisted of getting on a boat, and processing when you arrived. It did not cost 15K and take years, you literally got off the boat and poof you were done. There is no one stop daily shop for immigrants today.

So is your issue with the current immigration process, or is it that our borders aren't open enough to circumvent the immigration process?

 

[TLDR20]

So is your issue with the current immigration process, or is it that our borders aren't open enough to circumvent the immigration process?

I didn't comment on the current immigration process other than to say I think it takes too long, and is too expensive. As to an open border, I don't know where you got that.

I think that we should have both a better immigration policy, and a better controlled border. I am also saying that acting like everyone who attempts to better their lives through immigrating illegally into the U.S. Is some kind of criminal is fucking stupid. I think that illegal immigration is a problem, but I cannot fault those who do it.

Their governments failed them. Our government is failing us, but those immigrants are in it for survival.

 

[CDG]

I am also saying that acting like everyone who attempts to better their lives through immigrating illegally into the U.S. Is some kind of criminal is fucking stupid. I think that illegal immigration is a problem, but I cannot fault those who do it.

Their governments failed them. Our government is failing us, but those immigrants are in it for survival.

Intentions be damned, breaking the law does make them criminal, so holding that idea isn't "fucking stupid". I think acting like it's ok for people to stream across the border without regard to the law of the country they are entering, simply because the grass is greener, is fucking stupid. The majority may come from countries where making it to the US means surviving, but that's not our problem. It is not the United States's responsibility to save everyone else in the world who lives somewhere shitty. We are very fortunate to live where we do, others are not. That's life. It sucks, and it's harsh, but it is what it is. How would you respond to a US citizen who felt another country offered a better life, broke that country's immigration law to get in, and was caught and punished?

 

[TLDR20]

. How would you respond to a US citizen who felt another country offered a better life, broke that country's immigration law to get in, and was caught and punished?

I already said my piece on that. If I thought there was a place that offered me and my family a better life I would go. If it wasn't legal and the risk to reward ratio was right I would certainly try. If I could live better as an undocumented immigrant in one place than my home I would take illegal immigrant in a second. Survival is the most important thing, and it may sound harsh, but those people are doing what they need to to survive.

I think a person who is the byproduct of certain policy would more properly be termed refugees, they certainly are economically, and some are certainly fleeing from violence. But we call them illegal immigrants and the law is being broken, I think we should change the laws. To what, I don't know, I'm not an expert on border policy, or international relations.